Sainz to McLaren

[Norfolkit]

rallycross said:

Norfolkit said:

But why do yo think he's a very underrated diver?
Genuinely interested why because I just can't see it.

Looks like most people on this thread think the same and I am surprised by that - he’s proved how quick he was alongside Max V - and he has had far less incidents than Max: redbull is a strange set up that typically favours one driver (both teams) and I would bet that Carlos in an equal set up would be right there with Max in equal cars, what better benchmark than MV?

I don't doubt Red Bull saw Max as a demigod in 2015 (and still do) but I suspect they probably got equal equipment, I don't think they would have deliberately hobbled Sainz. I don't doubt Sainz has speed (he did out qualify Max over 2015, just, but he still did it) but the race results don't lie (Sainz did have the worst of the reliabilty but enough to explain the difference?). Red Bull favouritism wouldn't explain why he's well behind Hulkenberg either. Sainz has only beaten one F1 team mate, Kvyat, and that was the post demotion Kvyat and that was almost a blood sport.

I hope for Mclaren's sake he proves you right and me wrong

[rallycross]

Norfolkit said:

Red Bull favouritism wouldn't explain why he's well behind Hulkenberg either. Sainz has only beaten one F1 team mate, Kvyat, and that was the post demotion Kvyat and that was almost a blood sport.

I hope for Mclaren's sake he proves you right and me wrong

I hope he does well but if he does it will be in-spite of the shambles that McLaren are now.
Hulkenberg is another of the current great F1 talents stuck in a below average car - Brazil pole, Le Man win, often top of the times in wet/rainy conditions. F1 sadly is all about the best car.

[rdjohn]

rallycross said:

Carlos Jnr is a very underrated driver, its a shame to see him get manouvered out / into McLaren, his talents are far better than their current shambles set up deserves, let hope they start getting back on form it would be a shame if his career fades due to ending up there.

Carlos has now been passed over by two top teams with a big budget - RB and Renault. That must be a huge dent for his future prospects. These people have all the data they need to make the right decision.

If he does not look really good against Vandoorne, he will be toast.

[Kraken]

rallycross said:

I hope he does well but if he does it will be in-spite of the shambles that McLaren are now.
Hulkenberg is another of the current great F1 talents stuck in a below average car - Brazil pole, Le Man win, often top of the times in wet/rainy conditions. F1 sadly is all about the best car.

Very little motorsport is about the best driver. It's either the best car or, in the case of one make/spec series, the best team/engineers.

[Jasandjules]

He now has to beat Stoffel by quite a margin to see his stock rise.

[Supersam83]

Thread bump as just wanted to know how everyone feels now that Carlos Sainz Jr got his 1st podium last weekend?

Generally targeted to at least be best of the rest (P7) in each GP and P7 in the world championship.

He's done that 9 times in 20 races this season.

Also he is in P7 in the championship as well.

What does everyone think of him now?

[Jasandjules]

Same as before. He seems like a talented peddler.

[slipstream 1985]

I like him but then that's how he comes across as well. I also really like Landow and see him as my next supporter when Lewis leaves. However I think his career is a Perez style top midfield unless Mclaren suddenly develop a championship winning car for him he won't be moved to an on form team.

[Steamer]

Also - Considering how young their driver line up & development drivers - it is fantastic to see.

They must have one of the youngest line-ups on the grid.

Norris is doing great too - but needs to start putting is foot down slightly to some of the banter he is receiving from the likes of Max (I know its only friendly messing about, but I think he needs to flex his muscles a bit now).

[SturdyHSV]

Steamer said:

Norris is doing great too - but needs to start putting is foot down slightly to some of the banter he is receiving from the likes of Max (I know its only friendly messing about, but I think he needs to flex his muscles a bit now).

Norris and Max regularly race online together as they're part of the same team in iRacing, there's plenty of banter in both directions

[37chevy]

Steamer said:

Norris is doing great too - but needs to start putting is foot down slightly to some of the banter he is receiving from the likes of Max (I know its only friendly messing about, but I think he needs to flex his muscles a bit now).

This.

Sainz has been the surprise of the year for me, I was expecting Norris to cause him real trouble but Carlos has really stepped up this year.

Norris has had his fair share of bad luck too in races like spa so the points table doesn’t reflect the situation completely but I do agree while Norris has a great attitude that is refreshing he needs to toughen up a bit...but that will come with age...he’s gone about his rookie season in the right way I think...just needs to push on next year

[anonymous-user]

Sainz has done pretty well but I am still to be convinced with either driver at McLaren. Both work well with each other but it's all too nice IMO.

At best I would say both would make good number two drivers in a team but will never be a Hamilton, Verstappen or Ricciardo.

But the McLaren is a much better package which really does help. Mercedes engines could be even better but you just don't know with McLaren now.

[dunc_sx]

While on the subject of Norris, I was surprised to hear him beating up on himself for being too slow

4:08 into this vid

https://youtu.be/iJGthZJZ3Ho

Dunc.

[rallycross]

Supersam83 said:

Thread bump as just wanted to know how everyone feels now that Carlos Sainz Jr got his 1st podium last weekend?


What does everyone think of him now?

Same as before which was not a popular view a year ago glad to see McLaren gave him a decent go at showing his talent, both drivers have done well this year.

[utgjon]

ELUSIVEJIM said:

Sainz has done pretty well but I am still to be convinced with either driver at McLaren. Both work well with each other but it's all too nice IMO.

At best I would say both would make good number two drivers in a team but will never be a Hamilton, Verstappen or Ricciardo.

But the McLaren is a much better package which really does help. Mercedes engines could be even better but you just don't know with McLaren now.

McLaren have come on leaps and bounds this year, and I have no doubt that this is due to the departure of Alonso and the formation of the Sainz/Norris partnership. They appear to have a very good dynamic, and it's allowed Sainz to really take on a leadership role within the team.

Consequently, it's led me to believe that Sainz really is WDC material, and if they can continue to build as a team, we might see McLaren at the front again soon.

[DaveTheRave87]

utgjon said:

McLaren have come on leaps and bounds this year, and I have no doubt that this is due to the departure of Alonso and the formation of the Sainz/Norris partnership. They appear to have a very good dynamic, and it's allowed Sainz to really take on a leadership role within the team.

Consequently, it's led me to believe that Sainz really is WDC material, and if they can continue to build as a team, we might see McLaren at the front again soon.

Really? He's driving well this season and I can see him winning races in the future but I can't see him winning titles. I can see him being a long-term solid number 2 driver, a bit like Felipe Massa or Mark Webber.

[DanielSan]

DaveTheRave87 said:

Really? He's driving well this season and I can see him winning races in the future but I can't see him winning titles. I can see him being a long-term solid number 2 driver, a bit like Felipe Massa or Mark Webber.

Most consistent driver this season bar Hamilton, doesn't make mistakes really and rare is it that he doesn't finish higher than where he starts. He'd be a lot closer to Hamilton than Bottas is this season

[TheDeuce]

DanielSan said:

DaveTheRave87 said:

Really? He's driving well this season and I can see him winning races in the future but I can't see him winning titles. I can see him being a long-term solid number 2 driver, a bit like Felipe Massa or Mark Webber.

Most consistent driver this season bar Hamilton, doesn't make mistakes really and rare is it that he doesn't finish higher than where he starts. He'd be a lot closer to Hamilton than Bottas is this season

I tend to agree with some of that thinking. One big caveat though is that we can never know how a driver will get on in a top car until they drive one in a race. However, I do fundamentally agree that he's done as well this season as possible really, so would be worth a shot.

More than anything though I'd like him to stay at McLaren and for them to develop back to being a top team themselves... Plenty of good progress so far in that direction. Certainly managed to embarrass their PU supplying team this season!