Public emergency alert - being sent to your phone
Discussion
Greendubber said:
Disastrous said:
Greendubber said:
How would they know if something is happening there and then though? You could be in an office block and there's a terrorist incident around the corner, it's not yet on the news, it's still ongoing and you'd be totally unaware. It's an extreme example but how would you know?
Surely if an ongoing terrorist incident was happening round the corner the absolute LAST thing the authorities would want to do is message everyone in the area saying “There’s an ongoing terrorist incident round the corner”??Could you imagine the scenes?
If they send a message saying 'do not go north, you'll die' everyone will run north :-)
If they want to calm people down, just turn off the mobile networks.
What the emergency system should do, is send you a text saying 'sorry this is a local power outage, stay put, it'll be back on soon.' Only we already have this, I had one last month.
A pointless system, designed by idiots, for the stupid, who'll use it to run towards the danger!
dundarach said:
Greendubber said:
Disastrous said:
Greendubber said:
How would they know if something is happening there and then though? You could be in an office block and there's a terrorist incident around the corner, it's not yet on the news, it's still ongoing and you'd be totally unaware. It's an extreme example but how would you know?
Surely if an ongoing terrorist incident was happening round the corner the absolute LAST thing the authorities would want to do is message everyone in the area saying “There’s an ongoing terrorist incident round the corner”??Could you imagine the scenes?
If they send a message saying 'do not go north, you'll die' everyone will run north :-)
If they want to calm people down, just turn off the mobile networks.
What the emergency system should do, is send you a text saying 'sorry this is a local power outage, stay put, it'll be back on soon.' Only we already have this, I had one last month.
A pointless system, designed by idiots, for the stupid, who'll use it to run towards the danger!
monkfish1 said:
Fair enough.
Im surprised though.
I imagine it may be an age thing, but the vast majority of people I know, including my 70 year old parents, use their smartphone as their only source of clock and alarm clock on their bedside table. Hence why most people have their phone charger on their bedside table. Im surprised though.
The days of people having a dedicated bedside clock/alarm clock seem to be long gone. I don't know anyone who has one.
Greendubber said:
dundarach said:
Greendubber said:
Disastrous said:
Greendubber said:
How would they know if something is happening there and then though? You could be in an office block and there's a terrorist incident around the corner, it's not yet on the news, it's still ongoing and you'd be totally unaware. It's an extreme example but how would you know?
Surely if an ongoing terrorist incident was happening round the corner the absolute LAST thing the authorities would want to do is message everyone in the area saying “There’s an ongoing terrorist incident round the corner”??Could you imagine the scenes?
If they send a message saying 'do not go north, you'll die' everyone will run north :-)
If they want to calm people down, just turn off the mobile networks.
What the emergency system should do, is send you a text saying 'sorry this is a local power outage, stay put, it'll be back on soon.' Only we already have this, I had one last month.
A pointless system, designed by idiots, for the stupid, who'll use it to run towards the danger!
The Nudge Unit will have direct access to concerned people who leave the
H L Mencken said:
The whole aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed (and hence clamorous to be led to safety) by an endless series of hobgoblins, most of them imaginary.
Remember, good people, never run with scissors.Some of our friends abroad don't seem to understand why the announcement of this system for the UK has annoyed many of us. There are two issues being discussed here:
Firstly, is this system needed in the UK and is it good value for money? If we lived in a country where regular mass shootings, kidnappings, or hurricanes occurred, then it might be a good idea. But we don't, such instances are very rare, so I consider it to be a huge waste of millions (or billions?) of pounds.
Secondly, am I happy with further state intrusion into our daily lives, and the pushing of nudge messages to our phones? Absolutely not. They won't be able to resist. It will go the same way as messaging from my surgery went after Covid, constant messages to 'get vaccinated!' 'get boosted!' or 'don't bother contacting us at all as we understaffed' as usual, or the 'cycle for clean air' messages on the local traffic information matrix signs.
I find it worrying how so many people are quite happy go along with the Government narrative and do anything they say without question. What a waste of money!
So Sunday the 23rd is the big day. I'm fully prepared, I've had a look through my phone and turned off emergency alerts, and am hoping to get through the day without being interrupted.
Here's an idea - to prevent panic for those not in the know - how about using the matrix signs to broadcast this message:
Firstly, is this system needed in the UK and is it good value for money? If we lived in a country where regular mass shootings, kidnappings, or hurricanes occurred, then it might be a good idea. But we don't, such instances are very rare, so I consider it to be a huge waste of millions (or billions?) of pounds.
Secondly, am I happy with further state intrusion into our daily lives, and the pushing of nudge messages to our phones? Absolutely not. They won't be able to resist. It will go the same way as messaging from my surgery went after Covid, constant messages to 'get vaccinated!' 'get boosted!' or 'don't bother contacting us at all as we understaffed' as usual, or the 'cycle for clean air' messages on the local traffic information matrix signs.
I find it worrying how so many people are quite happy go along with the Government narrative and do anything they say without question. What a waste of money!
So Sunday the 23rd is the big day. I'm fully prepared, I've had a look through my phone and turned off emergency alerts, and am hoping to get through the day without being interrupted.
Here's an idea - to prevent panic for those not in the know - how about using the matrix signs to broadcast this message:
GSE said:
Some of our friends abroad don't seem to understand why the announcement of this system for the UK has annoyed many of us. There are two issues being discussed here:
Firstly, is this system needed in the UK and is it good value for money? If we lived in a country where regular mass shootings, kidnappings, or hurricanes occurred, then it might be a good idea. But we don't, such instances are very rare, so I consider it to be a huge waste of millions (or billions?) of pounds.
Secondly, am I happy with further state intrusion into our daily lives, and the pushing of nudge messages to our phones? Absolutely not. They won't be able to resist. It will go the same way as messaging from my surgery went after Covid, constant messages to 'get vaccinated!' 'get boosted!' or 'don't bother contacting us at all as we understaffed' as usual, or the 'cycle for clean air' messages on the local traffic information matrix signs.
I find it worrying how so many people are quite happy go along with the Government narrative and do anything they say without question. What a waste of money!
Spot on.Firstly, is this system needed in the UK and is it good value for money? If we lived in a country where regular mass shootings, kidnappings, or hurricanes occurred, then it might be a good idea. But we don't, such instances are very rare, so I consider it to be a huge waste of millions (or billions?) of pounds.
Secondly, am I happy with further state intrusion into our daily lives, and the pushing of nudge messages to our phones? Absolutely not. They won't be able to resist. It will go the same way as messaging from my surgery went after Covid, constant messages to 'get vaccinated!' 'get boosted!' or 'don't bother contacting us at all as we understaffed' as usual, or the 'cycle for clean air' messages on the local traffic information matrix signs.
I find it worrying how so many people are quite happy go along with the Government narrative and do anything they say without question. What a waste of money!
There's some evidence that Nudge can save public money in some areas, reducing the number of bailiff visits is reportedly one example involving the UK Nudge Unit.
That's the innocent flower, and it really exists. Shakespeare's serpent also really exists: "Look like the innocent flower but be the serpent under it".
We know this because of various happenings already mentioned in the thread concerning matrix messages and GP surgery text messages,
Any government will protest innocence and provide plausible excuses. Given the wise, pure innocent flowers that politicians tend not to be, they can go spin. Perhaps that needs to be re-phrased.
That's the innocent flower, and it really exists. Shakespeare's serpent also really exists: "Look like the innocent flower but be the serpent under it".
We know this because of various happenings already mentioned in the thread concerning matrix messages and GP surgery text messages,
Any government will protest innocence and provide plausible excuses. Given the wise, pure innocent flowers that politicians tend not to be, they can go spin. Perhaps that needs to be re-phrased.
Sway said:
GSE - how many millions (or billions)?
Got any figures?
No I haven't. To be honest, I wouldn't really know where to start, to calculate the cost. But, as with all Government initiatives,Got any figures?
it won't have been 'cheap' will it? Hence my suggestion that it has probably run into millions, particularly as they have been at it for over ten years.
Perhaps you have some figures? So that we can put it into perspective and see if the money could have been better spent...
It's worth noting that the Nudge Unit has gone through several changes since its inception in 2010. According to reports, in 2014 it became a "social purpose company" jointly owned by the UK government and Nesta, a UK-based innovation charity. In 2019, the Unit was renamed as "The Behavioural Insights Team" (BIT), and Nesta sold its shares to the UK government. Then in 2021 it became owned by Nesta in entirety. The impression given is that it was always called BIT rather than NU, presumably due to spin, as the notion of insights is more palatable than nudges?
https://www.bi.team/about-us-2/who-we-are/
It's not clear how these changes have affected the unit's funding arrangements and its effectiveness, but it does show that it hasn't been purely (!) politicians who've their finger on the nudges, and it may change again, privatisation for example if the charitable sector hands over (sells) to the private sector. Hopefully not. It's already been selling its services worldwide - a good thing when it saved public money, a bad thing if it involves policy drift.
https://www.bi.team/about-us-2/who-we-are/
It's not clear how these changes have affected the unit's funding arrangements and its effectiveness, but it does show that it hasn't been purely (!) politicians who've their finger on the nudges, and it may change again, privatisation for example if the charitable sector hands over (sells) to the private sector. Hopefully not. It's already been selling its services worldwide - a good thing when it saved public money, a bad thing if it involves policy drift.
MYOB said:
I don’t think this is a big IT project where a huge amount of money is being spent. They are not buying any equipment etc. They will use existing infrastructure with the telecom providers and existing staff in the Civil Service.
I believe the cost is minimal. My conclusion for this is that if they were spending millions, there would be public records of the project but I can’t find anything.
Indeed.I believe the cost is minimal. My conclusion for this is that if they were spending millions, there would be public records of the project but I can’t find anything.
The implementation approach is 'you have the network, we want to be able to do this - make that happen' (which is true for a number of different things)
turbobloke said:
It's worth noting that the Nudge Unit has gone through several changes since its inception in 2010. According to reports, in 2014 it became a "social purpose company" jointly owned by the UK government and Nesta, a UK-based innovation charity. In 2019, the Unit was renamed as "The Behavioural Insights Team" (BIT), and Nesta sold its shares to the UK government. Then in 2021 it became owned by Nesta in entirety. The impression given is that it was always called BIT rather than NU, presumably due to spin, as the notion of insights is more palatable than nudges?
https://www.bi.team/about-us-2/who-we-are/
It's not clear how these changes have affected the unit's funding arrangements and its effectiveness, but it does show that it hasn't been purely (!) politicians who've their finger on the nudges, and it may change again, privatisation for example if the charitable sector hands over (sells) to the private sector. Hopefully not. It's already been selling its services worldwide - a good thing when it saved public money, a bad thing if it involves policy drift.
This is a book by the person that started it all off the UK:https://www.bi.team/about-us-2/who-we-are/
It's not clear how these changes have affected the unit's funding arrangements and its effectiveness, but it does show that it hasn't been purely (!) politicians who've their finger on the nudges, and it may change again, privatisation for example if the charitable sector hands over (sells) to the private sector. Hopefully not. It's already been selling its services worldwide - a good thing when it saved public money, a bad thing if it involves policy drift.
https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B00TGIX6V2/
I read it some years ago, and what I recall was that they only had one large success and the book keeps harping back to it and the author has been dining out on it every since.
But now, the population know about this type of thing, so now, people can spot when they are being nudged, which causes them to resist instead.
snuffy said:
turbobloke said:
It's worth noting that the Nudge Unit has gone through several changes since its inception in 2010. According to reports, in 2014 it became a "social purpose company" jointly owned by the UK government and Nesta, a UK-based innovation charity. In 2019, the Unit was renamed as "The Behavioural Insights Team" (BIT), and Nesta sold its shares to the UK government. Then in 2021 it became owned by Nesta in entirety. The impression given is that it was always called BIT rather than NU, presumably due to spin, as the notion of insights is more palatable than nudges?
https://www.bi.team/about-us-2/who-we-are/
It's not clear how these changes have affected the unit's funding arrangements and its effectiveness, but it does show that it hasn't been purely (!) politicians who've their finger on the nudges, and it may change again, privatisation for example if the charitable sector hands over (sells) to the private sector. Hopefully not. It's already been selling its services worldwide - a good thing when it saved public money, a bad thing if it involves policy drift.
This is a book by the person that started it all off the UK:https://www.bi.team/about-us-2/who-we-are/
It's not clear how these changes have affected the unit's funding arrangements and its effectiveness, but it does show that it hasn't been purely (!) politicians who've their finger on the nudges, and it may change again, privatisation for example if the charitable sector hands over (sells) to the private sector. Hopefully not. It's already been selling its services worldwide - a good thing when it saved public money, a bad thing if it involves policy drift.
https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B00TGIX6V2/
I read it some years ago, and what I recall was that they only had one large success and the book keeps harping back to it and the author has been dining out on it every since.
But now, the population know about this type of thing, so now, people can spot when they are being nudged, which causes them to resist instead.
MYOB said:
I don’t think this is a big IT project where a huge amount of money is being spent. They are not buying any equipment etc. They will use existing infrastructure with the telecom providers and existing staff in the Civil Service.
I believe the cost is minimal. My conclusion for this is that if they were spending millions, there would be public records of the project but I can’t find anything.
Yes, yes I'm sure you're right. I believe the cost is minimal. My conclusion for this is that if they were spending millions, there would be public records of the project but I can’t find anything.
LOL
Disastrous said:
Greendubber said:
How would they know if something is happening there and then though? You could be in an office block and there's a terrorist incident around the corner, it's not yet on the news, it's still ongoing and you'd be totally unaware. It's an extreme example but how would you know?
Surely if an ongoing terrorist incident was happening round the corner the absolute LAST thing the authorities would want to do is message everyone in the area saying “There’s an ongoing terrorist incident round the corner”??Could you imagine the scenes?
Timothy Bucktu said:
MYOB said:
I don’t think this is a big IT project where a huge amount of money is being spent. They are not buying any equipment etc. They will use existing infrastructure with the telecom providers and existing staff in the Civil Service.
I believe the cost is minimal. My conclusion for this is that if they were spending millions, there would be public records of the project but I can’t find anything.
Yes, yes I'm sure you're right. I believe the cost is minimal. My conclusion for this is that if they were spending millions, there would be public records of the project but I can’t find anything.
LOL
oyster said:
Timothy Bucktu said:
MYOB said:
I don’t think this is a big IT project where a huge amount of money is being spent. They are not buying any equipment etc. They will use existing infrastructure with the telecom providers and existing staff in the Civil Service.
I believe the cost is minimal. My conclusion for this is that if they were spending millions, there would be public records of the project but I can’t find anything.
Yes, yes I'm sure you're right. I believe the cost is minimal. My conclusion for this is that if they were spending millions, there would be public records of the project but I can’t find anything.
LOL
But it would be nice to actually know...I asked the question early on, and nobody seems to know the answer. There must be a way to find out how our money is wasted surely?
Timothy Bucktu said:
Oh I agree. But this is the UK Government and an IT system. It'll probably have cost a fortune and gone way over budget.
But it would be nice to actually know...I asked the question early on, and nobody seems to know the answer. There must be a way to find out how our money is wasted surely?
Wait a few weeks and tin foil enthusiast A. Griffiths may get you the answers you crave: But it would be nice to actually know...I asked the question early on, and nobody seems to know the answer. There must be a way to find out how our money is wasted surely?
https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/emergency_a...
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