Scottish Referendum / Independence - Vol 11

Scottish Referendum / Independence - Vol 11

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Discussion

N7GTX

6,747 posts

120 months

Friday 13th May
quotequote all
TheJimi said:
irc said:
Refugees in Scotland a month allowed to vote in elections. Can I go on holiday somewhere and vote for their government?

https://twitter.com/themajorityscot/status/1524905...
How the hell is that right?
FFS. I despair. ranting

NoddyonNitrous

1,767 posts

209 months

Saturday 14th May
quotequote all
O/T question - did Humza's missus get elected to the council trough?

biggbn

13,298 posts

197 months

Saturday 14th May
quotequote all
thewarlock said:
vikingaero said:
thewarlock said:
Shambler said:
Heard a rumour by someone in the industry regarding the Glen Sannox. Apparently the ramp at the back of the vessel had to be ordered from a Nordic country as it was a specialist part. When the ramp was delivered there was nowhere to store it at Ferguson yard so it was stored at another yard nearby. The storage yard went bust and all items in storage were auctioned off. A while later Ferguson went to collect the ramps only to find them missing. They got in touch with the auctioneers and found out that the ramp had been sold to a local farmer who had cut the ramp in half and was using it to move his cattle over a large ditch. Ferguson then had to buy it back and weld it back together.
I know a few people that work there at various levels. I'm gonna have to ask about this, as if it's true, it's hilarious.
The twist in the tale will be that the Farmer in question is the Scottish Transport Ministers brother....
I'm told it's nonsense. The ramp was delivered to the yard years ago, and fitted years ago, in one piece.
I wonder how much of these incredible tales on the Internet about politicians and parties are true. Thanks for clarifying this one, had you not this would have passed into Internet folklore and become a truth. Its kinda sad because the SNP provide us almost daily with evidence of their many and varied failings, people don't have to make things up.

s2kjock

1,320 posts

124 months

Saturday 14th May
quotequote all
NoddyonNitrous said:
O/T question - did Humza's missus get elected to the council trough?
I believe she was.

s2kjock

1,320 posts

124 months

Saturday 14th May
quotequote all
Ian974 said:
malks222 said:
there’s also crazy laws/ rule regarding the area/ ground at the top- in winter (because snow is on the ground protecting the ground/flowers/ fauna) you can take the train to the top, and leave the building, walk around, go skiing, play in the snow……. in the summer, you are not allowed out with the building in case you damage the ground/ flowers/ fauna……. but if you the set off on foot from the bottom and walk to the top, they can’t stop you walking about outside the top building?!?!

so these rules mean in summer people (walkers/ cyclists etc..) are not allowed to buy tickets to use the train to get to the top then start a trip/ walk/ adventure from there. crazy!
I knew the funicular was a shambles, but I'd never heard of that before!
If there's no snow it's effectively a railway where you aren't allowed out of the end station, but if you're walking outside the station anyway it's fine? And they still think they can make money from this?
I thought some of the covid rules were ridiculous, at least it explains where they got some of their inspiration from laugh
It's tragic that, like the ferries, as a nation with a long history of innovative engineering we seem to be able to make a dog's breakfast of things that other countries have been doing for years and we could easily copy.

Evercross

4,059 posts

41 months

Saturday 14th May
quotequote all
biggbn said:
I wonder how much of these incredible tales on the Internet about politicians and parties are true. Thanks for clarifying this one, had you not this would have passed into Internet folklore and become a truth. Its kinda sad because the SNP provide us almost daily with evidence of their many and varied failings, people don't have to make things up.
Reminds me of when the cybernats spread a false story about former Liberal Leader and East Dunbartonshire MP Jo Swinson regarding badger baiting (essentially an exaggerated tale on the back of the fact that she had abstained in an Commons vote that would have permitted limited badger culling by farmers), or when Nationalist activists posted through doors electoral literature linking former Labour Paisley South MP Douglas Alexander to the closure of the Linwood car factory in the constituency, despite him having been in high school at the time of the closure and several years away from entering politics.

Both lost their seats at the subsequent general elections to SNP candidates (the outrageous reaction of Nicola Sturgeon to the news Swinson had lost out being broadcast on national TV being one of the more notorious events of that particular election's results night).

Fake news is fine as long as it is Nationalist fake news.....?

Edited by Evercross on Saturday 14th May 10:31

Pastor Of Muppets

2,098 posts

39 months

Saturday 14th May
quotequote all
s2kjock said:
NoddyonNitrous said:
O/T question - did Humza's missus get elected to the council trough?
I believe she was.
Well of course she was elected.

Amazing how the SNP manage to predict the outcomes from such an early stage, it's like they are gearing everybody up with the results so that when they are finally declared nothing looks out of place because it was the 'expected' result anyway. Now I wonder why that would be.

On a completely different topic does anyone know where all those postal votes went and who actually looked after them, and were they kept securely
and safe 24 hours a day by people who are completely impartial and see democracy, honesty and integrity at the forefront of their beliefs?

tim0409

3,356 posts

136 months

Saturday 14th May
quotequote all
Pastor Of Muppets said:
On a completely different topic does anyone know where all those postal votes went and who actually looked after them, and were they kept securely
and safe 24 hours a day by people who are completely impartial and see democracy, honesty and integrity at the forefront of their beliefs?
I'm all for conspiracy theories etc, but please trust me when I say the Scottish election system is pretty secure. I've been an elected councillor, election/count observer, agent etc, and have been involved in all stages of the process, and it would take a Trumpian level of delusion to believe that there was any systemic issues.

Postal ballots are verified each day when they arrive, then securely stored, and then counted on the night; at all stages of the process there will be oversight from observers nominated by each political party.


Hill92

3,517 posts

167 months

Saturday 14th May
quotequote all
N7GTX said:
TheJimi said:
irc said:
Refugees in Scotland a month allowed to vote in elections. Can I go on holiday somewhere and vote for their government?

https://twitter.com/themajorityscot/status/1524905...
How the hell is that right?
FFS. I despair. ranting
What exactly is wrong with all legal residents having the right to vote in local elections (as they do in Scotland, Wales and a number of other countries)? Do bin collections or potholes suddenly not matter?

Ukrainians are not "on holiday". The Home Office have given them legal right to remain and refugee status.

If you dislike it because you think the SNP did it to increase their vote share then the problem isn't foreign residents but party politics bringing national politics into what should be an election about local issues.

biggbn

13,298 posts

197 months

Saturday 14th May
quotequote all
Evercross said:
biggbn said:
I wonder how much of these incredible tales on the Internet about politicians and parties are true. Thanks for clarifying this one, had you not this would have passed into Internet folklore and become a truth. Its kinda sad because the SNP provide us almost daily with evidence of their many and varied failings, people don't have to make things up.
Reminds me of when the cybernats spread a false story about former Liberal Leader and East Dunbartonshire MP Jo Swinson regarding badger baiting (essentially an exaggerated tale on the back of the fact that she had abstained in an Commons vote that would have permitted limited badger culling by farmers), or when Nationalist activists posted through doors electoral literature linking former Labour Paisley South MP Douglas Alexander to the closure of the Linwood car factory in the constituency, despite him having been in high school at the time of the closure and several years away from entering politics.

Both lost their seats at the subsequent general elections to SNP candidates (the outrageous reaction of Nicola Sturgeon to the news Swinson had lost out being broadcast on national TV being one of the more notorious events of that particular election's results night).

Fake news is fine as long as it is Nationalist fake news.....?

Edited by Evercross on Saturday 14th May 10:31
That seems rather pugnacious EV? I did not specify anti SNP 'fake news', my comment was holistic, and I finished it by suggesting the clowns in the big hoose do a good enough job of discrediting themselves? I've nae time for all this media hyped or Internet created gossip about politicians, political parties, celebs etc, it seems rather indicative of the slavish pavlovian world we live in where everyone wants to believe the worst, and if they can't find it, they create it or it is created for them. Not a society I want to be a part of, I'm so glad my job puts me in touch with so many optimistic, free thinking individuals of all ages.

N7GTX

6,747 posts

120 months

Saturday 14th May
quotequote all
Hill92 said:
N7GTX said:
TheJimi said:
irc said:
Refugees in Scotland a month allowed to vote in elections. Can I go on holiday somewhere and vote for their government?

https://twitter.com/themajorityscot/status/1524905...
How the hell is that right?
FFS. I despair. ranting
What exactly is wrong with all legal residents having the right to vote in local elections (as they do in Scotland, Wales and a number of other countries)? Do bin collections or potholes suddenly not matter?

Ukrainians are not "on holiday". The Home Office have given them legal right to remain and refugee status.

If you dislike it because you think the SNP did it to increase their vote share then the problem isn't foreign residents but party politics bringing national politics into what should be an election about local issues.
Who said anything about Ukrainians? rolleyes

So its okay for people who have been resident for one month to vote? Really? No idea who the various parties are. No idea what they stand for. Potholes and bin collections wont matter to Afghanis, Rwandans, Somalis and others from 3rd world countries. Once they have been resident for 12 months they might well have a vague idea what's happening but one month is not on.

Hill92

3,517 posts

167 months

Saturday 14th May
quotequote all
N7GTX said:
Who said anything about Ukrainians? rolleyes

So its okay for people who have been resident for one month to vote? Really? No idea who the various parties are. No idea what they stand for. Potholes and bin collections wont matter to Afghanis, Rwandans, Somalis and others from 3rd world countries. Once they have been resident for 12 months they might well have a vague idea what's happening but one month is not on.
The tweet in the original post was about Ukrainian refugees rolleyes

By your argument we should also deny the vote to anyone who has recently moved up from England. After all, wtf do they know about Scottish education system for example? Or central belters moving to the islands?

Essentially anyone registered by 18 April was allowed to vote, regardless of whether they've just moved a street over in Inverness, moved from Exeter, Auckland or Tokyo.


TheJimi

21,969 posts

220 months

Saturday 14th May
quotequote all
Hill92 said:
N7GTX said:
TheJimi said:
irc said:
Refugees in Scotland a month allowed to vote in elections. Can I go on holiday somewhere and vote for their government?

https://twitter.com/themajorityscot/status/1524905...
How the hell is that right?
FFS. I despair. ranting
What exactly is wrong with all legal residents having the right to vote in local elections (as they do in Scotland, Wales and a number of other countries)? Do bin collections or potholes suddenly not matter?

Ukrainians are not "on holiday". The Home Office have given them legal right to remain and refugee status.

If you dislike it because you think the SNP did it to increase their vote share then the problem isn't foreign residents but party politics bringing national politics into what should be an election about local issues.
First of all, you will note that I mentioned nothing about the nationalities, nor did I mention anything about them being on holiday, so I'm entirely baffled at what you're responding to here.

For the avoidance of doubt, I don't care about the individual's nationalities, nor about the fact that they are refugees - in fact I welcome them, and I'm proud to say that my local community is doing brilliant work to bring a family over here to our village.

No, what I find unacceptable is giving the right to vote after having only been in the country for a month. How can someone possibly vote with any degree of conviction of who and what they're are voting for, having only been in the country for a month?

The period should be a year before the ability to vote is activated, in my opinion. At least that way the individual has a fairly good chance of building an understanding before voting.



Edited by TheJimi on Saturday 14th May 21:50

Hill92

3,517 posts

167 months

Saturday 14th May
quotequote all
TheJimi said:
Hill92 said:
N7GTX said:
TheJimi said:
irc said:
Refugees in Scotland a month allowed to vote in elections. Can I go on holiday somewhere and vote for their government?

https://twitter.com/themajorityscot/status/1524905...
How the hell is that right?
FFS. I despair. ranting
What exactly is wrong with all legal residents having the right to vote in local elections (as they do in Scotland, Wales and a number of other countries)? Do bin collections or potholes suddenly not matter?

Ukrainians are not "on holiday". The Home Office have given them legal right to remain and refugee status.

If you dislike it because you think the SNP did it to increase their vote share then the problem isn't foreign residents but party politics bringing national politics into what should be an election about local issues.
First of all, you will note that I mentioned nothing about the nationalities, nor did I mention anything about them being on holiday, so I'm entirely baffled at what you're responding to here.

For the avoidance of doubt, I don't care about the individual's nationalities, nor about the fact that they are refugees - in fact I welcome them, and I'm proud to say that my local community is doing brilliant work to bring a family over here to our village.

No, what I find unacceptable is giving the right to vote after having only been in the country for a month. How can someone possibly vote with any degree of conviction of who and what they're are voting for, having only been in the country for a month?

The period should a year before the ability to vote is activated, in my opinion. At least that way the individual has a fairly good chance of building an understanding before voting.


Edited by TheJimi on Saturday 14th May 21:49
I didn't say you did either. The original post you quoted does ask about holidays and the tweet it linked to is specifically about Ukrainian refugees.

See my other post above about the rest.

Anyway, I don't think we've had this:

The Telegraph have tracked down some inconvenient quotes from Mike Russell telling a US think tank that both UK and Westminster governments must consent to hold a referendum. And he knows this because it's what he agreed during With Blair and Dewer in the negotiations for the draft Scotland Bill in 1997, which established the Scottish Parliament.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2022/05/11/sc...

Sturgeon has until 10 June to publish the Scottish Government's legal advice. How much longer can she string her supporters along on the promise of a referendum that will not happen any time soon? The cognitive dissonance is approaching QAnon levels.

hidetheelephants

19,263 posts

170 months

Saturday 14th May
quotequote all
Hill92 said:
I didn't say you did either. The original post you quoted does ask about holidays and the tweet it linked to is specifically about Ukrainian refugees.

See my other post above about the rest.

Anyway, I don't think we've had this:

The Telegraph have tracked down some inconvenient quotes from Mike Russell telling a US think tank that both UK and Westminster governments must consent to hold a referendum. And he knows this because it's what he agreed during With Blair and Dewer in the negotiations for the draft Scotland Bill in 1997, which established the Scottish Parliament.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2022/05/11/sc...

Sturgeon has until 10 June to publish the Scottish Government's legal advice. How much longer can she string her supporters along on the promise of a referendum that will not happen any time soon? The cognitive dissonance is approaching QAnon levels.
Donald Dewar isnae deid, he faked his death, is living in secret and working for Indyref2? wobble

irc

3,360 posts

113 months

Sunday 15th May
quotequote all


How are the SNP going to justify ordering the ferries when the risk of huge financial loss was clear before the contract was signed. This was not a contract signed in good faith that went wrong.

rider73

2,315 posts

54 months

Sunday 15th May
quotequote all
Because they can get away with it without any real consequence in their electoral votes. See the council elections

I blame the failure of the opposition, and the main stream media.....


hidetheelephants

19,263 posts

170 months

Sunday 15th May
quotequote all
rider73 said:
Because they can get away with it without any real consequence in their electoral votes. See the council elections

I blame the failure of the opposition, and the main stream media.....
How so? The media have reported the ferry issue consistently and have highlighted every new development. The opposition are limp but the ferry issue has been raised at FMQs repeatedly. If the voters continue to vote them in there's not a lot more to be done; we get the representatives we vote for, like Natalie McGarry.

technodup

7,424 posts

107 months

Monday 16th May
quotequote all
hidetheelephants said:
How so? The media have reported the ferry issue consistently and have highlighted every new development. The opposition are limp but the ferry issue has been raised at FMQs repeatedly. If the voters continue to vote them in there's not a lot more to be done; we get the representatives we vote for, like Natalie McGarry.
It's not reported on in the same way as if it were the Tories down south. 'Tory sleaze', 'lies', 'a resignation matter' etc, once they take the lead it usually spells the end for whoever is in their sights. It is a convenient truth that the SNP in charge suit the Tories though, so it's no wonder some wonder if they're on the payroll somewhere...