S2000 Vs Elise Mk2
Discussion
Right.. 12k to spend.. what do i get.
I've enjoyed my 944 but want something a little more raw..
Is the S2000 a one-trick pony? Is the 9000rpm game just an extended range of a good engine (ideal), or do you need that extra 3000rpm to get the thing to shift.. i've heard that they have dissapointingly low levels of torque so you have to keep it on-cam to get it to go..
Similarly, the elise is no doubt quick off the line.. but does it run out of guts above 5000rpm and 80mph.. thinking of track days here.. it will be quick in corners but possibly struggle with longer straights and hills?!??!
Discuss
Simple advice - go to a dealer and test drive one.
Others can talk about how it is to THEM, but that doesn't mean it'll be the same to YOU.
A number of Nissan 350Zs (import) on autotrader online from £12.5-£14K
Plenty of Boxsters as well for same spread.
Lovely import non-UK white with red interior S2000 - £13K
Others can talk about how it is to THEM, but that doesn't mean it'll be the same to YOU.
A number of Nissan 350Zs (import) on autotrader online from £12.5-£14K
Plenty of Boxsters as well for same spread.
Lovely import non-UK white with red interior S2000 - £13K
Edited by pjskel on Friday 5th January 09:13
The S2000 is far from a one trick pony and the torque levels are plenty for normal driving. The push you get at 6k is great with another extra shove just below 8k. It'll happily embarrass plenty of car that cost twice as much,
Great handling - I've never had a problem with the so called 'on the limit' twitchyness. Not to say it's an easy drive but once you get to know the car and respect it you can drive it hard. Quick roof, extremely reliable, well made, looks tops (obviously subjective) and with a boot that is surprisingly big for this class of car.
Overall the quality of ownership for me has been excellent.
Can't comment on the S2 Elise.
Great handling - I've never had a problem with the so called 'on the limit' twitchyness. Not to say it's an easy drive but once you get to know the car and respect it you can drive it hard. Quick roof, extremely reliable, well made, looks tops (obviously subjective) and with a boot that is surprisingly big for this class of car.
Overall the quality of ownership for me has been excellent.
Can't comment on the S2 Elise.
so8 said:
Try posting on the UK part of S2Ki.com ... one of the guys who posts - 'Kelk' who is sometimes on here I believe has an Elise now after owning an S2000 for a few years. He and others will give you some ideas of the differences.
As does Bada Bing. Just don't ask him for a photograph
I too have owned both, the Honda is far from a one trick pony, I think its in a class of its own.
The Elise is something everyone should own once, as said though they are very different cars. The one thing the Lotus does way better than the S2k is corner/handle better. Some guys on S2ki think the Honda handles very well and it does to an extent but if Mr Average drove both back to back on road or track you would be able to exploit the limits of the Lotus much easier. The S2000 though takes some learning, which also adds to its appeal.
If its a track car your after go Lotus.
Russ.
The Elise is something everyone should own once, as said though they are very different cars. The one thing the Lotus does way better than the S2k is corner/handle better. Some guys on S2ki think the Honda handles very well and it does to an extent but if Mr Average drove both back to back on road or track you would be able to exploit the limits of the Lotus much easier. The S2000 though takes some learning, which also adds to its appeal.
If its a track car your after go Lotus.
Russ.
Edited by RusS 2k on Sunday 7th January 08:40
Both are very small cars and have positives to them.
The Honda S2K (AP1/AP2) is a delightful machine to own and you'll have lots of fun owning one. Very reliable and is a decent track weapon and it can hold it's own against other in the same category.
As for the Lotus, that's more track focused without any creature comforts.
To get the best of both worlds I would recommend a K20 conversion. I have come across numerous people who have done it. A new lightweight engine that revs up to 8k with the ability to still tune for more power if 200bhp in the little lotus isn't enough.
Add either a Hondadata/K Pro and the limit will be lifted and the vtec changeover is now lower down the rev. Still if you want even more power you can get forced induction with a Jackson Racing SuperCharger. Although fitting one to a k20 in an elise maybe somewhat difficult, I'm not even sure if that would fit. You'd have to look into that.
Why not have a look around on the LOT (Lotus on Track forum).
The Honda S2K (AP1/AP2) is a delightful machine to own and you'll have lots of fun owning one. Very reliable and is a decent track weapon and it can hold it's own against other in the same category.
As for the Lotus, that's more track focused without any creature comforts.
To get the best of both worlds I would recommend a K20 conversion. I have come across numerous people who have done it. A new lightweight engine that revs up to 8k with the ability to still tune for more power if 200bhp in the little lotus isn't enough.
Add either a Hondadata/K Pro and the limit will be lifted and the vtec changeover is now lower down the rev. Still if you want even more power you can get forced induction with a Jackson Racing SuperCharger. Although fitting one to a k20 in an elise maybe somewhat difficult, I'm not even sure if that would fit. You'd have to look into that.
Why not have a look around on the LOT (Lotus on Track forum).
Used to own an Elise, albeit an S1, and traded it in a year ago for an S2000. Here's my thoughts:
The Elise was a great car for a country road blast. The steering is superb and it has plenty of power for the road but on track it felt gutless. And as an everyday car it would be terrible as it leaked whenever it rained.
The S2000 is a much better proposition for an everyday car. Far more practical (I can get golf clubs in the boot!), comes with all the creature comforts you could want and if you get a GT version you'll have a nice hardtop that makes it feel like a snug coupe.
It's engine and gearbox are a superb combination and over 6000 revs it'll trounce the Elise - it's around 4 seconds quicker to 100. The handling is almost as good and on track it loses little to an Elise except you need to brake earlier.
Try them both. I prefer living with the S2000, but I'd definately have an Elise again.
The Elise was a great car for a country road blast. The steering is superb and it has plenty of power for the road but on track it felt gutless. And as an everyday car it would be terrible as it leaked whenever it rained.
The S2000 is a much better proposition for an everyday car. Far more practical (I can get golf clubs in the boot!), comes with all the creature comforts you could want and if you get a GT version you'll have a nice hardtop that makes it feel like a snug coupe.
It's engine and gearbox are a superb combination and over 6000 revs it'll trounce the Elise - it's around 4 seconds quicker to 100. The handling is almost as good and on track it loses little to an Elise except you need to brake earlier.
Try them both. I prefer living with the S2000, but I'd definately have an Elise again.
Hi me01mp,
We're lucky enough to have an S2000 and an S2 Exige (picked it up on Saturday so still getting used to it). I don't know about the S2 Elise, but the Exige/S2k are totally different apart from the fact that they're rear wheel drive.
The Exige has the same engine as the 111R Elise (1.8 from the Toyota Celica 190), and performance wise it feels significantly quicker than the S2000 at all engine speeds and in all gears - not sure how much quicker it is in reality, but surely your perception of speed is more important than how fast you're really going
. I'd imagine that the lower powered Elise models will still feel quick due to the light weight of the car.
The Exige is damn scary to drive in the wet, although the S2k isn't exactly a laugh a minute
The S2k engine is fantastic and has more than enough poke low down if you want to cruise about. If you want to pick up the pace a bit, then you need to work it hard and use the gears - this is the whole point of the car and it's serious fun. The engine noise is enough to make you spend all of your time as close as possible to the red line - you'll never get bored.
Not sure if it's important to you but comfort wise, the S2k wins hands down. Much easier to get in and out, more room, more space to put things, bigger boot etc etc. That said, the Exige is pretty comfortable once you're in - think the Elise must be pretty much the same (plus you can get the roof down)
As everyone else has said, drive both and you'll soon make your mind up. If I had to drive a lot of miles then I'd go for the s2k, but for shorter distances the Lotus will be my weapon of choice
We're lucky enough to have an S2000 and an S2 Exige (picked it up on Saturday so still getting used to it). I don't know about the S2 Elise, but the Exige/S2k are totally different apart from the fact that they're rear wheel drive.
The Exige has the same engine as the 111R Elise (1.8 from the Toyota Celica 190), and performance wise it feels significantly quicker than the S2000 at all engine speeds and in all gears - not sure how much quicker it is in reality, but surely your perception of speed is more important than how fast you're really going
. I'd imagine that the lower powered Elise models will still feel quick due to the light weight of the car. The Exige is damn scary to drive in the wet, although the S2k isn't exactly a laugh a minute
The S2k engine is fantastic and has more than enough poke low down if you want to cruise about. If you want to pick up the pace a bit, then you need to work it hard and use the gears - this is the whole point of the car and it's serious fun. The engine noise is enough to make you spend all of your time as close as possible to the red line - you'll never get bored.
Not sure if it's important to you but comfort wise, the S2k wins hands down. Much easier to get in and out, more room, more space to put things, bigger boot etc etc. That said, the Exige is pretty comfortable once you're in - think the Elise must be pretty much the same (plus you can get the roof down)
As everyone else has said, drive both and you'll soon make your mind up. If I had to drive a lot of miles then I'd go for the s2k, but for shorter distances the Lotus will be my weapon of choice
so8 said:
Try posting on the UK part of S2Ki.com ... one of the guys who posts - 'Kelk' who is sometimes on here I believe has an Elise now after owning an S2000 for a few years. He and others will give you some ideas of the differences.
'Tis true.
I owned an MY00 for 3 years and in summer I bought an MY06 Elise 111R and the differences are quite staggering. Neither of which have been my daily driver.
The S is a great looking car, IMHO it's probably the best looking car outside of the range of supercars but beauty is in the eye of the beholder. The Elise is a little more extreme in it's styling and this goes with the differences under the outer skin of the car.
The reason I loved the S for driving is the fact that it has a dual persona - below the 6k limit for VTEC the car drives as a quick rwd 2l car that is both stylish and inherently comfortable. The only gripe I ever had with the seating position is that it sometimes feels that you sit 'on' the seat rather than in it and can feel a little high up and exposed. However the rest of the driving position is excellent as you wear the car around you, which is ideal. For practicalities for a daily driver the S wins hands down, a large-ish boot, a roof that is raised or lowered in 6 secs and plenty of cubby holes for your bits and bobs.
Above 6k rpm then it opens up but is never a "widow maker" as I read elsewhere today. The pre-MY04 S02 tyres are slow to get heat in but any car that is cold shouldn't be ragged straight away IYAM. The pace is great but not blisteringly fast and due to its higher weight (IIRC 1330 kg approx) cornering, acceleration and braking have to take that into affect but the brakes are v. v. good.
The Elise is different - it's nowhere near as practical as a daily driver yet a lot of owners do use it as one, but compared to the S it suffers here for storage space and home comforts, the styling is spartan yet effective and fits with the feel of the car. The seats are much better as you sit far lower in them and the feel truly embraced and part of the car. The rest of the interior is basically black or polished aluminium.
Now for the contentious bit on a Honda forum - the driving is better in the Elise. Due to being 450kg -ish lighter and only 40-ish bhp down on the S, my Elise has a better power to weight ratio, is lighter all round and therefore quicker accelerating, braking and especially cornering. OH MY GOD - THE CORNERING ABILITIES OF THIS CAR ARE UNTRUE.
On a recent driving meet with the S2ki lot I had to consistently hold back, not that I am a faster driver, but because you can carry far more speed through corners safely and catch up on the guy in front a lot easier.
If I only had one car for both fun and daily driving I would say that the S would be my 1st choice, I'm sure other Elise owners will disagree but this is the S's strength not the Lotus' (especially as it was only ever meant as an A to B fun car - watch the Elise M1-11 vid on You tube for reference). However if practicalities are not a concern then I would stay with the Elise now.
My brother in law owns a Mk2 Elise and I own an S2000. I have driven his Elise and I love it, but it all comes down to what you want out of a car. Personally I went for the S as it's a more usable every day car, it's still raw , but more refined than an Elise. The Elise handles superbly and it does feel quicker, I think that is also something to do with the road noise and teeth shattering ride. I'd also have problems getting the Elise in and out of my drive as it's so low.
Plus the fact his only had 7,000 miles on the clock when he bought it about the same time as I got my S (June last year)and he's been back to the dealers numerous times and spent nearly a £1,000 keeping in it on the road whereas I've had no trouble (apart from a corroded centre cap -replaced under warranty)in that time.
They're both great fun good looking cars but the S just gives me that peice of mind on the reliabilty front.
Plus the fact his only had 7,000 miles on the clock when he bought it about the same time as I got my S (June last year)and he's been back to the dealers numerous times and spent nearly a £1,000 keeping in it on the road whereas I've had no trouble (apart from a corroded centre cap -replaced under warranty)in that time.
They're both great fun good looking cars but the S just gives me that peice of mind on the reliabilty front.
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