How do we think EU negotiations will go? (Vol 8)
Discussion
jonnyb said:
The thing is that both the UK government and the Irish government are committed by international treaty to no hard boarder on the island of Ireland. How would a no deal cope with that. Or do we kiss good by to the Good Friday agreement too?
You need to ask the EU how they will deal with a no deal, the UK government and the Irish government have both said many times they will not be putting up a hard border.steve_k said:
jonnyb said:
The thing is that both the UK government and the Irish government are committed by international treaty to no hard boarder on the island of Ireland. How would a no deal cope with that. Or do we kiss good by to the Good Friday agreement too?
You need to ask the EU how they will deal with a no deal, the UK government and the Irish government have both said many times they will not be putting up a hard border.Not having a deal does not mean a wall is going up.
steve_k said:
jonnyb said:
The thing is that both the UK government and the Irish government are committed by international treaty to no hard boarder on the island of Ireland. How would a no deal cope with that. Or do we kiss good by to the Good Friday agreement too?
You need to ask the EU how they will deal with a no deal, the UK government and the Irish government have both said many times they will not be putting up a hard border.And "we do not want to" is not the same as "we will not.
steve_k said:
jonnyb said:
The thing is that both the UK government and the Irish government are committed by international treaty to no hard boarder on the island of Ireland. How would a no deal cope with that. Or do we kiss good by to the Good Friday agreement too?
You need to ask the EU how they will deal with a no deal, the UK government and the Irish government have both said many times they will not be putting up a hard border.But what happens in the even of no deal is anyone’s guess. The only option I see would be an Irish customs union with a customs boarder down the Irish Sea. But isn’t that one of Mays red lines?
mx5nut said:
steve_k said:
jonnyb said:
The thing is that both the UK government and the Irish government are committed by international treaty to no hard boarder on the island of Ireland. How would a no deal cope with that. Or do we kiss good by to the Good Friday agreement too?
You need to ask the EU how they will deal with a no deal, the UK government and the Irish government have both said many times they will not be putting up a hard border.And "we do not want to" is not the same as "we will not.
"Northern Ireland does not have to rely on the Irish Government or the European Union to prevent a return to borders of the past. The UK Government will not let that happen. I will not let that happen."
Theresa May
steve_k said:
mx5nut said:
steve_k said:
jonnyb said:
The thing is that both the UK government and the Irish government are committed by international treaty to no hard boarder on the island of Ireland. How would a no deal cope with that. Or do we kiss good by to the Good Friday agreement too?
You need to ask the EU how they will deal with a no deal, the UK government and the Irish government have both said many times they will not be putting up a hard border.And "we do not want to" is not the same as "we will not.
"Northern Ireland does not have to rely on the Irish Government or the European Union to prevent a return to borders of the past. The UK Government will not let that happen. I will not let that happen."
Theresa May
mx5nut said:
steve_k said:
jonnyb said:
The thing is that both the UK government and the Irish government are committed by international treaty to no hard boarder on the island of Ireland. How would a no deal cope with that. Or do we kiss good by to the Good Friday agreement too?
You need to ask the EU how they will deal with a no deal, the UK government and the Irish government have both said many times they will not be putting up a hard border.And "we do not want to" is not the same as "we will not.
jonnyb said:
The thing is that both the UK government and the Irish government are committed by international treaty to no hard boarder on the island of Ireland. How would a no deal cope with that. Or do we kiss good by to the Good Friday agreement too?
All parties involved have said no harder border on the island of Ireland under any circumstances.Checks away from the border are fine. Barnier set out wanting them in the Irish Sea, but think about how that helps the Irish peace process...
Putting them in France therefore seems logical. There's (arguably) going to have be something there anyway, there being a border there previously has never been a particular issue and most of the goods etc from Eire destined for the non-UK EU countries comes through the UK anyway. The French port chaps have also been noting there'll be no issues in the event of a no-deal.
However, as Leo, Michele and Theresa have all said no harder infrastructure under any circumstances, perhaps they all ought to now come clean and note what that will actually entail...
jonnyb said:
steve_k said:
mx5nut said:
steve_k said:
jonnyb said:
The thing is that both the UK government and the Irish government are committed by international treaty to no hard boarder on the island of Ireland. How would a no deal cope with that. Or do we kiss good by to the Good Friday agreement too?
You need to ask the EU how they will deal with a no deal, the UK government and the Irish government have both said many times they will not be putting up a hard border.And "we do not want to" is not the same as "we will not.
"Northern Ireland does not have to rely on the Irish Government or the European Union to prevent a return to borders of the past. The UK Government will not let that happen. I will not let that happen."
Theresa May
steve_k said:
Her words
"Northern Ireland does not have to rely on the Irish Government or the European Union to prevent a return to borders of the past. The UK Government will not let that happen. I will not let that happen."
Theresa May
Her words"Northern Ireland does not have to rely on the Irish Government or the European Union to prevent a return to borders of the past. The UK Government will not let that happen. I will not let that happen."
Theresa May
"I’m not going to be calling a snap election. I’ve been very clear that I think we need that period of time, that stability, to be able to deal with the issues that the country is facing and have that election in 2020"
Theresa May
Against my better judgement I'll reply to one of your posts.
Please post the scenarios and economic forecasts that prove (or even attempt to) that we'll be absolutely worse off and I'll STFU.
Until then, you could do us all a favour by doing the same...
The GFA does not need membership of the EU. It does not need the "backstop". It doesn't even need no border.
As noted earlier, there are other solutions to this. The EU would prefer they didn't have to be used (fair play to them), but even they have noted there is no need for a harder border there.
mx5nut said:
I miss the days when Brexiters would pretend to care about parliamentary sovereignty.
I still do. It doesn't stop me having an opinion on the quality of our politicians. They may be idiots, but they're our idiots. We don't need more (so quit practising...you're already very good at it ).mx5nut said:
Experts claim it will be bad. Social media memes say it'll be OK because we survived the blitz. Poster on a car forum believes the latter.
Don't believe I mentioned WWII.Please post the scenarios and economic forecasts that prove (or even attempt to) that we'll be absolutely worse off and I'll STFU.
Until then, you could do us all a favour by doing the same...
mx5nut said:
Fixed that for you
No need. It was exactly how I intended the first time round.The GFA does not need membership of the EU. It does not need the "backstop". It doesn't even need no border.
As noted earlier, there are other solutions to this. The EU would prefer they didn't have to be used (fair play to them), but even they have noted there is no need for a harder border there.
Murph7355 said:
jonnyb said:
The thing is that both the UK government and the Irish government are committed by international treaty to no hard boarder on the island of Ireland. How would a no deal cope with that. Or do we kiss good by to the Good Friday agreement too?
All parties involved have said no harder border on the island of Ireland under any circumstances.Checks away from the border are fine. Barnier set out wanting them in the Irish Sea, but think about how that helps the Irish peace process...
Putting them in France therefore seems logical. There's (arguably) going to have be something there anyway, there being a border there previously has never been a particular issue and most of the goods etc from Eire destined for the non-UK EU countries comes through the UK anyway. The French port chaps have also been noting there'll be no issues in the event of a no-deal.
However, as Leo, Michele and Theresa have all said no harder infrastructure under any circumstances, perhaps they all ought to now come clean and note what that will actually entail...
steve_k said:
jonnyb said:
steve_k said:
mx5nut said:
steve_k said:
jonnyb said:
The thing is that both the UK government and the Irish government are committed by international treaty to no hard boarder on the island of Ireland. How would a no deal cope with that. Or do we kiss good by to the Good Friday agreement too?
You need to ask the EU how they will deal with a no deal, the UK government and the Irish government have both said many times they will not be putting up a hard border.And "we do not want to" is not the same as "we will not.
"Northern Ireland does not have to rely on the Irish Government or the European Union to prevent a return to borders of the past. The UK Government will not let that happen. I will not let that happen."
Theresa May
She’s saying the UK government will not allow a situation where NI has to rely on the Irish government or the E.U. to not put up a hard boarder.
How is she going to do that exactly?
jonnyb said:
...The only option I see would be an Irish customs union with a customs boarder down the Irish Sea. ...
You are Michele Barnier AICMFP.Sooooooo.
If one can go down the Irish Sea, why not one across the English Channel instead?
(Maybe we should put one down both and Ireland/NI can revel in being the next Luxembourg with joint benefits going to both the UK and EU. That would undoubtedly have the added benefit of pissing off Juncker).
jonnyb said:
...
How is she going to do that exactly?
Errrr....by not picking up shovels and building watchtowers on the UK border.How is she going to do that exactly?
What Eire and the EU do is then up to them.
But Eire have noted similar to May in the past.
So what is going to happen? Are Tusk, Juncker and Verhofstadt going to be picking up their shovels and popping some on the Irish side of the border at the dead of night?
mx5nut said:
steve_k said:
Her words
"Northern Ireland does not have to rely on the Irish Government or the European Union to prevent a return to borders of the past. The UK Government will not let that happen. I will not let that happen."
Theresa May
Her words"Northern Ireland does not have to rely on the Irish Government or the European Union to prevent a return to borders of the past. The UK Government will not let that happen. I will not let that happen."
Theresa May
"I’m not going to be calling a snap election. I’ve been very clear that I think we need that period of time, that stability, to be able to deal with the issues that the country is facing and have that election in 2020"
Theresa May
Murph7355 said:
jonnyb said:
...
How is she going to do that exactly?
Errrr....by not picking up shovels and building watchtowers on the UK border.How is she going to do that exactly?
What Eire and the EU do is then up to them.
But Eire have noted similar to May in the past.
So what is going to happen? Are Tusk, Juncker and Verhofstadt going to be picking up their shovels and popping some on the Irish side of the border at the dead of night?
How is May going to stop NI relying on the Irish republic or the E.U. to not put up a hard boarder? How is going to take that decision out of their hands in a no deal scenario?
jonnyb said:
Murph7355 said:
jonnyb said:
...
How is she going to do that exactly?
Errrr....by not picking up shovels and building watchtowers on the UK border.How is she going to do that exactly?
What Eire and the EU do is then up to them.
But Eire have noted similar to May in the past.
So what is going to happen? Are Tusk, Juncker and Verhofstadt going to be picking up their shovels and popping some on the Irish side of the border at the dead of night?
How is May going to stop NI relying on the Irish republic or the E.U. to not put up a hard boarder? How is going to take that decision out of their hands in a no deal scenario?
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