24 Hours in Police Custody: Ch4

[tim0409]

pocketspring said:

Bring back the 80's when the flying squad used to beat a confession out of you.

There are episodes of the Flying Squad documentary series from the late 1980’s on youtube and even then they were still coming to terms with PACE. In one episode they were attempting to refuse a suspects right to a solicitor on the grounds he might tell the suspect’s associates about their operation. It’s really interesting viewing.

[hungry_hog]

Vasco said:

Agreed, a nasty piece of work. I wonder if someone with a history like her can be a proper mother to her 3 children ?

I'll go out on a limb here and say "no"

[siremoon]

Hammer67 said:

I if were in charge of the world, if you answered no comment at interview then the 24 hours custody limit would simply extend endlessly until you decided to actually talk.

If I were in charge of the world and someone answered no comment to everything but then subsequently pleads guilty I would reduce the sentencing credit given for the guilty plea. My reasoning being the only reason people plead guilty is (in most cases) because (a) they did it and (b) the evidence available is very likely to result in a conviction.

I'd also extend "joint enterprise" to cover more situations. This would eliminate the scenario where for example two people run off from a car after a pursuit and it is not possible to prove which one was driving. Make them jointly liable for any offences committed. If this encourages one to give evidence against the other then so much the better.

[hungry_hog]

siremoon said:

If I were in charge of the world and someone answered no comment to everything but then subsequently pleads guilty I would reduce the sentencing credit given for the guilty plea. My reasoning being the only reason people plead guilty is (in most cases) because (a) they did it and (b) the evidence available is very likely to result in a conviction.

I'd also extend "joint enterprise" to cover more situations. This would eliminate the scenario where for example two people run off from a car after a pursuit and it is not possible to prove which one was driving. Make them jointly liable for any offences committed. If this encourages one to give evidence against the other then so much the better.

there should be a rule, no comment = you can't plead not guilty

[ben5575]

Have a watch of that US lawyer video linked a page or so ago

[bluemason]

fourstardan said:

Indeed shocking.

It may had come as a shock to the second bloke and young girl when charged but truth is they had all been getting away with crime for years, it may had not dawned on them what numbskulls they were involved with.

Does any of this stop knife crime in society?

I do think the uni girl should have spoken to a solicitor, and given her side of the story. Instead of trying to do the no comment thing. I do think her sentencing would have been much less.

[jonwm]

Enjoyed this weeks episode.

Still think there was more to it than we know, cant see anyone going to the lengths they did to steal a fake Rolex or even a real one that was would probably be worth a couple of thousand at most.

Travel from Cov to Luton for the girl, travel from London including hire car costs for the other 2, he is already is wearing a coat that is very expensive so split the spoils of the robbery 4 ways and and the risk of it all for a few hundred each? seems a bit much considering he is living in what looked like a hostel.

Good detective work though, I expected the 2 lads to not be found.

As always its the kids that suffer, she had 3 and the dad was already in jail, the murdered guy had a few too.

Girl at Uni seemed to have a decent life ahead of her.

[Vasco]

jonwm said:

Enjoyed this weeks episode.

Still think there was more to it than we know, cant see anyone going to the lengths they did to steal a fake Rolex or even a real one that was would probably be worth a couple of thousand at most.

Travel from Cov to Luton for the girl, travel from London including hire car costs for the other 2, he is already is wearing a coat that is very expensive so split the spoils of the robbery 4 ways and and the risk of it all for a few hundred each? seems a bit much considering he is living in what looked like a hostel.

Good detective work though, I expected the 2 lads to not be found.

As always its the kids that suffer, she had 3 and the dad was already in jail, the murdered guy had a few too.

Girl at Uni seemed to have a decent life ahead of her.

Yes, the Uni girl seemed the odd one out - but she had known the older nasty piece of work for some years, and seemed to be happy associating with her on a routine basis.

[andymc]

Vasco said:

jonwm said:

Enjoyed this weeks episode.

Still think there was more to it than we know, cant see anyone going to the lengths they did to steal a fake Rolex or even a real one that was would probably be worth a couple of thousand at most.

Travel from Cov to Luton for the girl, travel from London including hire car costs for the other 2, he is already is wearing a coat that is very expensive so split the spoils of the robbery 4 ways and and the risk of it all for a few hundred each? seems a bit much considering he is living in what looked like a hostel.

Good detective work though, I expected the 2 lads to not be found.

As always its the kids that suffer, she had 3 and the dad was already in jail, the murdered guy had a few too.

Girl at Uni seemed to have a decent life ahead of her.

Yes, the Uni girl seemed the odd one out - but she had known the older nasty piece of work for some years, and seemed to be happy associating with her on a routine basis.

gangster init

[normalbloke]

Are those two episodes the start of a new series, or are we just being drip fed as and when, as per the norm?

[shtu]

normalbloke said:

Are those two episodes the start of a new series, or are we just being drip fed as and when, as per the norm?

Don't see any next week.

Probably used it as a way of attracting folk onto the channel at 9, hoping they'll stay and watch that godawful "reality" gameshow at 10.

[GetCarter]

normalbloke said:

Are those two episodes the start of a new series, or are we just being drip fed as and when, as per the norm?

It's part of a series, but they put them on about once a month, not every week.

[bigandclever]

GetCarter said:

normalbloke said:

Are those two episodes the start of a new series, or are we just being drip fed as and when, as per the norm?

It's part of a series, but they put them on about once a month, not every week.

Historically you get a series run of weekly episodes and the 2-part specials happen as and when. Who knows what's happening with this series (10) we've had the first 2 on the weekly cadence and then nothing till this special.

[C5_Steve]

eccles said:

C5_Steve said:

No I hadn't missed that point at all, they had planned way in advance to drug and rob the guy at knifepoint. All four of them. Whilst the girls may not have expected the guys to arrive tooled up (doubtful, they weren't going to rob him with colourful language were they?), to be undertaking that kind of venture and not even demonstrating the most basic attempt to conceal your identity is incredibly stupid, but you're right they probably (wrongly) assumed as he was out of jail that he wouldn't report it for whatever reasons.

The guys clearly arrived with the intention of causing serious harm. If you turn up somewhere with a knife drawn, you're not coming for a chat. They were perhaps more worried about the guy recognising them than the police investigating which was the point of my comment.

I agree that had it just been a robbery the police wouldn't have undertaken such a thorough investigation. Certainly wouldn't be expensing a Moncleur coat!

You say " to be undertaking that kind of venture and not even demonstrating the most basic attempt to conceal your identity is incredibly stupid,"
one had his hood up, mask on and looked down as he passed the camera, then they went and cleaned the car. Even the police woman said they must be forensically aware as they used their shoulders to open the door, not their hands.

And yet, they were driving a car hired in their own name, one had his phone on him and the other put his partners SIM in his burner. So it made no difference that they had their faces covered because all the other evidence (including taking said car to a petrol station) was enough to convict.

Perhaps my expectations are too high and I've watched too many crime series over the years, expecting criminals to be as intelligent as someone who's watched at least one episode of Top Boy.........

[thetapeworm]

The biggest shock in all of this for me was that the coat was apparently a real one, I half expected them to buy one and then find it looked totally different on the CCTV compared with the £50 one the chap had got from a lock-up around the back of some shops.

Did it mention what happens to the coat once the investigation is complete?

The police spent less than that buying an entire car off me to help with an investigation but sold that on afterwards.

[Swervin_Mervin]

thetapeworm said:

The biggest shock in all of this for me was that the coat was apparently a real one, I half expected them to buy one and then find it looked totally different on the CCTV compared with the £50 one the chap had got from a lock-up around the back of some shops.

Did it mention what happens to the coat once the investigation is complete?

The police spent less than that buying an entire car off me to help with an investigation but sold that on afterwards.

I assumed that the coat they used in the reconstruciton was actually loaned by Moncler, who seemed like they'd been fairly helpful.

We couldn't decide if it was just pure arrogance that he went equpped to a robbery wearing such a jacket, or whether he was thick as mince. No point having a burner phone and hiding your face if you commit a crime wearing a coat only 69 people in the country have bought...

[Alickadoo]

Swervin_Mervin said:

I assumed that the coat they used in the reconstruciton was actually loaned by Moncler, who seemed like they'd been fairly helpful.

We couldn't decide if it was just pure arrogance that he went equpped to a robbery wearing such a jacket, or whether he was thick as mince. No point having a burner phone and hiding your face if you commit a crime wearing a coat only 69 people in the country have bought...

Stupidity fuelled by arrogance?

Arrongance fuelled by stupidity?

[Legacywr]

Alickadoo said:

Swervin_Mervin said:

I assumed that the coat they used in the reconstruciton was actually loaned by Moncler, who seemed like they'd been fairly helpful.

We couldn't decide if it was just pure arrogance that he went equpped to a robbery wearing such a jacket, or whether he was thick as mince. No point having a burner phone and hiding your face if you commit a crime wearing a coat only 69 people in the country have bought...

Stupidity fuelled by arrogance?

Arrongance fuelled by stupidity?

Most likely he was on drugs.

[Hammer67]

Legacywr said:

Alickadoo said:

Swervin_Mervin said:

I assumed that the coat they used in the reconstruciton was actually loaned by Moncler, who seemed like they'd been fairly helpful.

We couldn't decide if it was just pure arrogance that he went equpped to a robbery wearing such a jacket, or whether he was thick as mince. No point having a burner phone and hiding your face if you commit a crime wearing a coat only 69 people in the country have bought...

Stupidity fuelled by arrogance?

Arrongance fuelled by stupidity?

Most likely he was on drugs.

Although undoubtedly a duffer, he wouldn`t know Monclers sales figures.

[Swervin_Mervin]

Hammer67 said:

Legacywr said:

Alickadoo said:

Swervin_Mervin said:

I assumed that the coat they used in the reconstruciton was actually loaned by Moncler, who seemed like they'd been fairly helpful.

We couldn't decide if it was just pure arrogance that he went equpped to a robbery wearing such a jacket, or whether he was thick as mince. No point having a burner phone and hiding your face if you commit a crime wearing a coat only 69 people in the country have bought...

Stupidity fuelled by arrogance?

Arrongance fuelled by stupidity?

Most likely he was on drugs.

Although undoubtedly a duffer, he wouldn`t know Monclers sales figures.

He may not, bot it wouldn't take too many functioning brain cells to figure that a coat that retails at >£1k is unlikely to be that common. I mean, there was an episode a few series ago where the 2 dimwits went shopping in Tesco for plain clothing. They might not have been bright enough to work out they were on camera buying the stuff, but at least they'd got as far as figuring that wearing plain clothing might be a good idea.

But then again, what'a a guy that's making enough to buy such a coat doing getting involved in a robbery for 2 watches that they've already acknowledged might not be worth much?