Six Nations 2018
Discussion
towser said:
Kermit power said:
Well if that's all you can read into my post, then all I can say is your chip, your shoulder, and there's clearly nothing I can do to change that.
No chip here, no need to stoop to insults.towser said:
However, to me it seems that coaching, tactics, possibly (perish the thought) better, fitter players in key areas of the pitch made a big difference to the result on Saturday. Maybe the sum total of those parts (the key constituents of a team performance) are, from a Scottish perspective, better than England's right now?
As I said, Scotland did play exceptionally well, but do you honestly think they would've beaten the All Blacks or Ireland so solidly with that game plan? Or do you think they would've reacted far, far faster than England did, changed their game plan and pressed on in a different direction?England have a real weakness at the moment, in so far as they can't for the life of them find a Plan B if Plan A isn't working. That is bad play. It still required Scotland to play well to win, do why are you taking it so personally when people point out that the result was a combination of the two? Why does that make it "all about England", as opposed to an appraisal of the performance of both sides in the match?
Kermit power said:
As I said, Scotland did play exceptionally well, but do you honestly think they would've beaten the All Blacks or Ireland so solidly with that game plan? Or do you think they would've reacted far, far faster than England did, changed their game plan and pressed on in a different direction?
England have a real weakness at the moment, in so far as they can't for the life of them find a Plan B if Plan A isn't working. That is bad play. It still required Scotland to play well to win, do why are you taking it so personally when people point out that the result was a combination of the two? Why does that make it "all about England", as opposed to an appraisal of the performance of both sides in the match?
Maybe, just maybe.....England were not allowed to play well through better preparation and players on the day and it wasn't just down to a bad day at the office for EJ and his guys?England have a real weakness at the moment, in so far as they can't for the life of them find a Plan B if Plan A isn't working. That is bad play. It still required Scotland to play well to win, do why are you taking it so personally when people point out that the result was a combination of the two? Why does that make it "all about England", as opposed to an appraisal of the performance of both sides in the match?
Same as Wales did to Scotland on the 1st weekend of the championship, blew them away with passion and fine rugby....and I doff my cap to them for that.
BTW - I don't take a game of rugby played by a bunch of people I don't know from Adam personally.
Edited by towser on Wednesday 28th February 14:18
towser said:
Kermit power said:
As I said, Scotland did play exceptionally well, but do you honestly think they would've beaten the All Blacks or Ireland so solidly with that game plan? Or do you think they would've reacted far, far faster than England did, changed their game plan and pressed on in a different direction?
England have a real weakness at the moment, in so far as they can't for the life of them find a Plan B if Plan A isn't working. That is bad play. It still required Scotland to play well to win, do why are you taking it so personally when people point out that the result was a combination of the two? Why does that make it "all about England", as opposed to an appraisal of the performance of both sides in the match?
Maybe, just maybe.....England were not allowed to play well through better preparation and players on the day and it wasn't just down to a bad day at the office for EJ and his guys?England have a real weakness at the moment, in so far as they can't for the life of them find a Plan B if Plan A isn't working. That is bad play. It still required Scotland to play well to win, do why are you taking it so personally when people point out that the result was a combination of the two? Why does that make it "all about England", as opposed to an appraisal of the performance of both sides in the match?
If England had tried something different, and Scotland had been able to adapt and contain that then again, I'd agree, but again they didn't. Time after time, they had forwards standing off the ruck, gormlessly watching on as Barclay in particular waltzed in and took their ball off them, and they just couldn't bring themselves to change their approach.
Scotland played exceptionally well, and thoroughly deserved their victory, but I still don't understand why firstly you seem to think I think it was all down to England playing badly when I've stated the opposite, and secondly why you seem completely incapable of grasping the concept that just maybe the result arose from how both teams played, not one or the other.
Kermit power said:
If it was a one off, then yes, I'd agree, but worryingly it's not. Italy last year was the other real stand out occasion where England have proven totally unable to adapt to an unexpected strategy, but there have been other occasions where it has also raised its head.
If England had tried something different, and Scotland had been able to adapt and contain that then again, I'd agree, but again they didn't. Time after time, they had forwards standing off the ruck, gormlessly watching on as Barclay in particular waltzed in and took their ball off them, and they just couldn't bring themselves to change their approach.
Scotland played exceptionally well, and thoroughly deserved their victory, but I still don't understand why firstly you seem to think I think it was all down to England playing badly when I've stated the opposite, and secondly why you seem completely incapable of grasping the concept that just maybe the result arose from how both teams played, not one or the other.
I'm not saying it was purely down to England playing badly....I'm saying that the way Scotland were setup to play and the performance of their players on the day meant that whatever game plan England had come into the match with was nullified. There were signs of a reaction from England in the 2nd half but they didn't seem to be able to maintain any momentum.If England had tried something different, and Scotland had been able to adapt and contain that then again, I'd agree, but again they didn't. Time after time, they had forwards standing off the ruck, gormlessly watching on as Barclay in particular waltzed in and took their ball off them, and they just couldn't bring themselves to change their approach.
Scotland played exceptionally well, and thoroughly deserved their victory, but I still don't understand why firstly you seem to think I think it was all down to England playing badly when I've stated the opposite, and secondly why you seem completely incapable of grasping the concept that just maybe the result arose from how both teams played, not one or the other.
Anyway, why do you resort to putting people down? "you seem completely incapable of grasping"....just trying to put my point across not have a slanging match.
I'm going back into lurking mode....
desolate said:
Personally I think it's down to a lack of leadership and thought in the forwards.
Hartley is just not up to that and neither is Robshaw.
Plus a certain arrogance - they believe that if the "keep executing their plans" they will win.
I still remember the look on his face when the Italians were executing Ruckgate and the referee wouldn't tell him what to do Hartley is just not up to that and neither is Robshaw.
Plus a certain arrogance - they believe that if the "keep executing their plans" they will win.
Bonefish Blues said:
I still remember the look on his face when the Italians were executing Ruckgate and the referee wouldn't tell him what to do
For a bloke with so many caps I just don't think he is very good at all.One of the issues with the modern game is that when a pack is getting mullered they can't mix it up and get violent to see if that changes things.
I think we should still allow a certain amount of man to man combat.
towser said:
Anyway, why do you resort to putting people down? "you seem completely incapable of grasping"....just trying to put my point across not have a slanging match.
Commenting that you seemed completely incapable of grasping the concept of the result being a combination of Scotland playing well but also England playing badly wasn't a put down. It was simple frustration at the fact that no matter what I say, you've kept coming back to your odd belief that I'm trying to make everything "all about England" for some reason.If you perceived that as a put down, then you have my apologies, but also a warning that if you really did perceive it as such, you may find yourself rather thin-skinned for commenting in some of the other P&P sub-fora!
Kermit power said:
Commenting that you seemed completely incapable of grasping the concept of the result being a combination of Scotland playing well but also England playing badly wasn't a put down. It was simple frustration at the fact that no matter what I say, you've kept coming back to your odd belief that I'm trying to make everything "all about England" for some reason.
If you perceived that as a put down, then you have my apologies, but also a warning that if you really did perceive it as such, you may find yourself rather thin-skinned for commenting in some of the other P&P sub-fora!
Whatever....If you perceived that as a put down, then you have my apologies, but also a warning that if you really did perceive it as such, you may find yourself rather thin-skinned for commenting in some of the other P&P sub-fora!
towser said:
Kermit power said:
Commenting that you seemed completely incapable of grasping the concept of the result being a combination of Scotland playing well but also England playing badly wasn't a put down. It was simple frustration at the fact that no matter what I say, you've kept coming back to your odd belief that I'm trying to make everything "all about England" for some reason.
If you perceived that as a put down, then you have my apologies, but also a warning that if you really did perceive it as such, you may find yourself rather thin-skinned for commenting in some of the other P&P sub-fora!
Whatever....If you perceived that as a put down, then you have my apologies, but also a warning that if you really did perceive it as such, you may find yourself rather thin-skinned for commenting in some of the other P&P sub-fora!
Bonefish Blues said:
desolate said:
Personally I think it's down to a lack of leadership and thought in the forwards.
Hartley is just not up to that and neither is Robshaw.
Plus a certain arrogance - they believe that if the "keep executing their plans" they will win.
I still remember the look on his face when the Italians were executing Ruckgate and the referee wouldn't tell him what to do Hartley is just not up to that and neither is Robshaw.
Plus a certain arrogance - they believe that if the "keep executing their plans" they will win.
Kermit power said:
Bonefish Blues said:
desolate said:
Personally I think it's down to a lack of leadership and thought in the forwards.
Hartley is just not up to that and neither is Robshaw.
Plus a certain arrogance - they believe that if the "keep executing their plans" they will win.
I still remember the look on his face when the Italians were executing Ruckgate and the referee wouldn't tell him what to do Hartley is just not up to that and neither is Robshaw.
Plus a certain arrogance - they believe that if the "keep executing their plans" they will win.
DocJock said:
I am reading that Eddie Jones was verbally and physically abused by Scots 'fans' on his way home at the weekend.
What an embarrassing bunch of bigoted idiots. I'd like to apologise on behalf of proper Scots rugby fans, we're not all uncivilised bravehearts...
Absolutely, bloody morons.....EJ was the perfect gent in the post match interview and very magnanimous in defeat....now saying he'll not use public transport in the UK again because of this. What an embarrassing bunch of bigoted idiots. I'd like to apologise on behalf of proper Scots rugby fans, we're not all uncivilised bravehearts...
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/43235314
Disgusting. But not particularly surprising
Hastings and Berghan were idiots too.
I'm sure Jones will want to grind Scotland into the dust next time round.
Disgusting. But not particularly surprising
Hastings and Berghan were idiots too.
I'm sure Jones will want to grind Scotland into the dust next time round.
towser said:
DocJock said:
I am reading that Eddie Jones was verbally and physically abused by Scots 'fans' on his way home at the weekend.
What an embarrassing bunch of bigoted idiots. I'd like to apologise on behalf of proper Scots rugby fans, we're not all uncivilised bravehearts...
Absolutely, bloody morons.....EJ was the perfect gent in the post match interview and very magnanimous in defeat....now saying he'll not use public transport in the UK again because of this. What an embarrassing bunch of bigoted idiots. I'd like to apologise on behalf of proper Scots rugby fans, we're not all uncivilised bravehearts...
towser said:
Same as Wales did to Scotland on the 1st weekend of the championship, blew them away with passion and fine rugby....and I doff my cap to them for that.
That's the point. Scotland were abysmal that day. Russell couldn't hit a barn door with a pass, and they were sixes and sevens throughout. Wales, as proved on Sat, weren't that good. They were just made to look like world beaters by an embarrassing Scottish performance.Edited by towser on Wednesday 28th February 14:18
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