Dan Ticktum Can't Test - Boohoo or suck it up sunshine?

Dan Ticktum Can't Test - Boohoo or suck it up sunshine?

Author
Discussion

Vaud

42,436 posts

127 months

Tuesday 14th August 2018
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coppice said:
The reek of a lynch mob , nothing like an attack of self righteous outrage . But here's the thing - plenty of racing drivers have misbehaved in the past,and some of them have gone on to great things. Young men do daft things - let him who is without sin and all that....
I think he should be allowed to race again. He is in effect still serving his punishment, which I still think was a tad lenient, but that said, when he does qualify for testing I will be interested in the results.

Blatter

747 posts

163 months

Tuesday 14th August 2018
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The article said that it was a two year ban, with the second year suspended. My understanding of a suspended sentence is that it you commit a further "transgression", then the suspended part of the sentence is imposed.

I imagine that will keep him on the straight and narrow.

Kraken

1,710 posts

172 months

Tuesday 14th August 2018
quotequote all
There's misbehaving and misbehaving. Disregarding that amount of yellow flags (single and double), white flags, SC boards and overtaking most of the field to catch and deliberately drive into another competitor is something that I have never heard of anyone doing anything remotely like.

I totally understand an attack of the red mist. I've been there plenty of times in racing but I can't get my head around anyone in a race car being that angry that they could pass that many warning flags and other competitors without calming down enough to realise they were terribly in the wrong.

Smitters

Original Poster:

3,587 posts

129 months

Wednesday 15th August 2018
quotequote all
coppice said:
The reek of a lynch mob , nothing like an attack of self righteous outrage . But here's the thing - plenty of racing drivers have misbehaved in the past,and some of them have gone on to great things. Young men do daft things - let him who is without sin and all that....
Let him who is without sin is a great point...

I guess I was interested in views on whether having broken the rules, and been punished, he should be given special consideration because RB want him testing and, because of the nature of his punishment, he doesn't (yet) qualify. To me, that's the ongoing part of the punishment.

Do I have a problem with him testing, driving, racing? No. But only when he has the requisite experience on his licence and not just because Christian Horner wants him to and will pull some strings.

thegreenhell

9,855 posts

191 months

Monday 15th October 2018
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Oh well, he's failed to win the F3 title so he still doesn't have enough points to be allowed in an F1 car next year.

Smitters

Original Poster:

3,587 posts

129 months

Monday 15th October 2018
quotequote all
thegreenhell said:
Oh well, he's failed to win the F3 title so he still doesn't have enough points to be allowed in an F1 car next year.
I'm still assuming there fill be string pulling and he'll get some seat time. And it'll piss me off.

Vaud

42,436 posts

127 months

Monday 15th October 2018
quotequote all
Smitters said:
I'm still assuming there fill be string pulling and he'll get some seat time. And it'll piss me off.
I doubt it, I think his brand is a bit toxic to pull the "exceptional circumstances" trick.

turbomoped

2,608 posts

55 months

Monday 15th October 2018
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Had no opinion on him either way but after trying to watch f3 coverage on the youtube channel it seems every other word is ticktum regardless of whats on the tv screen.
There is obviously a giant push to turn the world ticktum by red bull although it could end up being a sort of aversion therapy where stress is induces on hearing the name and I could only be bothered to watch one of the three races.

Smitters

Original Poster:

3,587 posts

129 months

Monday 15th October 2018
quotequote all
Vaud said:
I doubt it, I think his brand is a bit toxic to pull the "exceptional circumstances" trick.
Hope you're right.

telecat

8,525 posts

213 months

Monday 15th October 2018
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Smitters said:
Vaud said:
I doubt it, I think his brand is a bit toxic to pull the "exceptional circumstances" trick.
Hope you're right.
I was not happy about the title winners move in the first race trying to push Ticktum into the wall. Shades of his dads move on Barrichello a little while back. And done when he knew he would have to come in because of damage.

anonymous-user

26 months

Monday 15th October 2018
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telecat said:
Smitters said:
Vaud said:
I doubt it, I think his brand is a bit toxic to pull the "exceptional circumstances" trick.
Hope you're right.
I was not happy about the title winners move in the first race trying to push Ticktum into the wall. Shades of his dads move on Barrichello a little while back. And done when he knew he would have to come in because of damage.
Knowing Ticktum’s history it may have been a preemptive strike thing?

Norfolkit

2,391 posts

162 months

Monday 15th October 2018
quotequote all
telecat said:
Smitters said:
Vaud said:
I doubt it, I think his brand is a bit toxic to pull the "exceptional circumstances" trick.
Hope you're right.
I was not happy about the title winners move in the first race trying to push Ticktum into the wall. Shades of his dads move on Barrichello a little while back. And done when he knew he would have to come in because of damage.
Not a conspiracy theorist but there was a remarkable upturn in Schumy Jnr's form from mid season onwards, strangely his team mate (one of them anyway) had the same thing happen to him.


JonChalk

4,899 posts

82 months

Monday 15th October 2018
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Here's my summary:

  • Young racing driver does stupid thing
  • Serves punishment quietly, accepting it without moaning about it
  • Learns from punishment
  • Serves suspended part of punishment without a hint of issues
  • Continues to improve after suspended sentence period ends
  • Continues to get support from Red Bull, and on F1 radar
  • Does a pretty good job fighting son of famous racing driver who is equally (if not better) supported
  • Doesn't really talk about F1 in public too much
  • Young racing driver doesn't have enough superlicense points to test or race in F1
  • Whiny F1 boss talks about it a lot and makes a huge issue of it, even though young racing driver hasn't really talked about it.
To my mind Ticktum has worked through his issues, served his punishment, retains the support of Marko and (now) has done little for anyone to suggest he is "toxic" or not deserving.

His comments about Schumacher's "uptick" in performance are no worse (or better) than the permanent inter-team squabbling in F1 about performance thinly disguised as cheating.

Vaud

42,436 posts

127 months

Monday 15th October 2018
quotequote all
JonChalk said:
To my mind Ticktum has worked through his issues, served his punishment, retains the support of Marko and (now) has done little for anyone to suggest he is "toxic" or not deserving.
I don't deny his talents.

However, I think he is toxic for sponsors in a a modern Youtube era. Things that would have been forgotten in a pre-digital era are trickier these days. Brands look for sentiment analysis, etc when considering investments and if the first video hit is very negative then it's an uphill struggle.

If you are a brand looking to invest do you see son of Schumacher (a mixed brand but 7x WDC) or a risk with Ticktum?

I wonder what his punishment would have been for his actions in an F1 car. A one year ban would have been the starting point.

JonChalk

4,899 posts

82 months

Monday 15th October 2018
quotequote all
Vaud said:
I don't deny his talents.

However, I think he is toxic for sponsors in a a modern Youtube era. Things that would have been forgotten in a pre-digital era are trickier these days. Brands look for sentiment analysis, etc when considering investments and if the first video hit is very negative then it's an uphill struggle.

If you are a brand looking to invest do you see son of Schumacher (a mixed brand but 7x WDC) or a risk with Ticktum?

I wonder what his punishment would have been for his actions in an F1 car. A one year ban would have been the starting point.
Your point is valid; in the eyes of some people, he would be considered less "worthy" or of less "value" relatively, than say Mick Schumacher.

But I believe he (Ticktum) knows and accepts that his fate - other seem less capable of letting it go.

coppice

6,961 posts

116 months

Tuesday 16th October 2018
quotequote all
Vaud said:
However, I think he is toxic for sponsors in a a modern Youtube era. Things that would have been forgotten in a pre-digital era are trickier these days. Brands look for sentiment analysis, etc when considering investments and if the first video hit is very negative then it's an uphill struggle.

.
Perfect summary of the reason so much has been lost in motor sport. I liked things rather more when we had drivers and not bloody 'brands' . I think the only people who really think sponsorship is 'investment ' are those who have spent too much time with the Ron Dennises of the world.


BaronVonVaderham

2,116 posts

119 months

Tuesday 16th October 2018
quotequote all
Kraken said:
There's misbehaving and misbehaving. Disregarding that amount of yellow flags (single and double), white flags, SC boards and overtaking most of the field to catch and deliberately drive into another competitor is something that I have never heard of anyone doing anything remotely like.

I totally understand an attack of the red mist. I've been there plenty of times in racing but I can't get my head around anyone in a race car being that angry that they could pass that many warning flags and other competitors without calming down enough to realise they were terribly in the wrong.
Exactly why he should’ve been given a lifetime ban for such a severe incident.

Vaud

42,436 posts

127 months

Tuesday 16th October 2018
quotequote all
coppice said:
Perfect summary of the reason so much has been lost in motor sport. I liked things rather more when we had drivers and not bloody 'brands' . I think the only people who really think sponsorship is 'investment ' are those who have spent too much time with the Ron Dennises of the world.
I disagree. Brands invest into someone like Lewis Hamilton because they think the attachment of his image will drive sales, either directly or indirectly. It is hard to measure, but they have a LOT of sales and marketing data points to allow them to measure impact of specific campaigns.

We've had it for so long now, and the costs are so high that we can't put the genie back in the bottle.

Durzel

10,678 posts

140 months

Tuesday 16th October 2018
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Tough st. Actions have consequences.

He's not been banned from ever participating in F1, he's just not qualified for it this year.

coppice

6,961 posts

116 months

Tuesday 16th October 2018
quotequote all
But it's all utter bks really - outside the massively over exposed F1 hardly anybody , except hard core enthusiasts, now little and cares even less about lower formulae. And as we don't kill or maim drivers much in F1any more, we have a very low turnover , as well as thinner grids.

The irony is that Billy monger gets more coverage than the rest of F3 combined , if not in the way anybody would have wished