First rwd car need tips
Discussion
Dizeee said:
I did a full day on a skid pan at Hendon in 2009, front wheel drive rear wheel drive, clockwise and anti clockwise, left turns, right turns, driving solo and chasing a bandit across it.
My understanding is that Hendon no longer use the skid pan - both for the reasons already mentioned and because of the universal fitment of skid control systems. Is that incorrect?By the way, I have had limit handling driving sessions with Don Palmer, Andy Walsh (CarLimits), other UK off road facilities including but not limited to Millbrook, Prodrive, MIRA, Porsche Experience Centre, and Mercedes Benz World (most of them multiple times), and several visits to Sweden for winter driving on snow and ice. Listed like that it sounds as though I should be quite competent at this stuff - or perhaps have a very high risk profile! And I drive powerful (sometimes very powerful) rear wheel drive cars. In spite of all my training and experience at limit handling, it is the Roadcraft training which keeps me relatively safe on the road. I do the limit handling stuff because it is such fun.
The skid pan was demolished circa 2014 but it may have been sooner. Hendon was then demolished soon after and is now around 5 billion flats.
Hendon was "re born" into a much smaller footprint, and training farmed out to division. Driving school clung on for some time, but eventually finally came to an end this late last year. They occupy a new building now which has its own politics around space but it's still working.
Skid pan training was removed from the advanced car course sometime before the pan was demolished. Limit handling is still practiced to a degree on anti-hijack / prot courses - at one of the places already listed above. As far as I am aware however, it is done only as a 1 week course ( as part of a whole host of non driving related courses lasting usually 12 - 24 months ) and not refreshed. From my experience of it, many drivers who partake have only recently undergone driver training as part of the initial course list for the role, so have no and go on to gain no proper on the road operational driving experience. The odd applicant may have a traffic or driving background, but many are quite inexperienced in terms of advanced driving. A friend of mine 6 years ago went from being a none driver, straight onto back to back driving courses then onto the anti hijack before going into the protection role. He never has and probably never will drive a police vehicle on blue lights on the public road. He certainly wont be nearing the limits of adhesion, convoying at moderate speeds on routes closed by the SEG.
Hendon was "re born" into a much smaller footprint, and training farmed out to division. Driving school clung on for some time, but eventually finally came to an end this late last year. They occupy a new building now which has its own politics around space but it's still working.
Skid pan training was removed from the advanced car course sometime before the pan was demolished. Limit handling is still practiced to a degree on anti-hijack / prot courses - at one of the places already listed above. As far as I am aware however, it is done only as a 1 week course ( as part of a whole host of non driving related courses lasting usually 12 - 24 months ) and not refreshed. From my experience of it, many drivers who partake have only recently undergone driver training as part of the initial course list for the role, so have no and go on to gain no proper on the road operational driving experience. The odd applicant may have a traffic or driving background, but many are quite inexperienced in terms of advanced driving. A friend of mine 6 years ago went from being a none driver, straight onto back to back driving courses then onto the anti hijack before going into the protection role. He never has and probably never will drive a police vehicle on blue lights on the public road. He certainly wont be nearing the limits of adhesion, convoying at moderate speeds on routes closed by the SEG.
Very late to the party here, apologies for this.
Just to quickly mention a superb track day I had last year at the Mercedes Benz World in Woking. Birthday present from the wife, who (unwisely?) decided to sit in the back while I gave it plenty of welly in a 2019 Merc C63S. With over 500 bhp, in the damp. Having just stepped out of a 130 bhp Ford Focus.
Spent a few mins getting familiar with the car, about 20 mins in total on the skid pad, and then some laps around the track. No need to worry about RWD really. As nearly everyone has said, as long as you're sensible, there is no need to be concerned.
Just to quickly mention a superb track day I had last year at the Mercedes Benz World in Woking. Birthday present from the wife, who (unwisely?) decided to sit in the back while I gave it plenty of welly in a 2019 Merc C63S. With over 500 bhp, in the damp. Having just stepped out of a 130 bhp Ford Focus.
Spent a few mins getting familiar with the car, about 20 mins in total on the skid pad, and then some laps around the track. No need to worry about RWD really. As nearly everyone has said, as long as you're sensible, there is no need to be concerned.
Zarco said:
Is it not likely that part of that is because people that want to learn limit handling like driving fast and taking risks?
Indeed. If an advanced driving course teaching such skills was mandated so that every driver had to complete this, then the stats would soon change, I strongly believe that taking an advanced driver training course has saved many people's livesMattylamb said:
Indeed. If an advanced driving course teaching such skills was mandated so that every driver had to complete this, then the stats would soon change, I strongly believe that taking an advanced driver training course has saved many people's lives
No. The Swedes did mandate limit handling training for all. It made things worse and they withdrew it.Learn to handle the car normally before giving it some. Don't bow to peer pressure by friends. Most rwd cars are not death traps, plenty of people drive them without nearly killing themselves within their ability. Make sure your tyres have decent tread, I know many youngsters, myself included would/do scrimp here.
I've had more near death experiences in fwd by driving above my ability and not knowing the car than I have in rwd.
That said, to echo others. Keep esp on and don't floor it mid turn or dump the clutch.
Try and find a supermarket car park late at night and when its wet for some low speed practice to start.
Give it a few months and you'll be much more confident to push things on a bit.
I've had more near death experiences in fwd by driving above my ability and not knowing the car than I have in rwd.
That said, to echo others. Keep esp on and don't floor it mid turn or dump the clutch.
Try and find a supermarket car park late at night and when its wet for some low speed practice to start.
Give it a few months and you'll be much more confident to push things on a bit.
Bloxxcreative said:
I've had more near death experiences in fwd by driving above my ability and not knowing the car than I have in rwd.
This is not a reflection on one drive system being safer than another...it simply means that you have been driving like an idiot more often in fwd vehicles. 
Having said that driving above your ability will always be potentially more serious in a rwd vehicle.
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