Degree qualified?

Author
Discussion

Europa1

10,599 posts

144 months

Tuesday 25th June 2019
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OP, in theory you don't need a degree to be a solicitor anymore: there's now an apprenticeship route. I know nothing about it though, I'm afraid.

meehaja

607 posts

64 months

Tuesday 25th June 2019
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Jobs that I look at are asking for a master now, I don't have a bachelor degree. I looked into MBAs a while back, but its a lot of money for something I'm not sure about.

I guess time will tell if I need a degree, but so far I'm clinging on!

worsy

3,826 posts

131 months

Tuesday 25th June 2019
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Op - I don't have a degree although I'm currently doing a Masters, that could be a route for you. If a job says anything but "Must have related degree" then it's fair game. i just assume degree or relevant experience is required. I've also worked at a large military organisation combining several countries where the norm is a request for PHD or Masters as a minimum.

272BHP

Original Poster:

1,767 posts

192 months

Tuesday 25th June 2019
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worsy said:
Op - I don't have a degree although I'm currently doing a Masters, that could be a route for you. If a job says anything but "Must have related degree" then it's fair game. i just assume degree or relevant experience is required. I've also worked at a large military organisation combining several countries where the norm is a request for PHD or Masters as a minimum.
Yeah I have worked there as well as a contractor, a degree wasn't a requirement for the role I applied for though.

boxst

3,246 posts

101 months

Wednesday 26th June 2019
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worsy said:
Op - I don't have a degree although I'm currently doing a Masters, that could be a route for you. If a job says anything but "Must have related degree" then it's fair game. i just assume degree or relevant experience is required. I've also worked at a large military organisation combining several countries where the norm is a request for PHD or Masters as a minimum.
As I'm just lazy (I could google it smile ) how do you do a Masters without a degree? I thought that was afterwards ?

272BHP

Original Poster:

1,767 posts

192 months

Wednesday 26th June 2019
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boxst said:
As I'm just lazy (I could google it smile ) how do you do a Masters without a degree? I thought that was afterwards ?
I got offered a Masters course by one university, they looked at my experience and certifications and said I could apply with those and I should be ok. Of course I then looked at the cost and promptly walked away.

Dr Jekyll

19,958 posts

217 months

Wednesday 26th June 2019
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boxst said:
As I'm just lazy (I could google it smile ) how do you do a Masters without a degree? I thought that was afterwards ?
There's a lot of wriggle room for mature students. On my masters course there was one guy who reckoned he'd never taken an exam before, certainly had no qualifications. He may have found it harder, but he still passed and even the people who already had PHDs found it hard work.

worsy

3,826 posts

131 months

Wednesday 26th June 2019
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Yup, you can do a Masters as a mature student. The application focuses on experience and so the application involves writing a great deal around that. Also needed two work references to support.

drmcw

169 posts

48 months

Wednesday 26th June 2019
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272BHP said:
I am 54 now so no spring chicken that's for sure.

I have no problem with the technical grilling and the coding challenges. I am fully employed and always have been so I have no trouble finding gainful employment in this domain. My issue is that there are a few roles that I thought I would have be perfect for until I scroll to the must haves and it cites a degree in CS or a related discipline.
Ah, I see. I'd have hoped your experience would count for more than a degree at your time of life and career.

I would certainly investigate the fast track route to a degree, plenty do and you'd hope no-one would pay much attention to which university it is given your experience. If it's a tick the box situation then they can tick that box!

anonymous-user

10 months

Wednesday 26th June 2019
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Arranguez said:
I’ve not got a degree. I’m early 40s and have only had three jobs since leaving uni for my first one. I’m still a bit nervous when applying for jobs (enterprise IT account management) but it hasn’t held me back so far, the companies (good vendors, top of their game) have been more interested in my experience and have never even bothered asking. Most of the time I tell them as an early disclosure and it doesn’t even register. I just had zero interest in my subject at degree level (Maths) and lasted 2 out of 3 years whereas at work I work hard and enjoy it. I wonder what the likes of Accenture might say if I ever apply there.
If you have any sense at all you wouldn't apply. Shysters and charlatans, along with EY PwC etc etc

I speak from experience of working alongside, and in some cases for, these companies

rog007

5,354 posts

180 months

Wednesday 26th June 2019
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boxst said:
worsy said:
Op - I don't have a degree although I'm currently doing a Masters, that could be a route for you. If a job says anything but "Must have related degree" then it's fair game. i just assume degree or relevant experience is required. I've also worked at a large military organisation combining several countries where the norm is a request for PHD or Masters as a minimum.
As I'm just lazy (I could google it smile ) how do you do a Masters without a degree? I thought that was afterwards ?
It’s termed Accreditation of prior and experiential learning (APEL).

Each University and course may have subtly differing requirements, so you’d need to check.

More here as an example (as it relates in this case to teacher training):

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/masters-level-accredit...


Chicken dinner

2,615 posts

24 months

Wednesday 26th June 2019
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Arranguez said:
I’ve not got a degree. I’m early 40s and have only had three jobs since leaving uni for my first one. I’m still a bit nervous when applying for jobs (enterprise IT account management) but it hasn’t held me back so far, the companies (good vendors, top of their game) have been more interested in my experience and have never even bothered asking. Most of the time I tell them as an early disclosure and it doesn’t even register. I just had zero interest in my subject at degree level (Maths) and lasted 2 out of 3 years whereas at work I work hard and enjoy it. I wonder what the likes of Accenture might say if I ever apply there.
No one in vendor land gives a stuff if the sales team or the SE’s have a degree.
It oddly appears on the job spec and I think it’s a US hangover.

If you’re going to Accenture for a sales role, they wouldn’t care either.

ericmcn

1,999 posts

53 months

Friday 28th June 2019
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272BHP said:
I don't have a degree.

I did plan on getting one when I left the military but by then it had all got a bit too expensive and the actual syllabus (Computer Science) would bore me to tears. In the end I decided it would be a better use of my time and money to get professional certifications instead.

Obviously you need a degree to be a doctor or lawyer but for technical and IT related roles is a degree really necessary in 2019?
For Electronics and that field in my area you will most likely need a degree and even that is not much, I did a masters back in 2009 when I found a degree less than i expected. Many IT jobs like tech support and networking via courses but hardcore stuff like embedded programming, Digital Design like VHDL and Verilog is all degree education and beyond.

Having said that nothing beats some common sense and experience and degree courses cant teach that.

ARHarh

745 posts

63 months

Friday 28th June 2019
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i worked my way to Senior engineer in a large consumer electronics corporation, my highest qualification was an o'level a pass in woodwork, I also had a b pass in maths and tech drawing. retired now so don't know if I could get a job at that level again or not.

orangesrule

554 posts

104 months

Saturday 29th June 2019
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ARHarh said:
i worked my way to Senior engineer in a large consumer electronics corporation, my highest qualification was an o'level a pass in woodwork, I also had a b pass in maths and tech drawing. retired now so don't know if I could get a job at that level again or not.
Unfortunately, i'd very much doubt you'd get to that position. Its really bloody frustrating the weigh companys' put on a degree.

Having been an apprentice and worked from the bottom up, into a commissioning role over the past 10 years if i want to progress into a more senior role than this then a degree is a requirement.... at 28 I'm about to finish a BEng, not because i want to but because doors are being closed, despite ever increasing experience in my sector.

SVS

3,824 posts

227 months

Saturday 29th June 2019
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The shame is that most university degrees don’t cover some of the most important skills required for many jobs, such as teamwork or communication skills.

These are skills most people need throughout their career. Whereas technical knowledge can go out of date as technology changes over time.

orangesrule

554 posts

104 months

Saturday 29th June 2019
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SVS said:
The shame is that most university degrees don’t cover some of the most important skills required for many jobs, such as teamwork or communication skills.

These are skills most people need throughout their career. Whereas technical knowledge can go out of date as technology changes over time.
Totally agree, the company i work for has totally lost the plot employing too many grads and not enough apprentices. Just because someone has a degree doesn't mean they have understanding of the job in hand or are a good manager. It really is rather frustrating! This also has had the affect of stalling progression for others, as grads are plonked into middle management.

Earthdweller

5,456 posts

82 months

Saturday 29th June 2019
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menguin said:
LosingGrip said:
Need one to join the police now...

Or you can do the Apprentice route and do a degree during your probation.

I'm not sure if it's a good idea.
Are you serious? You need a degree to join the police?!
It unfortunately is true and is a very bad idea

pghstochaj

717 posts

75 months

Saturday 29th June 2019
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orangesrule said:
Unfortunately, i'd very much doubt you'd get to that position. Its really bloody frustrating the weigh companys' put on a degree.

Having been an apprentice and worked from the bottom up, into a commissioning role over the past 10 years if i want to progress into a more senior role than this then a degree is a requirement.... at 28 I'm about to finish a BEng, not because i want to but because doors are being closed, despite ever increasing experience in my sector.
The issue is that without a degree in engineering, as a commissioning technician you might understand that changing x does y but you are unlikely, without further training, to understand why. In most cases that’s fine but in some cases it can be dangerous or commercially a bad idea. That’s why weight is put onto it. It’s ensuring a basic fundamental minimum understanding.

As a chemical engineer I understand what a chemical engineer is likely to know. As such, when in a design review process or HAZOP study or such like, I know whether they have the basic understanding sufficient to have an opinion on something.

That’s not to say that there aren’t people without degrees that would be or even are excellent engineers, it’s just it’s a lot more inconsistent and with the increase in numbers attending university earlier in life, more rare to find those people. 10 years ago managers on the civil engineering side would be “builders” and now they’re degree educated civil or structural engineers and it’s highly unlikely that will get anything but more normal.

The biggest problem is the abuse of the term engineer and the resulting confusion. I work on new build power stations and people are very clear as to whether they are an engineer in almost all situations as it matters. It’s interesting as in private life, people call themselves an engineer regardless. An operator can far better explain how changing x does y but it is usually an engineer (I.e with a degree and preferably chartered) that would be able to explain why and therefore apply science to it. If an operator tried to explain why, unless they were exceptional, their opinion wouldn’t count as they are very unlikely to have the fundamental building blocks to understand it.

hungry_hog

1,186 posts

144 months

Saturday 29th June 2019
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The dumbing down of school exams has mean a "good" degree has become the new "entry level"

Back in the late 90s, many of the traders I worked with would have a solid 2:2 from a red brick and well honed drinking skills.

Now City firms are asking for:

Pre-requisite:
- Good 2:1 (predicted or achieved) from top Uni
- internships / relevant experience
- evidence of leadership / initiative etc. from societies or other activities
- cultural fit, are you their "type" of person

Useful:

- programming skills
- language skills
- masters / PhD

you have to be a renaissance man / woman to snag the grad roles!