The Official Arsenal - 14 x Cup Winners Thread (Vol 5)
Discussion
leglessAlex said:
How has Mane got away with that? We're treated to endless replays of a ball skimming a defenders hand when it's booted straight at them for a VAR penalty but a clenched fist in the face doesn't even get a check? That's bulls
t.
I think it was because it was his forearm that actually connected and with not much force.t. I thought he'd be off in today's climate though.
I don't really understand why we've been playing out from the back so insistently. Arteta hasn't usually been so risky/stupid, we clearly do not have the ability to that against the likes of Liverpool.
I expected the loss, but I feel like it hurts more seeing the idiotic playing out from the back and the same sideways or backwards passing when we do have the ball. Same mistakes as before, it hurts to watch.
Blades next, hopefully we'll bounce back against them and get a bit of belief back. Then City, Leicester and United, oh christ I hope we have Saliba ready or even better a midfielder or two by then.
I expected the loss, but I feel like it hurts more seeing the idiotic playing out from the back and the same sideways or backwards passing when we do have the ball. Same mistakes as before, it hurts to watch.
Blades next, hopefully we'll bounce back against them and get a bit of belief back. Then City, Leicester and United, oh christ I hope we have Saliba ready or even better a midfielder or two by then.
What really jumped out at me tonight was having that central midfielder who has the ability to take the ball from his central defender or GK on the half turn and drive forward/look forward with purpose. Ceballos started to do this as soon as he came on and we looked a much better team for it. Xhaka and Elneny just don't have the skill or confidence to be able to do that. Ceballos has to start in the PL for me.....every game.
My other worry is of Arteta's use of AMN and Saka. They seem to each be playing several different roles at the minute and whilst the ability to be able to play different positions is useful, we can't be playing players out of position - AMN is not a left sided WB and against the big teams, as we found today you get found out. I can only think Saka will get 90 mins on Thursday, or is carrying a knock, for reasons why he wasn't starting on that left side - the balance would have been so much better.
My other worry is of Arteta's use of AMN and Saka. They seem to each be playing several different roles at the minute and whilst the ability to be able to play different positions is useful, we can't be playing players out of position - AMN is not a left sided WB and against the big teams, as we found today you get found out. I can only think Saka will get 90 mins on Thursday, or is carrying a knock, for reasons why he wasn't starting on that left side - the balance would have been so much better.
Mane, just incredible to watch.
I thought he was gonna punch Klopp's face in when he got subbed off, Mane already punched Tierney so why not go for a second bout.
Liverpool, well they just choked us out, a masterclass for the most part with some silly mistakes.
Our lads, yeah we had grit and great shielding in the middle for the most part but once you have the ball you have to do something with it and that ball from Ceb to 'Yang on the 94th minute is the ball we really needed from the start.
Sorry got to say it but the wage position that Ozil is occupying, for a creative midfielder, is really going to kill us in the big games if he is stuck at home playing Xbox for the rest of the season.
Ceb brings creativity and grit to the midfield, a physicality Ozil does not have, Ceb he really is a good player but we need to have two players like that where we can open up the middle of the park when we need to change it up.
I thought he was gonna punch Klopp's face in when he got subbed off, Mane already punched Tierney so why not go for a second bout.
Liverpool, well they just choked us out, a masterclass for the most part with some silly mistakes.
Our lads, yeah we had grit and great shielding in the middle for the most part but once you have the ball you have to do something with it and that ball from Ceb to 'Yang on the 94th minute is the ball we really needed from the start.
Sorry got to say it but the wage position that Ozil is occupying, for a creative midfielder, is really going to kill us in the big games if he is stuck at home playing Xbox for the rest of the season.
Ceb brings creativity and grit to the midfield, a physicality Ozil does not have, Ceb he really is a good player but we need to have two players like that where we can open up the middle of the park when we need to change it up.
Edited by Carl_Manchester on Monday 28th September 22:56
ChocolateFrog said:
I think it was because it was his forearm that actually connected and with not much force.
I thought he'd be off in today's climate though.
Exactly Gibbs (WBA) got sent off for pushing his hands into James (Everton) face, Mane deliberately raised his arm/elbow/forearm to stop Tierney getting to the ball. I thought he'd be off in today's climate though.
At the risk of sounding like a Ceballos fanboy - he has to start. The midfield is, quite simply, worse without him. I'm not knocking Xhaka as he has been an important player for months now, but if we can get in someone to compliment and partner Ceballos (whoever that may be) then we've got a strong central midfield.
Liverpool looked well up for it last night. Was always going to be hard when they are in that kind of mood and would have been the same for any team in the league. Not many teams will get a sniff there this year. We've got it out of the way early and are 6 from 9. Liverpool are way out in front, and over the course of a season, you'd expect Man City to be 2nd (though they need a signing or two). Everyone else though? fk it, we're there or thereabouts. The next few weeks with all those top 8 sides from last year will be telling.
Liverpool looked well up for it last night. Was always going to be hard when they are in that kind of mood and would have been the same for any team in the league. Not many teams will get a sniff there this year. We've got it out of the way early and are 6 from 9. Liverpool are way out in front, and over the course of a season, you'd expect Man City to be 2nd (though they need a signing or two). Everyone else though? f
k it, we're there or thereabouts. The next few weeks with all those top 8 sides from last year will be telling. Edited by scrubchub on Tuesday 29th September 08:36
Are the refs, VAR and the FA Knobs all from the North and have an aversion to London
The Free kick Newcastle got for that aerial attack on the Spurs player Carroll being just that 'little bit; offside' when in other matches it would have been called down to the last nanomillimetre
Mane doing an audition for WWE
The ManU penalty AFTER the game had finished.. in most other sports the game ends at the whistle
They must have been on their tea break when they missed the Chelsea handball
In a way i am glad we cannot attend most of us would get banned for pitch invasions
RIP football as we knew it
The Free kick Newcastle got for that aerial attack on the Spurs player Carroll being just that 'little bit; offside' when in other matches it would have been called down to the last nanomillimetre
Mane doing an audition for WWE
The ManU penalty AFTER the game had finished.. in most other sports the game ends at the whistle
They must have been on their tea break when they missed the Chelsea handball
In a way i am glad we cannot attend most of us would get banned for pitch invasions
RIP football as we knew it
I'm in two minds about last nights game, so help me out fellow Gooners.
Having watched the Leeds Liverpool game, their strategy was no fear and go at them - rewarded with three goals and possibly could have snuck 1 or 3 points, it was refreshing to watch - but was it a naive strategy, could they have actually been done for 6 if Liverpool had been more on song?
Arsenal, last night, went for the disciplined sit back approach - not as exciting to watch, but was it a better strategy, especially as we usually go for the Leeds approach, all guns blazing and then get stuffed. I really can't decide if I like the park the bus and hit on the counter, or just go for it?
You could argue that Arsenal was more disciplined, stuck in the game and could have come away with 1 point and that Liverpool (after two straight defeats to us) upped their game and absolutely smothered us!
Having watched the Leeds Liverpool game, their strategy was no fear and go at them - rewarded with three goals and possibly could have snuck 1 or 3 points, it was refreshing to watch - but was it a naive strategy, could they have actually been done for 6 if Liverpool had been more on song?
Arsenal, last night, went for the disciplined sit back approach - not as exciting to watch, but was it a better strategy, especially as we usually go for the Leeds approach, all guns blazing and then get stuffed. I really can't decide if I like the park the bus and hit on the counter, or just go for it?
You could argue that Arsenal was more disciplined, stuck in the game and could have come away with 1 point and that Liverpool (after two straight defeats to us) upped their game and absolutely smothered us!
silverfoxcc said:
Are the refs, VAR and the FA Knobs all from the North and have an aversion to London
Does look that way in the last few weeks doesn't it.........The whole VAR thing as well as the anti-football rules is just an utter farce now....and having had to get used to not attending live matches in the last 18 months or so (been twice in last 24 months) even if 'normality' returns I'm not sure I will be bothering to return.
Well that was a painful, sadly predictable watch last night. To add to what has already been said; the midfield needs some serious work. It is a vital link from defence to attack. The attacking players are there but getting little service through the team via midfield. Where is the next Viera/Febragas when you need them. Liverpool again in the EFL cup so lets hope we are on the right end of a 5-5 this time.
RacingPete said:
I'm in two minds about last nights game, so help me out fellow Gooners.
You could argue that Arsenal was more disciplined, stuck in the game and could have come away with 1 point and that Liverpool (after two straight defeats to us) upped their game and absolutely smothered us!
firstly, the liverpool performance was one of the best you’ll see all season. Yes there was a couple of errors from them but they are still in pre-season. You could argue that Arsenal was more disciplined, stuck in the game and could have come away with 1 point and that Liverpool (after two straight defeats to us) upped their game and absolutely smothered us!
My reading is that the Arsenal game plan required winning the ball around the half way line and then bursting through the press by playing a ball over the top or, a killer pass diagonally between the centre back and the wing backs.
Most of the play was going down the wings, right through to the Ceb to ‘Yang ball at the end.
Problem was Arteta did not field anyone that could provide that linkage ball between the rest of the team and the 3 forwards until Ceb came on.
Leeds were slightly different because they were counter pressing Liverpool all over the pitch, not just down the wings and then dinking balls over the top and behind Liverpool.
Leicester against Man City executed the plan that Arsenal needed to execute against Liverpool but the big difference was that Leicester had the players required to provide that linkage ball which gets you over the top of the press and into goal scoring positions.
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