Discussion
Hi,
Any auto parts store that carries Gates rubber products (belts and hoses) can order a Kriket for you. This could take up to a couple weeks dependig upon when they submit their next order to Gates.
You can also order one online and avoid the wait at:
HMC INT'L. DIV., INC.
5996 South Crocker Street
Littleton, Colorado 80120-2054
(303) 794-2510 Phone
(800) 848-4912 Ext. 4452 Toll Free Phone within USA
(303) 794-3703 Fax
<info@h...> E-mail
<www.hmc-international.com/krikit.htm> Website
The KR1 gives good, consistent results, but it translates the Lotus 'Burroughs'spec (90-95 'units') to about 50-55 on the KR1 scale.
We have repeatedly done comparison measurements using both a Krikit KR1 and a Burroughs gauge (I have both) and each tool corroborates the other. Happy Motoring! ...Jim'85TE
Any auto parts store that carries Gates rubber products (belts and hoses) can order a Kriket for you. This could take up to a couple weeks dependig upon when they submit their next order to Gates.
You can also order one online and avoid the wait at:
HMC INT'L. DIV., INC.
5996 South Crocker Street
Littleton, Colorado 80120-2054
(303) 794-2510 Phone
(800) 848-4912 Ext. 4452 Toll Free Phone within USA
(303) 794-3703 Fax
<info@h...> E-mail
<www.hmc-international.com/krikit.htm> Website
The KR1 gives good, consistent results, but it translates the Lotus 'Burroughs'spec (90-95 'units') to about 50-55 on the KR1 scale.
We have repeatedly done comparison measurements using both a Krikit KR1 and a Burroughs gauge (I have both) and each tool corroborates the other. Happy Motoring! ...Jim'85TE
lotusguy said:
Hi,
You can also order one online and avoid the wait at:
HMC INT'L. DIV., INC.
5996 South Crocker Street
Littleton, Colorado 80120-2054
(303) 794-2510 Phone
(800) 848-4912 Ext. 4452 Toll Free Phone within USA
(303) 794-3703 Fax
<info@h...> E-mail
<www.hmc-international.com/krikit.htm> Website
Jim,
I don't think you can order direct online or at least I couldn't find any way to when I was looking. Sent them a couple of emails with no response.
NAPA stocks them in a lot of their stores which is where I got mine for around $14. They can also be found on ebay but you'll probably pay too much.
Jim K.
lotusguy said:
The KR1 gives good, consistent results, but it translates the Lotus 'Burroughs'spec (90-95 'units') to about 50-55 on the KR1 scale.
Sounds familiar
Close, but... 50-55 Krikit KR1 = 90 - 100 Burroughs.
52 Krikit = 95 Burroughs.
Lotus "Burroughs" specs for timing belt tension (they now specify the Clavis meter) changed through the years. Intially it was just 90 Burroughs. Then 95-105, followed by 90-95 and finally just 95.
90 proved to be a little on the loose side and probably represents the bottom side of my "go-ahead-and-drive-it" comfort zone. 92-95 is a good range to look for when checking a belt that's been in service. When installling a new belt, I like to set it little tight to allow for some initial belt stretch and usually target 100 Burroughs/ 55 Krikit. 105 Burroughs is a little too tight and the belt may whine a bit. Don't go over 105 Burroughs. If the belt ever whines, it's too tight.
If I check a belt and find it to be loose, and I'm trying to decide whether the car is driveable or not, I draw the line at Kriket 45 (Burroughs 82). Drive it home if need be, but take it easy... keep the rpm down. Park the car and make plans to tension the belt before you drive it again. Just my judgement. YMMV.
The Krikit KR1 pounds scale runs about 55% of the Burroughs scale. I don't know how linear that factor is, but in direct comparison tests I've made, it seems to hold true across the range of tensions that are appropriate for a Lotus 9XX engine.
Bur = Krikit ranges (my judgement, not Lotus)
82 = 45 Park it... proceed at your own risk.
90 = 50 Normal minimum
95 = 52 My routine target tension
100 = 55 New belts (just me, YMMV)
105 = 58 Too tight, IMHO.
Always check/ set the timing belt tension with the engine cold and before it has been run for the first time that day. Tension readings on a hot engine will be higher:
Burroughs: 90–95 cold goes to about 120–125 hot.
Krikit KR1: 50-52 cold goes to about 66–69 hot.
All Burroughs specs are for readings taken at TDC. Clavis readings are taken at 30 BTDC. Don't mix and match elements of the two specs. If you set the belt tension to Burroughs 95 at Clavis 30 TDC, the belt will be too loose. Pick one spec and stick with it.
A little off topic, but...
In scanning the archives, I ran across a thread posted a couple months ago about checking 9XX timing belt tension using the twist test. The procedure given there was incorrect ! If the belt is so tight you can only twist it 45 degrees one way and 45 degrees the other way for a total of 90 degrees, then the belt will be seriously too tight. Something like 150-155 Burroughs / 82-85 Krikit.
The correct twist test requires turning the belt 90 degrees. Grasp the belt midway between the intake cam pulley and the auxiliary pulley. If the belt's normal position is considered to be horizontal fore and aft, then twist the belt either way 90 degrees to vertical. From flat to knife edge.
As you twist it, the belt will progressively resist more and more until it seems to hit a wall. Don't make a contest of strength out of it. Just feel for the point at which the belt seems to go hard... it doesn't want to move any more.
A properly tensioned belt will stop just a little short of 90 degrees / vertical. A full 90 degrees is acceptable. "ANYTHING" beyond 90 degrees is too loose.
The twist test is a "learned feel" test. There's little risk in an inexperienced user spot-checking belt tension with the twist test. But you really shouldn't use it as your only "gauge" for setting belt tension until you have done enough belts with a proper gauge to know what correct tension feels like.
Regards,
Tim Engel
Lotus Owners Oftha North
Minnesota, USA
[quote] I don't think you can order direct online or at least I couldn't find any way to when I was looking. Sent them a couple of emails with no response.
[/quote]
I just got off the phone with Tito at HMC International (18 Aug 04).
Updated:
HMC International Division, Inc.
5996 South Crocker Street
Littleton, Colorado 80120-2054
<"www.hmc-international.com/krikit.htm> Website
Forget e-mail enquiries.
(303) 794-3703 Fax (They prefer FAX orders)
(303) 794-2510 Phone (Direct to HMC)
(800) 848-4912 Ext. 4452 (Toll Free within the USA)
The 800 number goes to an answering service. The automated system will ask for an "account" number… key in the phone extension number, 4452. Of if you get lucky and a person answers, you can ask for either the extension or HMC International Division, Inc.
HMC International is the manufacturer of the Krikit gauge line. They sell to Gates Rubber, Goodyear, NAPA, Dayco and others in the USA. They also sell to European accounts like Optibelt in Germany.
HMC manufactures versions of the KR-1 with either Kilograms & Pounds (91107) or Newtons & Pounds. But either will work for our Lotus 9XX purposes since all the empirical cross reference data correlates Burroughs readings to Krikit readings in pounds (ie, 90-95 Burroughs – 50-52 Krikit KR1)
HMC normally sells wholesale to businesses, but will accept single orders from private individuals. However, their system is not set up for that and they do not have a streamlined, e-business website. They don't know what PayPal or BidPay are.
If you wish to purchase direct from HMC, use the website for info only and "forget about" e-mail. They prefer a FAX order. But a phone call will work as long as you understand the person on the other end of the line is not trained at direct consumer sales and may not know what to do. If you need to speak to someone more "up to speed", ask for Tito (they guy I talked to who had all the answers).
They will require payment in advance in US funds. Tito indicated they used to sell on credit, "… but those Porsche people weren't paying their $20 bills, so now we require payment in advance of shipping". Well, you know those Porsche people… ;-) On the other hand he perked right up when I mentioned Lotus… he really likes Lotus. Maybe we have an "in" with Tito. ;-)
US $17.00 Krikit KR-1, Model Number 91107
US $16.00 Shipping to most European Countries
US $33.00 Total. Buyer responsible for any Customs Duties.
US $7.00 Shipping in the USA.
Buyers in the USA can do better by purchasing one over the retail counter at NAPA for about US$14.00. That's cheaper and no shipping cost.
However, someone on a Yahoo list (turboesprit ?) recently purchased a KR-1 from an auto parts store in England. He had to order it and wait, and the price was something like GBP £48-49… close to US$90.
=8<0 Yipes !!
If you live outside the USA and find Krikit prices to be a little high, it may be worth the small hassle of dealing directly with HMC. They prefer FAX orders, but you can call them on the phone. The delivery address cannot be a P.O Box, it must be a home or business street address. They require a phone number and contact name in case they have any questions. Payment in US funds. An International Money Order is preferred.
I called the 800 phone number. It seemed to go to some answering service rather than HMC direct. If the system asks for an account number, they want the phone extension for HMC… 4452. If you get a live person, you can use 4452 or ask for HMC Div, Inc.
FYI...
Tito pointed out that all Krikits are designed to an "internationally accepted standard for determining belt tension". Deflect the belt 1/64" per inch of run between the pulley tangent points, measure the force in pounds to accomplish that deflection, and multiply by 16. The result is the belt tension in pounds.
All Krikits work that way, but Burroughs used their own method. That's why the Krikit and Burroughs readings are so different. Both are consistent, they just give different number values for the same belt tension.
Finally... another FYI...
Burroughs sold their gauge line to SPX Kent-Moore long ago. The Burroughs BT-33-86A we all know and love has not been in series production for years, but if you call the USA office, they will hand build one for you for $250 plus shipping. They can also make the later cantilevered version. Expect to wait 3 to 4 weeks.
Regards,
Tim Engel
Lotus Owners Oftha North
Minnesota, USA
[/quote]
I just got off the phone with Tito at HMC International (18 Aug 04).
Updated:
HMC International Division, Inc.
5996 South Crocker Street
Littleton, Colorado 80120-2054
<"www.hmc-international.com/krikit.htm> Website
Forget e-mail enquiries.
(303) 794-3703 Fax (They prefer FAX orders)
(303) 794-2510 Phone (Direct to HMC)
(800) 848-4912 Ext. 4452 (Toll Free within the USA)
The 800 number goes to an answering service. The automated system will ask for an "account" number… key in the phone extension number, 4452. Of if you get lucky and a person answers, you can ask for either the extension or HMC International Division, Inc.
HMC International is the manufacturer of the Krikit gauge line. They sell to Gates Rubber, Goodyear, NAPA, Dayco and others in the USA. They also sell to European accounts like Optibelt in Germany.
HMC manufactures versions of the KR-1 with either Kilograms & Pounds (91107) or Newtons & Pounds. But either will work for our Lotus 9XX purposes since all the empirical cross reference data correlates Burroughs readings to Krikit readings in pounds (ie, 90-95 Burroughs – 50-52 Krikit KR1)
HMC normally sells wholesale to businesses, but will accept single orders from private individuals. However, their system is not set up for that and they do not have a streamlined, e-business website. They don't know what PayPal or BidPay are.
If you wish to purchase direct from HMC, use the website for info only and "forget about" e-mail. They prefer a FAX order. But a phone call will work as long as you understand the person on the other end of the line is not trained at direct consumer sales and may not know what to do. If you need to speak to someone more "up to speed", ask for Tito (they guy I talked to who had all the answers).
They will require payment in advance in US funds. Tito indicated they used to sell on credit, "… but those Porsche people weren't paying their $20 bills, so now we require payment in advance of shipping". Well, you know those Porsche people… ;-) On the other hand he perked right up when I mentioned Lotus… he really likes Lotus. Maybe we have an "in" with Tito. ;-)
US $17.00 Krikit KR-1, Model Number 91107
US $16.00 Shipping to most European Countries
US $33.00 Total. Buyer responsible for any Customs Duties.
US $7.00 Shipping in the USA.
Buyers in the USA can do better by purchasing one over the retail counter at NAPA for about US$14.00. That's cheaper and no shipping cost.
However, someone on a Yahoo list (turboesprit ?) recently purchased a KR-1 from an auto parts store in England. He had to order it and wait, and the price was something like GBP £48-49… close to US$90.
=8<0 Yipes !!
If you live outside the USA and find Krikit prices to be a little high, it may be worth the small hassle of dealing directly with HMC. They prefer FAX orders, but you can call them on the phone. The delivery address cannot be a P.O Box, it must be a home or business street address. They require a phone number and contact name in case they have any questions. Payment in US funds. An International Money Order is preferred.
I called the 800 phone number. It seemed to go to some answering service rather than HMC direct. If the system asks for an account number, they want the phone extension for HMC… 4452. If you get a live person, you can use 4452 or ask for HMC Div, Inc.
FYI...
Tito pointed out that all Krikits are designed to an "internationally accepted standard for determining belt tension". Deflect the belt 1/64" per inch of run between the pulley tangent points, measure the force in pounds to accomplish that deflection, and multiply by 16. The result is the belt tension in pounds.
All Krikits work that way, but Burroughs used their own method. That's why the Krikit and Burroughs readings are so different. Both are consistent, they just give different number values for the same belt tension.
Finally... another FYI...
Burroughs sold their gauge line to SPX Kent-Moore long ago. The Burroughs BT-33-86A we all know and love has not been in series production for years, but if you call the USA office, they will hand build one for you for $250 plus shipping. They can also make the later cantilevered version. Expect to wait 3 to 4 weeks.
Regards,
Tim Engel
Lotus Owners Oftha North
Minnesota, USA
jk1 said:
Hi,
You can also order one online and avoid the wait at:
Jim,
I don't think you can order direct online or at least I couldn't find any way to when I was looking. Sent them a couple of emails with no response.
NAPA stocks them in a lot of their stores which is where I got mine for around $14. They can also be found on ebay but you'll probably pay too much.
Jim K.
Jim,
You could be right. I ordered mine via Fax and had no prob. whatsoever... Jim
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