Scottish Politics / Independence - Vol 12

[CallThatMusic]

I watched the service and was impressed.
Put together and performed faultlessly, I’d recommend anyone watch it.
Macaskill spoke powerfully, he did not miss the current leadership of the SNP.
You could see them squirm.

[biggles330d]

General Price said:

Very modern.

Good to see they are still getting value from the design implemented on the last ship they built. I'm half expecting to see a faded picture of Princess Anne lurking somewhere.

Honestly, to think how much design effort and quality that went into the refreshed Caledonian Sleeper and the station lounges where the brief was to showcase the best of Scotland because it was seen as part of the 'sell' of Scottish tourism. Designed in Scotland, built in Spain. Here we have seemingly not designed at all and built in Scotland... Says it all really.

[biggles330d]

It will be truly fascinating to see these vessels put side by side with the Turkish ones and see how stark the quality and design differences are, and in the long term, how the real life costs play out. I fear it won't be a very good advert for Scottish workmanship.

[hidetheelephants]

as

biggles330d said:

Good to see they are still getting value from the design implemented on the last ship they built. I'm half expecting to see a faded picture of Princess Anne lurking somewhere.

Honestly, to think how much design effort and quality that went into the refreshed Caledonian Sleeper and the station lounges where the brief was to showcase the best of Scotland because it was seen as part of the 'sell' of Scottish tourism. Designed in Scotland, built in Spain. Here we have seemingly not designed at all and built in Scotland... Says it all really.

As opposed to Glens stbox and Rusty; designed in Portugal and built in Scotland.

[Carl_VivaEspana]

sherman said:

A couple of hundred (if your lucky) flag wavers out for Salmond.

Several thousand Christmas shoppers just behind walking along the Royal mile wondering why everyone was hanging about.

The world of politics feels much poorer without him. He made his mark. May he rest in peace.

[irc]

The continued failure in education in Scotland.

"The latest results showed how the education of children in the devolved nations of Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland, which have all used their devolved powers to enact radical experiment with education policies, has slipped back compared to that of their peers in England"



"It is hard to say definitively why there has been a deterioration in the educational achievement of any one country,” says Sibieta. “But it is very plausible that the introduction of skills-base curricula is at least partly to blame and would match what has also happened in New Zealand and Finland, which have also adopted a similar approach.”

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/12/02/scotti...

And all while Scotland spends more per pupil than anywhere else in the UK.

[rider73]

irc said:

The continued failure in education in Scotland.

"The latest results showed how the education of children in the devolved nations of Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland, which have all used their devolved powers to enact radical experiment with education policies, has slipped back compared to that of their peers in England"



"It is hard to say definitively why there has been a deterioration in the educational achievement of any one country,” says Sibieta. “But it is very plausible that the introduction of skills-base curricula is at least partly to blame and would match what has also happened in New Zealand and Finland, which have also adopted a similar approach.”

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/12/02/scotti...

And all while Scotland spends more per pupil than anywhere else in the UK.

its all the Tories fault ........................... oh no wait..............Westministers fault...............

[dxg]

rider73 said:

irc said:

The continued failure in education in Scotland.

"The latest results showed how the education of children in the devolved nations of Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland, which have all used their devolved powers to enact radical experiment with education policies, has slipped back compared to that of their peers in England"



"It is hard to say definitively why there has been a deterioration in the educational achievement of any one country,” says Sibieta. “But it is very plausible that the introduction of skills-base curricula is at least partly to blame and would match what has also happened in New Zealand and Finland, which have also adopted a similar approach.”

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/12/02/scotti...

And all while Scotland spends more per pupil than anywhere else in the UK.

its all the Tories fault ........................... oh no wait..............Westministers fault...............

The McNamara Fallacy - it's easy to measure and boast about money spent, but that's not the metric that matters...

[irc]

The boss of Fergusons explains wh the Glen Sanxox anchor was found to be faulty on the sea trial. It would go down but they were not sure it would come up again.

At 2:50


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lc0QlZLRdxw

Also points out the LNG systems are complex and nobody knows how to install them. THey add complexity

A wise choice for the ships then.

[Taffer]

irc said:

The boss of Fergusons explains wh the Glen Sanxox anchor was found to be faulty on the sea trial. It would go down but they were not sure it would come up again.

At 2:50


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lc0QlZLRdxw

Also points out the LNG systems are complex and nobody knows how to install them. THey add complexity

A wise choice for the ships then.

He's talking ste, just like his delivery date estimates - they are slightly more complex, but it's a good thing that the LNGPac system which is on the Sannox and hundreds of other vessels arrives as a pre-packaged system - the shipyard only has to supply piping from bunker station to the fuel tank, and from gas valve units to the engines, and appropriate ventilation and gas detection systems.

There's plenty of expertise worldwide on LNG systems; just because no UK yard had built a dual-fuel ship doesn't mean the knowledge isn't out there - Ferguson's just attempted to wing the whole project and not seek out appropriate assistance.

As for him saying the Glen Rosa is still on track for September 2025? It won't be, and he's already said off-the-record that the yard is (somehow) running out of money for it........IF they get the small ferries contract, they'll struggle to finish the Rosa off and make headway on the new ships with the resources they have

[alangla]

Taffer said:

He's talking ste, just like his delivery date estimates - they are slightly more complex, but it's a good thing that the LNGPac system which is on the Sannox and hundreds of other vessels arrives as a pre-packaged system - the shipyard only has to supply piping from bunker station to the fuel tank, and from gas valve units to the engines, and appropriate ventilation and gas detection systems.

There's plenty of expertise worldwide on LNG systems; just because no UK yard had built a dual-fuel ship doesn't mean the knowledge isn't out there - Ferguson's just attempted to wing the whole project and not seek out appropriate assistance.

As for him saying the Glen Rosa is still on track for September 2025? It won't be, and he's already said off-the-record that the yard is (somehow) running out of money for it........IF they get the small ferries contract, they'll struggle to finish the Rosa off and make headway on the new ships with the resources they have

I think we all know that the resources they have are not the resources that they will have, despite any pronouncements that Swinney and Robison may make. Those votes in Inverclyde don’t buy themselves.

[dxg]

Taffer said:

As for him saying the Glen Rosa is still on track for September 2025? It won't be, and he's already said off-the-record that the yard is (somehow) running out of money for it........IF they get the small ferries contract, they'll struggle to finish the Rosa off and make headway on the new ships with the resources they have

It's a boat-building Ponzi scheme. They'll use the money for the small boats to finish the big boat. Then they'll use the money from ... to finish the small boats.

I mean, it works in construction, so...?

[Olivera]

'Tax rises for the better off' now mooted in the Guardian for this week's Scottish budget.

[e600]

Are the tradesmen involved in building these ferries not red faced with embarrassment. Do any frequent these pages?

The state of the interior in the shots above, lengths of 2x1 used as packing, really. I just couldn’t do it.

[Taffer]

e600 said:

Are the tradesmen involved in building these ferries not red faced with embarrassment. Do any frequent these pages?

The state of the interior in the shots above, lengths of 2x1 used as packing, really. I just couldn’t do it.

You should see the bits downstairs...........

[alangla]

Taffer said:

You should see the bits downstairs...........

That photo from one of the newspapers of the wire brush embedded in the paint was, er, spectacular.

Given the mess this heap is apparently in, are Calmac going to be able to find yards that are willing to bid for overhaul work?

[hidetheelephants]

alangla said:

Taffer said:

You should see the bits downstairs...........

That photo from one of the newspapers of the wire brush embedded in the paint was, er, spectacular.

Given the mess this heap is apparently in, are Calmac going to be able to find yards that are willing to bid for overhaul work?

Work is work; I'm sure Dales will offer a price, as will Cammell Laird, maybe even Buckie if they're still going.

[Leithen]

hidetheelephants said:

alangla said:

Taffer said:

You should see the bits downstairs...........

That photo from one of the newspapers of the wire brush embedded in the paint was, er, spectacular.

Given the mess this heap is apparently in, are Calmac going to be able to find yards that are willing to bid for overhaul work?

Work is work; I'm sure Dales will offer a price, as will Cammell Laird, maybe even Buckie if they're still going.

Almost worth setting up a 'yard to take on the work. Guaranteed income stream for decades. Just need to make sure the right people are engaged as advisors.

[matchmaker]

Leithen said:

hidetheelephants said:

alangla said:

Taffer said:

You should see the bits downstairs...........

That photo from one of the newspapers of the wire brush embedded in the paint was, er, spectacular.

Given the mess this heap is apparently in, are Calmac going to be able to find yards that are willing to bid for overhaul work?

Work is work; I'm sure Dales will offer a price, as will Cammell Laird, maybe even Buckie if they're still going.

Almost worth setting up a 'yard to take on the work. Guaranteed income stream for decades. Just need to make sure the right people are engaged as advisors.

Maybe Dales Voe in Shetland should tender. Ideally placed to deal with Glen Rustbucket as their major function is scrapping redundant marine equipment...

[alangla]

Leithen said:

Almost worth setting up a 'yard to take on the work. Guaranteed income stream for decades. Just need to make sure the right people are engaged as advisors.

Given the number of changes of senior personnel that appear to have occurred over the last few years I doubt anyone actually has a full handle on all the horrors that are lurking in those two hulls. I suspect this might end up being a blank cheque scenario similar to what appears to have happened with Caledonian Isles. They seriously need to start looking at getting more large ships built to a common design and start scrapping some of these moneypits. If stbox and Rustbox don’t perform in service then scrapping them even at a few years old needs to be on the table. Rosa should have been scrapped before it left the slipway and the parts salvaged.