Discussion
Hugo Stiglitz said:
pherlopolus said:
I am completely off coffee, I have a can of Diet Coke mid afternoon. It might be because my dose needs upping I guess. I do notice a tail off mid afternoon (leg jiggles and phone usage)
Dosage as yours will tail off at the 10hr point. Hugo Stiglitz said:
The good thing about Elvanse is its great for weight loss.
I ate a bacon butty at 0800. Rode my mountain bike for 2hrs. Now at 1600hrs I still can't be arsed to eat. I was hungry but didn't see anything that I fancied so left it.
I think it’s different for everyone, hasn’t made a difference for my appetite.I ate a bacon butty at 0800. Rode my mountain bike for 2hrs. Now at 1600hrs I still can't be arsed to eat. I was hungry but didn't see anything that I fancied so left it.
I did try methylphenidate before Elvanse and the only thing it did was kill my appetite.
Hugo Stiglitz said:
The good thing about Elvanse is its great for weight loss.
I ate a bacon butty at 0800. Rode my mountain bike for 2hrs. Now at 1600hrs I still can't be arsed to eat. I was hungry but didn't see anything that I fancied so left it.
Yep Elvanse has done nothing about my appetite, unfortunately.I ate a bacon butty at 0800. Rode my mountain bike for 2hrs. Now at 1600hrs I still can't be arsed to eat. I was hungry but didn't see anything that I fancied so left it.
My wife suggested that I had Adult ADHD. Many of the posts on this thread, I could have wrote myself.
I went to the GP, he referred me to a local place who asked some questions, said I didn't score high enough and instead suggested it was depression and recommended I be put on 100mg of sertraline.
I used to have these intense periods of hyper focus, where for around 2 weeks I would be fixated on a specific topic. It's all I'd think about, it's all I'd want to research on the internet, it's all I'd want to talk about. Being self-employed it had a detrimental impact on my work, as I'd spent time during the day researching, researching and researching, wasting billable hours. Since being on sertraline that's no longer an issue, but the problem is it's numbed almost any interest I have in anything. Things I used to enjoy I just can't be bothered with anymore. I can be pretty snappy, little things can really peeve me off, and sertraline helps with that.
I'm not convinced my issues are caused by depression, and if they are then I've clearly been depressed since I was in primary school, because looking back I can see all the signs. Bright kid when I put my mind to it, but unable to focus. A total lack of interest in anything that didn't peak my interest. As an adult it's the obvious things like not being organised, struggling to focus, perform better at work when I'm under pressure I know a deadline is approaching. Money issues when I was much younger, a lack of interest in what people have to say. I can stand there listening to someone while at the same time going off in my head thinking about something completely different and not at all listening to what the other person is saying.
My wife thinks I should try and get a diagnosis privately, but at 42 I'm not sure what benefit I'd get from a diagnosis. I've already accepted that I likely have it, so I just crack on with life the best I can and find ways to make sure it doesn't have too much of a negative impact on life.
I went to the GP, he referred me to a local place who asked some questions, said I didn't score high enough and instead suggested it was depression and recommended I be put on 100mg of sertraline.
I used to have these intense periods of hyper focus, where for around 2 weeks I would be fixated on a specific topic. It's all I'd think about, it's all I'd want to research on the internet, it's all I'd want to talk about. Being self-employed it had a detrimental impact on my work, as I'd spent time during the day researching, researching and researching, wasting billable hours. Since being on sertraline that's no longer an issue, but the problem is it's numbed almost any interest I have in anything. Things I used to enjoy I just can't be bothered with anymore. I can be pretty snappy, little things can really peeve me off, and sertraline helps with that.
I'm not convinced my issues are caused by depression, and if they are then I've clearly been depressed since I was in primary school, because looking back I can see all the signs. Bright kid when I put my mind to it, but unable to focus. A total lack of interest in anything that didn't peak my interest. As an adult it's the obvious things like not being organised, struggling to focus, perform better at work when I'm under pressure I know a deadline is approaching. Money issues when I was much younger, a lack of interest in what people have to say. I can stand there listening to someone while at the same time going off in my head thinking about something completely different and not at all listening to what the other person is saying.
My wife thinks I should try and get a diagnosis privately, but at 42 I'm not sure what benefit I'd get from a diagnosis. I've already accepted that I likely have it, so I just crack on with life the best I can and find ways to make sure it doesn't have too much of a negative impact on life.
sparkyhx said:
shirt said:
Also estimate I spent 5-6k on various shrinks ahead of the correct diagnosis.
thats way over the top for general guideline- Diagnosis £600-1k ish
- prescriptions and titration another £500 ish - after that you need shared care. If not, then the medication cost will be monthly £100-200
TheBinarySheep said:
My wife thinks I should try and get a diagnosis privately, but at 42 I'm not sure what benefit I'd get from a diagnosis. I've already accepted that I likely have it, so I just crack on with life the best I can and find ways to make sure it doesn't have too much of a negative impact on life.
so you've got symptoms corresponding to depression but can't see a negative impact on your life? i was diagnosed last year aged 41. i do not take any meds for a variety of reasons but concur is the only one available to me and i severely dislike the side effects. i see a psychologist regularly but talk about more general things than just ADD. knowing i have it makes navigating my own head easier.
TheBinarySheep said:
My wife thinks I should try and get a diagnosis privately, but at 42 I'm not sure what benefit I'd get from a diagnosis. I've already accepted that I likely have it, so I just crack on with life the best I can and find ways to make sure it doesn't have too much of a negative impact on life.
Depression can often be brought about by untreated ADHD. I have had spells of it in the past (and possibly at the moment), though never sought medical treatment. It always passed.Because many doctors are unused to diagnosing adult ADHD, many can attribute the symptoms to depression alone, when in fact that itself is a ‘symptom’ or a co-morbidity of the ADHD. This is why elements of the diagnosis involve checking how long the symptoms of ADHD have been present - the answer (for ADHD) needs to be always.
Here’s what I’d suggest…
- get a good book about adult ADHD, have a read, see if it resonates with you. A book, from someone authoritative, is going to much more useful than online forms or online articles in terms of using as a bit of a sense check.
- so perhaps you could then seek a diagnosis privately from someone who is specialised in adult ADHD, should you find from reading a proper book by an authoritative source affirming in terms of your experience.
For the record i was diagnosed at a similar age and it has been transformative.
TheBinarySheep said:
My wife thinks I should try and get a diagnosis privately, but at 42 I'm not sure what benefit I'd get from a diagnosis. I've already accepted that I likely have it, so I just crack on with life the best I can and find ways to make sure it doesn't have too much of a negative impact on life.
I’m only a few years behind you and the diagnosis has helped me understand why I work in certain ways, lean into those and use those as strengths. It’s also helped my wife understand me better and improved our relationship.
Additionally, it helped me in the world of work, understanding what sort of jobs really work for me and avoid tasks that have got me in trouble in the past.
I am a long term reader and lurker on PH but this topic is very relevant to me and I thought I might be useful to share my experience of ADHD.
I have long been a high performer in specific high pressure environment, I am the person who can carry a lot of burden and make life easier for people by putting more on myself. I have always been able to blast 90% of everything and that normally is good enough.
At school I was always bored, unengaged but somehow able to be near or at the top of the class, however I was prone to making simple errors; spelling, mental arithmetic, reading out loud. I was diagnosed with dyslexia and everything attributed to that. I got dispensation for spelling and got given a calculator in exams and that solved everything. From there I was lucky that I somehow picked a degree and following career which interested me and allowed me to excel.
I was also able to ignore my personal life to some degree with a low maintenance partner who was happy to do the things I enjoyed and was passionate about. Drinking, socialising and going places to do whatever I wanted whenever I wanted during my free time and at work always busy, always doing new things, always leading the way.
I got married, got a dog and things started to change for me. I started to feel dread, anxiety much more than I’d ever felt before, I had always been depressive but they came in short periods which went as quickly as they came. This time it didn’t, I was worried about money, the dog changed everything we could do and I started drinking more excessively which compounded the anxiety.
My wife then got pregnant, something we discussed briefly but didn’t fully agree on and from there things got much worse. I entered a deep depression where everything suffered and I through myself into work and ignored everything else.
My son arrived and things got even worse, my wife’s parents were around a lot something which just made my home feel like not my home. I didn’t feel like I could speak to my wife as she didn’t understand and then the inevitable happened where I found someone else. This all then coincided with lockdown in march 2020 where I was then forced into my hell. Being in the house with my wife and son constantly, no escape, no alternative.
Things got even worse from a mental health perspective and I drank more and distanced myself from everyone.
Things came to a head with my wife and she asked me to leave at which point I moved back to my parents and sought help through my GP. I was prescribed with antidepressants. I was lucky that through my work I had access to private mental health support which I got a referral for. I went to 60 hours of therapy over the next 2 years while being on antidepressants. The antidepressants did nothing for me and I switched to others which just numbed me. I did everything the therapist asked and I wasn’t getting any better.
The therapist said that she should have discussed ADHD with me sooner but because of all my other issues we hadn’t really spoken about the small things. She gave me the test to do and I completed it and returned it. She stated she’d never seen a test which had as many indicators as the one I’d returned. At this point she referred me to a psychiatrist. The test I did with the psychologist was used as the basis and the psychatrist endorsed the diagnosis. I stopped the antidepressants and started lisdexanfetamine.
For the last year now my life has been dramatically different. I can focus on everything, small things like paperwork while challenging are no longer paralysing, my mood has stabilised and become more predictable. My relationship with my son has transformed from being nothing to being really good. I’ve moved closer to my wife and son to try and repair the damage I’ve caused. It’s amazing the more you read and experience the more you see how crippling ADHD can become.
I am still untidy and still can only attain 95% of tasks but it’s an improvement and I feel much better for it. I also gave up drinking while on antidepressants and have not restarted. I used to be endlessly tired and exhausted which now I am not, I have energy for the first time I can remember.
I am definitely not cured, but medication has had such a positive effect on my life from what it was before, I still cannot quite believe it.
The diagnosis itself for me feels embarrassing, I do not really like discussing it but at the age of 34 it finally feels like I know myself.
I have long been a high performer in specific high pressure environment, I am the person who can carry a lot of burden and make life easier for people by putting more on myself. I have always been able to blast 90% of everything and that normally is good enough.
At school I was always bored, unengaged but somehow able to be near or at the top of the class, however I was prone to making simple errors; spelling, mental arithmetic, reading out loud. I was diagnosed with dyslexia and everything attributed to that. I got dispensation for spelling and got given a calculator in exams and that solved everything. From there I was lucky that I somehow picked a degree and following career which interested me and allowed me to excel.
I was also able to ignore my personal life to some degree with a low maintenance partner who was happy to do the things I enjoyed and was passionate about. Drinking, socialising and going places to do whatever I wanted whenever I wanted during my free time and at work always busy, always doing new things, always leading the way.
I got married, got a dog and things started to change for me. I started to feel dread, anxiety much more than I’d ever felt before, I had always been depressive but they came in short periods which went as quickly as they came. This time it didn’t, I was worried about money, the dog changed everything we could do and I started drinking more excessively which compounded the anxiety.
My wife then got pregnant, something we discussed briefly but didn’t fully agree on and from there things got much worse. I entered a deep depression where everything suffered and I through myself into work and ignored everything else.
My son arrived and things got even worse, my wife’s parents were around a lot something which just made my home feel like not my home. I didn’t feel like I could speak to my wife as she didn’t understand and then the inevitable happened where I found someone else. This all then coincided with lockdown in march 2020 where I was then forced into my hell. Being in the house with my wife and son constantly, no escape, no alternative.
Things got even worse from a mental health perspective and I drank more and distanced myself from everyone.
Things came to a head with my wife and she asked me to leave at which point I moved back to my parents and sought help through my GP. I was prescribed with antidepressants. I was lucky that through my work I had access to private mental health support which I got a referral for. I went to 60 hours of therapy over the next 2 years while being on antidepressants. The antidepressants did nothing for me and I switched to others which just numbed me. I did everything the therapist asked and I wasn’t getting any better.
The therapist said that she should have discussed ADHD with me sooner but because of all my other issues we hadn’t really spoken about the small things. She gave me the test to do and I completed it and returned it. She stated she’d never seen a test which had as many indicators as the one I’d returned. At this point she referred me to a psychiatrist. The test I did with the psychologist was used as the basis and the psychatrist endorsed the diagnosis. I stopped the antidepressants and started lisdexanfetamine.
For the last year now my life has been dramatically different. I can focus on everything, small things like paperwork while challenging are no longer paralysing, my mood has stabilised and become more predictable. My relationship with my son has transformed from being nothing to being really good. I’ve moved closer to my wife and son to try and repair the damage I’ve caused. It’s amazing the more you read and experience the more you see how crippling ADHD can become.
I am still untidy and still can only attain 95% of tasks but it’s an improvement and I feel much better for it. I also gave up drinking while on antidepressants and have not restarted. I used to be endlessly tired and exhausted which now I am not, I have energy for the first time I can remember.
I am definitely not cured, but medication has had such a positive effect on my life from what it was before, I still cannot quite believe it.
The diagnosis itself for me feels embarrassing, I do not really like discussing it but at the age of 34 it finally feels like I know myself.
jk_88 thanks for posting.
Your last line really resonated with me.
I too do not like talking about it. But I have struggled so hard to get the support I did in my environment at work (also quite high functioning) that I really want the process to be easier for others like me. So I am beginning to work out whether I want or need to talk about it more publicly in order to achieve those aims.
I am very conflicted about that. I have a strong sense that people will or would think lesser of me once they know, or think that I am gaming the system or malingering, or something. Because so many of the traits are things that everyone experiences (albeit mostly from time to time, rather than turned up to 11 and every day) there is still a strong element of stigma and judgment around ADHD, I think. when really all that needs to happen is greater realisation that different people have different strengths/weaknesses.
Your last line really resonated with me.
I too do not like talking about it. But I have struggled so hard to get the support I did in my environment at work (also quite high functioning) that I really want the process to be easier for others like me. So I am beginning to work out whether I want or need to talk about it more publicly in order to achieve those aims.
I am very conflicted about that. I have a strong sense that people will or would think lesser of me once they know, or think that I am gaming the system or malingering, or something. Because so many of the traits are things that everyone experiences (albeit mostly from time to time, rather than turned up to 11 and every day) there is still a strong element of stigma and judgment around ADHD, I think. when really all that needs to happen is greater realisation that different people have different strengths/weaknesses.
I think it's different for everyone. I have never taken Med's despite being diagnosed a few years ago at the age of 49. By that time, I had already ended up doing something I was good at and made up for my inadequacies by surrounding myself with people who were better at admin/time management/execution than I was.
The same was true of my home life - I ended up with a wife who was good at all the things I wasn't so we have ended up being a good team.
With hindsight, I can see many instances in my earlier life where Meds would have made a huge difference - but It is fair to say that my life would have been very different - Who knows if it would have been better or not?
For folks not lucky enough to have the support I enjoyed (or engineered in some cases, ie.e business) then I can understand why Meds might appear to be the best option - but having watched both my kids grow up using them, I can say for certain that they are both more fun, creative and all in all themselves, when not using them.
The same was true of my home life - I ended up with a wife who was good at all the things I wasn't so we have ended up being a good team.
With hindsight, I can see many instances in my earlier life where Meds would have made a huge difference - but It is fair to say that my life would have been very different - Who knows if it would have been better or not?
For folks not lucky enough to have the support I enjoyed (or engineered in some cases, ie.e business) then I can understand why Meds might appear to be the best option - but having watched both my kids grow up using them, I can say for certain that they are both more fun, creative and all in all themselves, when not using them.
jk_88 said:
I am a long term reader and lurker on PH but this topic is very relevant to me and I thought I might be useful to share my experience of ADHD.
.
Thanks for that, great read and a very common experience. You think everyone is having the same problems, but you are just not good enough at life. Then you get a diagnosis a realisation that not everyone is struggling, get meds and bingo you realise what 'normal' is..
jk_88 said:
helpful stuff
Really interesting, thanks for posting. I'm just managed to get an assessment referral from my GP. Luckily I have private healthcare which will apparently cover the cost of the assessment (and expedite it, because I hear the waiting list is very, very long).At this stage, and after having taken antidepressants for more than a decade in total, I'm not entirely sure what I'm expecting from the process or what help if any I should expect, but your post helps.
Animal said:
Really interesting, thanks for posting. I'm just managed to get an assessment referral from my GP. Luckily I have private healthcare which will apparently cover the cost of the assessment (and expedite it, because I hear the waiting list is very, very long).
At this stage, and after having taken antidepressants for more than a decade in total, I'm not entirely sure what I'm expecting from the process or what help if any I should expect, but your post helps.
All I would say is go into it with an open mind. Take time to do the assessment and really think about the questions being asked. The test I did focused on childhood then adulthood which can be something that not everyone can recall that easily.At this stage, and after having taken antidepressants for more than a decade in total, I'm not entirely sure what I'm expecting from the process or what help if any I should expect, but your post helps.
I prior to doing the assessment purposely didn’t research ADHD as I didn’t want to influence my responses, I’m not sure of this was the right or wrong thing to do but it was certainly what I decided.
Regardless of everything else going on around me I feel better and more “normal” now I am taking medication, however it definitely isn’t a magic bullet. The endless procrastination and artificial pressure that I manufactured is something that over 15+ years became too much to cope with when my personal life became more serious (mortgage, wife, dog, child) and is now something which has largely subsided. I know some people manage their whole lives but I couldn’t anymore which led to my 2 years on antidepressants and my self destructive behaviour.
cashmax said:
I think it's different for everyone. I have never taken Med's despite being diagnosed a few years ago at the age of 49. By that time, I had already ended up doing something I was good at and made up for my inadequacies by surrounding myself with people who were better at admin/time management/execution than I was.
The same was true of my home life - I ended up with a wife who was good at all the things I wasn't so we have ended up being a good team.
With hindsight, I can see many instances in my earlier life where Meds would have made a huge difference - but It is fair to say that my life would have been very different - Who knows if it would have been better or not?
For folks not lucky enough to have the support I enjoyed (or engineered in some cases, ie.e business) then I can understand why Meds might appear to be the best option - but having watched both my kids grow up using them, I can say for certain that they are both more fun, creative and all in all themselves, when not using them.
I think this is really key. There are definitely coping mechanisms and having someone who really gets you, knows how to handle you and can be empathetic to who you are, with or without a diagnosis, I can imagine just makes everything, not easier, but more manageable. The same was true of my home life - I ended up with a wife who was good at all the things I wasn't so we have ended up being a good team.
With hindsight, I can see many instances in my earlier life where Meds would have made a huge difference - but It is fair to say that my life would have been very different - Who knows if it would have been better or not?
For folks not lucky enough to have the support I enjoyed (or engineered in some cases, ie.e business) then I can understand why Meds might appear to be the best option - but having watched both my kids grow up using them, I can say for certain that they are both more fun, creative and all in all themselves, when not using them.
I think without Covid and lockdown I’d have made it through it all without ever ending up seeking depression treatment or getting a diagnosis for ADHD. I just always chalked my inattentiveness, inability to do certain things etc as dyslexia which I was diagnosed with as a child, rather than ADHD.
GiantCardboardPlato said:
jk_88 thanks for posting.
Your last line really resonated with me.
I too do not like talking about it. But I have struggled so hard to get the support I did in my environment at work (also quite high functioning) that I really want the process to be easier for others like me. So I am beginning to work out whether I want or need to talk about it more publicly in order to achieve those aims.
I am very conflicted about that. I have a strong sense that people will or would think lesser of me once they know, or think that I am gaming the system or malingering, or something. Because so many of the traits are things that everyone experiences (albeit mostly from time to time, rather than turned up to 11 and every day) there is still a strong element of stigma and judgment around ADHD, I think. when really all that needs to happen is greater realisation that different people have different strengths/weaknesses .
I can relate to what you have written.Your last line really resonated with me.
I too do not like talking about it. But I have struggled so hard to get the support I did in my environment at work (also quite high functioning) that I really want the process to be easier for others like me. So I am beginning to work out whether I want or need to talk about it more publicly in order to achieve those aims.
I am very conflicted about that. I have a strong sense that people will or would think lesser of me once they know, or think that I am gaming the system or malingering, or something. Because so many of the traits are things that everyone experiences (albeit mostly from time to time, rather than turned up to 11 and every day) there is still a strong element of stigma and judgment around ADHD, I think. when really all that needs to happen is greater realisation that different people have different strengths/weaknesses .
When you are (even only slightly) different to the norm, it can be quite difficult for others to understand it, especially if you appear to be a capable individual in many aspects -The difficulties you may have in some areas can appear very odd and incongruous -and assumed by some to be "laziness" or "not trying".
Personally speaking, I'm somebody who appears very capable, versatile and well-rounded (a very low level polymath?) but "focus on demand" and even basic "planning" and "admin" type activities that most fairly average, moderately educated, people manage without difficulty can take a lot of effort and my abilities in those areas are way below my abilities elsewhere.
NB. I'm not the sort of "autistic" (for want of a better choice of word) super-focussed specialist expert either.
I have hinted at these things in the workplace in the past, but would not declare it as a disability/special need, as I don't regard it as such and don't believe that it would help my cause.
Woodrow Wilson said:
I can relate to what you have written.
When you are (even only slightly) different to the norm, it can be quite difficult for others to understand it, especially if you appear to be a capable individual in many aspects -The difficulties you may have in some areas can appear very odd and incongruous -and assumed by some to be "laziness" or "not trying".
Personally speaking, I'm somebody who appears very capable, versatile and well-rounded (a very low level polymath?) but "focus on demand" and even basic "planning" and "admin" type activities that most fairly average, moderately educated, people manage without difficulty can take a lot of effort and my abilities in those areas are way below my abilities elsewhere.
NB. I'm not the sort of "autistic" (for want of a better choice of word) super-focussed specialist expert either.
I have hinted at these things in the workplace in the past, but would not declare it as a disability/special need, as I don't regard it as such and don't believe that it would help my cause.
100% the same. You can quote some nugget of information buried in a government document on the topic being discussed or pull on a raft of detailed statistics, but the life insurance form that I’ve completed, printed and have sitting on my desk staring at me for the last 2 weeks is impossible to put in an envelope with a stamp and drop in a post box. When you are (even only slightly) different to the norm, it can be quite difficult for others to understand it, especially if you appear to be a capable individual in many aspects -The difficulties you may have in some areas can appear very odd and incongruous -and assumed by some to be "laziness" or "not trying".
Personally speaking, I'm somebody who appears very capable, versatile and well-rounded (a very low level polymath?) but "focus on demand" and even basic "planning" and "admin" type activities that most fairly average, moderately educated, people manage without difficulty can take a lot of effort and my abilities in those areas are way below my abilities elsewhere.
NB. I'm not the sort of "autistic" (for want of a better choice of word) super-focussed specialist expert either.
I have hinted at these things in the workplace in the past, but would not declare it as a disability/special need, as I don't regard it as such and don't believe that it would help my cause.
Can write a 10,000 word technical report in 3 days though… the mind boggles.
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