"Sebastian Vettel a 'massively overrated one-trick pony"
Discussion
Eddie Irvine sticking the boot into Vettel, plus his opinion Lewis and unsurprising praise of Schumi.
He also has interesting views on the current state of F1... One being that manufacturers shouldn't be allowed to be team owners, only engine suppliers. I quite like the idea of that.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/46927041
He also has interesting views on the current state of F1... One being that manufacturers shouldn't be allowed to be team owners, only engine suppliers. I quite like the idea of that.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/46927041
Irrelevant driver in clickbaity interview non-shocker.
He says "He's got the best car, there are more races and the competition is debateable" in relation to Hamilton. Could the same not have mostly been said in MSC's era also? He also has no problem saying his piece despite admitting "I don't watch it anymore because it bores me".
I'm not the biggest or even the smallest fan of Vettel, but you don't just win 4 titles on the bounce by luck. His racecraft hasn't seemed as good as Ham's lately but he has had a number of good drives throughout his career.
Anyway - I'm not posting this to defend Seb, more to ask why are we even bothered by what an ex racer with minimal success, in one of the best teams of the time, who isn't present or even watches the sport any more - has to say? Just off season filler?
He says "He's got the best car, there are more races and the competition is debateable" in relation to Hamilton. Could the same not have mostly been said in MSC's era also? He also has no problem saying his piece despite admitting "I don't watch it anymore because it bores me".
I'm not the biggest or even the smallest fan of Vettel, but you don't just win 4 titles on the bounce by luck. His racecraft hasn't seemed as good as Ham's lately but he has had a number of good drives throughout his career.
Anyway - I'm not posting this to defend Seb, more to ask why are we even bothered by what an ex racer with minimal success, in one of the best teams of the time, who isn't present or even watches the sport any more - has to say? Just off season filler?
I don't think anyone would dispute that Vettel is not in the same class as Schumacher or Hamilton, particularly in wheel-to wheel racing, and his temperament under pressure is clearly suspect, but calling him a 'one trick pony' is ridiculous.
He showed prodigious speed in the BMW Sauber, and was often quicker than their race drivers. He won a Grand Prix in a Toro Rosso in the wet. He has comfortably beaten every team-mate he has ever faced, with the sole exception of Riccardo. He won four championships in the Red Bull by adapting his driving style to Newey's blown diffuser. His CV is rather stronger than Irvine's...
He showed prodigious speed in the BMW Sauber, and was often quicker than their race drivers. He won a Grand Prix in a Toro Rosso in the wet. He has comfortably beaten every team-mate he has ever faced, with the sole exception of Riccardo. He won four championships in the Red Bull by adapting his driving style to Newey's blown diffuser. His CV is rather stronger than Irvine's...
Andy S15 said:
Anyway - I'm not posting this to defend Seb, more to ask why are we even bothered by what an ex racer with minimal success, in one of the best teams of the time, who isn't present or even watches the sport any more - has to say? Just off season filler?
Sadly Irvine sounds like Villeneuve...
te. 
HighwayStar said:
Irvine always struck me as someone with no really love of F1... like Villeneurve, saying controversial stuff and liking the sound of his own voice, getting a little attention along the way. Never generally a driver that held my attention when he spoke.
they come across more as having a massive chip to me.Teddy Lop said:
HighwayStar said:
Irvine always struck me as someone with no really love of F1... like Villeneurve, saying controversial stuff and liking the sound of his own voice, getting a little attention along the way. Never generally a driver that held my attention when he spoke.
they come across more as having a massive chip to me.HighwayStar said:
He also has interesting views on the current state of F1... One being that manufacturers shouldn't be allowed to be team owners, only engine suppliers. I quite like the idea of that.
Define a manufacturer and define a team owner.Are Ferarri a manufacturer owned team? Officially Ferrari S. p. A. (the car company) has nothing to do with Scuderia Ferrari (the F1 team), so not a manufacturer owned team - but they are both owned by Fiat, who are a manufacturer.
If we say the Mercedes F1 team are a manufacturer (unsure of business structure) if they set up a new company called Scuderia Mercedes, which happens to be owned by the Mercedes car company are they no longer a manufacturer? Or if Scuderia Mercedes is owned by Mercedes Shell Company 1, which is owned by Mercedes Shell Company 2, which is owned by....which is owned by the Mercedes car company?
Ferrari isn't owned by Fiat anymore. They were separated off a few years ago to enable the company to be floated on the NYSE, and as part of this restructuring most of the Fiat shareholders became Ferrari shareholders directly, rather than through Fiat. I think this same restructuring was why Maserati was moved under Alfa Romeo's control, because Ferrari is no longer part of the same group, although it obviously remains very closely related.
Edited by thegreenhell on Thursday 24th January 14:47
I used to run an F1 fanzine, back in the old days. I did mock interviews with the great and the not so good in the sport.
One time I supposedly went to the Ferrari motor home at Silverstone and spoke with Ferrari management, asking to speak with Irvine. No one there knew who he was. I used the nickname Fast Eddy, and again no one knew who he was. I then said he was the bloke in the second car. The team manager then asked someone else, 'Do we run a second car?'
I expected a lot of criticism from my regulars but almost all the mail I got was about other entries. I had one have a moan and use as evidence someone saying that the only person on the grid faster that Irvine was Schumacher. She did not quote the source.
One time I supposedly went to the Ferrari motor home at Silverstone and spoke with Ferrari management, asking to speak with Irvine. No one there knew who he was. I used the nickname Fast Eddy, and again no one knew who he was. I then said he was the bloke in the second car. The team manager then asked someone else, 'Do we run a second car?'
I expected a lot of criticism from my regulars but almost all the mail I got was about other entries. I had one have a moan and use as evidence someone saying that the only person on the grid faster that Irvine was Schumacher. She did not quote the source.
By coincedence last week I looked at an F1 racing mag from just after they season eddie didn't win the title due
to a feeble effort in the last race.
Journalist (proper paid ones in those days) summed him up as a driver of racing cars not a racing driver.
Always thought he was a tool as he spent more time boasting about his investments and going to discos.
I think Rosberg showed Shumi was not that great and it was more a collective effort of the craftiest people in f1 at the time that helped him to 7 wc.
to a feeble effort in the last race.
Journalist (proper paid ones in those days) summed him up as a driver of racing cars not a racing driver.
Always thought he was a tool as he spent more time boasting about his investments and going to discos.
I think Rosberg showed Shumi was not that great and it was more a collective effort of the craftiest people in f1 at the time that helped him to 7 wc.
I liked Irvine - awkward bugger that he undoubtedly was . He wasn't one for corporate speak , was a more than competent F1 driver and- laudably - was quite happy to admit that Schumacher was a better driver by far . Something most of Schumacher's team mates were in perpetual denial about - 'infamy , infamy , they've all got it infamy' ....
Fundoreen said:
By coincedence last week I looked at an F1 racing mag from just after they season eddie didn't win the title due
to a feeble effort in the last race.
Journalist (proper paid ones in those days) summed him up as a driver of racing cars not a racing driver.
Always thought he was a tool as he spent more time boasting about his investments and going to discos.
I think Rosberg showed Shumi was not that great and it was more a collective effort of the craftiest people in f1 at the time that helped him to 7 wc.
Sorry, I have to call that out as rubbish.to a feeble effort in the last race.
Journalist (proper paid ones in those days) summed him up as a driver of racing cars not a racing driver.
Always thought he was a tool as he spent more time boasting about his investments and going to discos.
I think Rosberg showed Shumi was not that great and it was more a collective effort of the craftiest people in f1 at the time that helped him to 7 wc.
I loathed the man when he was driving in his main period in F1 - how could a man 'play' so dirty when he clearly didn't need to? Why did Ferrari treat us all like idiots claiming they weren't being underhand when it was there for us all to see?
But Hungary 1998 was proof of his genius and one Nico Rosberg could never come close to emulating. 20 laps to pull a 19 second margin to switch to a 3 stop race and take the win from a lightning fast Mclaren steam rollering the field. Schumacher just said 'Okay' to Ross Brawn and he did it.
Schumacher had been out the sport for considerable time when he joined Mercedes and the cars had gone through at least two major changes and were nothing like the one he last drove. Plus the guy retired because he knew he'd peaked. He was never going to come back and find his old form. To claim Rosberg showed how average he was and his titles were down to nothing but the best cars, the best people and underhand tactics is so blinkered and deliberately ignoring the context above of the circumstances of his time at Mercedes.
I need no excuse to sneer about Schumacher's character and dislike him, but that statement is factually incorrect and like or loathe him, I doubt there are many in here who would dispute that. Surely?
spunkytherabbit said:
Sorry, I have to call that out as rubbish.
I loathed the man when he was driving in his main period in F1 - how could a man 'play' so dirty when he clearly didn't need to? Why did Ferrari treat us all like idiots claiming they weren't being underhand when it was there for us all to see?
But Hungary 1998 was proof of his genius and one Nico Rosberg could never come close to emulating. 20 laps to pull a 19 second margin to switch to a 3 stop race and take the win from a lightning fast Mclaren steam rollering the field. Schumacher just said 'Okay' to Ross Brawn and he did it.
Schumacher had been out the sport for considerable time when he joined Mercedes and the cars had gone through at least two major changes and were nothing like the one he last drove. Plus the guy retired because he knew he'd peaked. He was never going to come back and find his old form. To claim Rosberg showed how average he was and his titles were down to nothing but the best cars, the best people and underhand tactics is so blinkered and deliberately ignoring the context above of the circumstances of his time at Mercedes.
I need no excuse to sneer about Schumacher's character and dislike him, but that statement is factually incorrect and like or loathe him, I doubt there are many in here who would dispute that. Surely?
I agree. Michael was definitely past his peak on his return and Nico close to his peak, as well as having more experience in that era of car.I loathed the man when he was driving in his main period in F1 - how could a man 'play' so dirty when he clearly didn't need to? Why did Ferrari treat us all like idiots claiming they weren't being underhand when it was there for us all to see?
But Hungary 1998 was proof of his genius and one Nico Rosberg could never come close to emulating. 20 laps to pull a 19 second margin to switch to a 3 stop race and take the win from a lightning fast Mclaren steam rollering the field. Schumacher just said 'Okay' to Ross Brawn and he did it.
Schumacher had been out the sport for considerable time when he joined Mercedes and the cars had gone through at least two major changes and were nothing like the one he last drove. Plus the guy retired because he knew he'd peaked. He was never going to come back and find his old form. To claim Rosberg showed how average he was and his titles were down to nothing but the best cars, the best people and underhand tactics is so blinkered and deliberately ignoring the context above of the circumstances of his time at Mercedes.
I need no excuse to sneer about Schumacher's character and dislike him, but that statement is factually incorrect and like or loathe him, I doubt there are many in here who would dispute that. Surely?
Nico is/was a very good driver, but on a career not comparable to Michael/Lewis.
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