Max Verstappen

Max Verstappen

Author
Discussion

aston80

192 posts

6 months

Friday 23rd April
quotequote all
Sandpit Steve said:
If CLC had ‘gone’ as soon as Max was off the track, Max would have had the same penalty as Kimi (10s stop/go, commuted to 30s race time) if he’d not entered the pit lane and put himself to the back.
If Max went off the track and got overtaken by someone, Max would receive a penalty unless he entered the pit lane??

Wtf?

What's the reason behind this?

Sandpit Steve

2,759 posts

39 months

Friday 23rd April
quotequote all
aston80 said:
Sandpit Steve said:
If CLC had ‘gone’ as soon as Max was off the track, Max would have had the same penalty as Kimi (10s stop/go, commuted to 30s race time) if he’d not entered the pit lane and put himself to the back.
If Max went off the track and got overtaken by someone, Max would receive a penalty unless he entered the pit lane??

Wtf?

What's the reason behind this?
Yes, that’s what happened to Raikkonen. The lap after the red flag is a parade lap rather than a safety car lap, and cars need to either remain in the same order or start from the pit lane.

Kimi judgement: https://www.fia.com/sites/default/files/decision-d...

VladD

7,471 posts

230 months

Friday 23rd April
quotequote all
Sandpit Steve said:
aston80 said:
Sandpit Steve said:
If CLC had ‘gone’ as soon as Max was off the track, Max would have had the same penalty as Kimi (10s stop/go, commuted to 30s race time) if he’d not entered the pit lane and put himself to the back.
If Max went off the track and got overtaken by someone, Max would receive a penalty unless he entered the pit lane??

Wtf?

What's the reason behind this?
Yes, that’s what happened to Raikkonen. The lap after the red flag is a parade lap rather than a safety car lap, and cars need to either remain in the same order or start from the pit lane.

Kimi judgement: https://www.fia.com/sites/default/files/decision-d...
I had to read that a few times to work out WTF was going on. biggrin

95 fiesta si

1,174 posts

117 months

Friday 23rd April
quotequote all
Even if CL passed him when max had a wobble, would of made no difference, the pace Max had he would of breezed passed him anyway like What Lewis did on those 8 cars in the last 10 laps

sparta6

2,538 posts

65 months

Friday 23rd April
quotequote all
Muzzer79 said:
sparta6 said:
HighwayStar said:
kiseca said:
sparta6 said:
Blimey !

Do you really need to be spoon-fed information due to an inability to conduct your own research ?

How old are you ? Serious question.
You made the claim. Back it up or shut up.
If he had the goods to back it up he’d be posting it right here.
He’s got nothing but what’s in his mind.
I assumed this forum was populated by well connected and well read participants. Oh well hehe

For the uninitiated and lazy PH peeps, here's a starter for ten

https://www.grandprix247.com/2017/02/01/montezemol...
Please point out where in that article it supports your following assertation regarding hybrid engines:

sparta6 said:
In this instance Mercedes had a massive head start and other teams were prohibited from catching up.
So you cannot read. Is that what you're saying ?
hehe


“Lauda recently confessed to me that Mercedes were already working [on their hybrid engine] since 2007 and that’s why they so adamant during the negotiations to introduce V6 engines from 2014.”

Muzzer79

4,655 posts

152 months

Friday 23rd April
quotequote all
sparta6 said:
Muzzer79 said:
sparta6 said:
HighwayStar said:
kiseca said:
sparta6 said:
Blimey !

Do you really need to be spoon-fed information due to an inability to conduct your own research ?

How old are you ? Serious question.
You made the claim. Back it up or shut up.
If he had the goods to back it up he’d be posting it right here.
He’s got nothing but what’s in his mind.
I assumed this forum was populated by well connected and well read participants. Oh well hehe

For the uninitiated and lazy PH peeps, here's a starter for ten

https://www.grandprix247.com/2017/02/01/montezemol...
Please point out where in that article it supports your following assertation regarding hybrid engines:

sparta6 said:
In this instance Mercedes had a massive head start and other teams were prohibited from catching up.
So you cannot read. Is that what you're saying ?
hehe


“Lauda recently confessed to me that Mercedes were already working [on their hybrid engine] since 2007 and that’s why they so adamant during the negotiations to introduce V6 engines from 2014.”
I read just fine.

Explain how the other teams were prohibited from doing what Mercedes did or from catching up, as you claim.

Do you need me to draw this in crayons?

Sandpit Steve

2,759 posts

39 months

Friday 23rd April
quotequote all
95 fiesta si said:
Even if CL passed him when max had a wobble, would of made no difference, the pace Max had he would of breezed passed him anyway like What Lewis did on those 8 cars in the last 10 laps
If CL had passed him, Max would have been out of position at the restart and required to start from the pit lane in last place. See Raikkonen judgement for that offence at the same restart.

sparta6

2,538 posts

65 months

Friday 23rd April
quotequote all
Muzzer79 said:
sparta6 said:
Muzzer79 said:
sparta6 said:
HighwayStar said:
kiseca said:
sparta6 said:
Blimey !

Do you really need to be spoon-fed information due to an inability to conduct your own research ?

How old are you ? Serious question.
You made the claim. Back it up or shut up.
If he had the goods to back it up he’d be posting it right here.
He’s got nothing but what’s in his mind.
I assumed this forum was populated by well connected and well read participants. Oh well hehe

For the uninitiated and lazy PH peeps, here's a starter for ten

https://www.grandprix247.com/2017/02/01/montezemol...
Please point out where in that article it supports your following assertation regarding hybrid engines:

sparta6 said:
In this instance Mercedes had a massive head start and other teams were prohibited from catching up.
So you cannot read. Is that what you're saying ?
hehe


“Lauda recently confessed to me that Mercedes were already working [on their hybrid engine] since 2007 and that’s why they so adamant during the negotiations to introduce V6 engines from 2014.”
I read just fine.

Explain how the other teams were prohibited from doing what Mercedes did or from catching up, as you claim.

Do you need me to draw this in crayons?
Spin it any way you like buttercup.
Lauda coughed.

You must've also missed the FIA development freezes and token bullst designed to protect Mercedes advantage.
Toto's agenda for domination was well and truly served up in a frying pan by the FIA.

Todt should walk the plank hehe



Muzzer79

4,655 posts

152 months

Friday 23rd April
quotequote all
sparta6 said:
Spin it any way you like buttercup.
Lauda coughed.

You must've also missed the FIA development freezes and token bullst designed to protect Mercedes advantage.
Toto's agenda for domination was well and truly served up in a frying pan by the FIA.

Todt should walk the plank hehe
Ah, I see - you’re a tin-foil-hat guy. Makes sense.

If what you’re saying is true, perhaps Todt used a small percentage of his techniques from years of protecting Ferrari’s advantage so Schumacher could get his titles.......

Big love. smile


HighwayStar

3,358 posts

109 months

Friday 23rd April
quotequote all
sparta6 said:
Muzzer79 said:
sparta6 said:
HighwayStar said:
kiseca said:
sparta6 said:
Blimey !

Do you really need to be spoon-fed information due to an inability to conduct your own research ?

How old are you ? Serious question.
You made the claim. Back it up or shut up.
If he had the goods to back it up he’d be posting it right here.
He’s got nothing but what’s in his mind.
I assumed this forum was populated by well connected and well read participants. Oh well hehe

For the uninitiated and lazy PH peeps, here's a starter for ten

https://www.grandprix247.com/2017/02/01/montezemol...
Please point out where in that article it supports your following assertation regarding hybrid engines:

sparta6 said:
In this instance Mercedes had a massive head start and other teams were prohibited from catching up.
So you cannot read. Is that what you're saying ?
hehe


“Lauda recently confessed to me that Mercedes were already working [on their hybrid engine] since 2007 and that’s why they so adamant during the negotiations to introduce V6 engines from 2014.”
You totally ignored that Ferrari pushed for the V6. The original plan was for 4cyl engines but Ferrari objected on the grounds that they would not have a 4cyl in their road cars.

https://www.bbc.com/sport/formula1/13878359

As for your FIA stitch up. If Ferrari and Renault had done a better job in the 5yrs they knew Hybrid was coming maybe they would’ve benefited from the token system. It’s 2021 and where are they now? What have they been doing? Oh yes, Ferrari decided cheating was the best option and managed to fk that up too! Honda have been on the scene, a relatively short time and have grasped what Ferrari and Renault haven’t.
Maybe RedBull will get it done now they’ve recruited one of Mercedes top engine men to run their power train operation.





Edited by HighwayStar on Saturday 24th April 08:33

vdn

7,999 posts

168 months

Saturday 24th April
quotequote all
HighwayStar said:
sparta6 said:
Muzzer79 said:
sparta6 said:
HighwayStar said:
kiseca said:
sparta6 said:
Blimey !

Do you really need to be spoon-fed information due to an inability to conduct your own research ?

How old are you ? Serious question.
You made the claim. Back it up or shut up.
If he had the goods to back it up he’d be posting it right here.
He’s got nothing but what’s in his mind.
I assumed this forum was populated by well connected and well read participants. Oh well hehe

For the uninitiated and lazy PH peeps, here's a starter for ten

https://www.grandprix247.com/2017/02/01/montezemol...
Please point out where in that article it supports your following assertation regarding hybrid engines:

sparta6 said:
In this instance Mercedes had a massive head start and other teams were prohibited from catching up.
So you cannot read. Is that what you're saying ?
hehe


“Lauda recently confessed to me that Mercedes were already working [on their hybrid engine] since 2007 and that’s why they so adamant during the negotiations to introduce V6 engines from 2014.”
You totally ignored that Ferrari pushed for the V6. The original plan was for 4cyl engines but Ferrari objected on the grounds that they would not have a 4cyl in their road cars.

https://www.bbc.com/sport/formula1/13878359

As for your FIA stitch up. If Ferrari and Renault had done a better job in the 5yrs they new Hybrid was coming maybe they would’ve benefited from the token system. It’s 2021 and where are they now? What have they been doing? Oh yes, Ferrari decided cheating was the best option and managed to fk that up too! Honda have been on the scene, a relatively short time and have grasped what Ferrari and Renault haven’t.
Maybe RedBull will get it done now they’ve recruited one of Mercedes top engine men to run their power train operation.
hehe

Dismantling Sparta with facts... there's a pattern emerging here!

sparta6

2,538 posts

65 months

Monday 26th April
quotequote all
HighwayStar said:
As for your FIA stitch up. If Ferrari and Renault had done a better job in the 5yrs they knew Hybrid was coming maybe they would’ve benefited from the token system. It’s 2021 and where are they now? What have they been doing? Oh yes, Ferrari decided cheating was the best option and managed to fk that up too! Honda have been on the scene, a relatively short time and have grasped what Ferrari and Renault haven’t.
Maybe RedBull will get it done now they’ve recruited one of Mercedes top engine men to run their power train operation.





Edited by HighwayStar on Saturday 24th April 08:33
7 years development is greater.

Seems pretty clear Lauda knew Mercedes would smash it with their advantage, and subsequent development freezes.


Todt is leaving and cars are now closer at the front. Must be a coincidence.

sparta6

2,538 posts

65 months

Monday 26th April
quotequote all
vdn said:
hehe

Dismantling Sparta with facts... there's a pattern emerging here!
You love me really wink

Gives you something to do hehe

TheDeuce

9,108 posts

31 months

Monday 26th April
quotequote all
HighwayStar said:
You totally ignored that Ferrari pushed for the V6. The original plan was for 4cyl engines but Ferrari objected on the grounds that they would not have a 4cyl in their road cars.

https://www.bbc.com/sport/formula1/13878359

As for your FIA stitch up. If Ferrari and Renault had done a better job in the 5yrs they knew Hybrid was coming maybe they would’ve benefited from the token system. It’s 2021 and where are they now? What have they been doing? Oh yes, Ferrari decided cheating was the best option and managed to fk that up too! Honda have been on the scene, a relatively short time and have grasped what Ferrari and Renault haven’t.
Maybe RedBull will get it done now they’ve recruited one of Mercedes top engine men to run their power train operation.
That's a good point regards Honda being able to leapfrog Renault and Ferrari - it totally undermines the theory that whatever initial advantage Mercedes supposedly had, would somehow be enough to keep them ahead so many years later.

Also neatly outlines just how disappointing Renault have been this era. They were also consulting with F1 regards the hybrid spec years in advance - as a long term and valuable F1 engine supplier themselves their desires in terms of spec would've been no less influencial than Mercedes..

In the end, Mercedes simply did a better job initially, and now honda are indeed proving that it's possible to catch up, maybe even overtake them.. shame on Renault and Ferrari for not being as capable wink

Dermot O'Logical

1,079 posts

94 months

Monday 26th April
quotequote all
TheDeuce said:
HighwayStar said:
You totally ignored that Ferrari pushed for the V6. The original plan was for 4cyl engines but Ferrari objected on the grounds that they would not have a 4cyl in their road cars.

https://www.bbc.com/sport/formula1/13878359

As for your FIA stitch up. If Ferrari and Renault had done a better job in the 5yrs they knew Hybrid was coming maybe they would’ve benefited from the token system. It’s 2021 and where are they now? What have they been doing? Oh yes, Ferrari decided cheating was the best option and managed to fk that up too! Honda have been on the scene, a relatively short time and have grasped what Ferrari and Renault haven’t.
Maybe RedBull will get it done now they’ve recruited one of Mercedes top engine men to run their power train operation.
That's a good point regards Honda being able to leapfrog Renault and Ferrari - it totally undermines the theory that whatever initial advantage Mercedes supposedly had, would somehow be enough to keep them ahead so many years later.

Also neatly outlines just how disappointing Renault have been this era. They were also consulting with F1 regards the hybrid spec years in advance - as a long term and valuable F1 engine supplier themselves their desires in terms of spec would've been no less influencial than Mercedes..

In the end, Mercedes simply did a better job initially, and now honda are indeed proving that it's possible to catch up, maybe even overtake them.. shame on Renault and Ferrari for not being as capable wink
Renault dispensed with many of their key engineers on economic grounds during the 2.4l V8 era, when they were dominating F1 with Red Bull, thereby tying one hand behind their own back when the time came to develop the V6 Turbo-Hybrid power unit. It was thought at one stage that Carlos Ghosn, the man holding the purse strings, and a notorious cost-cutter, might veto further investment in Formula 1 when the new regulations came into force in 2014.

Whatever happened to Carlos Ghosn?

vaud

40,122 posts

120 months

Monday 26th April
quotequote all
Dermot O'Logical said:
Whatever happened to Carlos Ghosn?
Something something double bass case something something living in Beirut.

Now that would make a good film.

TheDeuce

9,108 posts

31 months

Monday 26th April
quotequote all
I'd say that Renault's budget is a great example of how not spending enough on something ensures that any money that is spent, is entirely wasted.

Maybe someone else has a different way of viewing the marketing value for Renault, but for the life of me I can't see how it's good for their brand to get soundly beaten by other teams that spend less, or in the case of McLaren, beaten with their own engine... Also all the reliability issues, the awkwardness of having no PU customers.. basically slow, unreliable and unpopular - these are not desirable words to associate with a car brand.

Munter

30,470 posts

206 months

Monday 26th April
quotequote all
TheDeuce said:
basically slow, unreliable and unpopular - these are not desirable words to associate with a car brand.
Well...it is totally on brand for Renault though.

TheDeuce

9,108 posts

31 months

Monday 26th April
quotequote all
Munter said:
Well...it is totally on brand for Renault though.
rofl

Dermot O'Logical

1,079 posts

94 months

Tuesday 27th April
quotequote all
vaud said:
Dermot O'Logical said:
Whatever happened to Carlos Ghosn?
Something something double bass case something something living in Beirut.

Now that would make a good film.
Ghosn with the Wind.

Inconvenient in a confined space, one imagines.