Official Italian Grand Prix Thread ***SPOILERS***

Official Italian Grand Prix Thread ***SPOILERS***

Author
Discussion

TheDeuce

2,797 posts

11 months

Friday 6th September
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Hungrymc said:
Deesee said:
Well it’s quite probably PU4, or PU3+, the days of works teams running preferred PU were over a few years back.. & this is not a marketing exercise, it can run the quali mode in the race (finally) and that mode is not available to the customer teams which have the same labelled PU..
I assume that the works team just didn’t take the PU3 upgrade that was available to everyone? Won’t that be the argument that they elected to wait for the next revision but the customer teams didn’t?

Of course, if the customer teams were fully informed of the timing of PU3+ is another question and could be dodgy?
Or perhaps the customer teams were motivated to make certain timing decisions by factors they thought it was best to go along with... Who knows what goes on behind the scenes? I'm sure it's possible to undermine the rules without actually breaking them, as ever in F1..

Deesee

2,756 posts

28 months

Friday 6th September
quotequote all
TheDeuce said:
Hungrymc said:
Deesee said:
Well it’s quite probably PU4, or PU3+, the days of works teams running preferred PU were over a few years back.. & this is not a marketing exercise, it can run the quali mode in the race (finally) and that mode is not available to the customer teams which have the same labelled PU..
I assume that the works team just didn’t take the PU3 upgrade that was available to everyone? Won’t that be the argument that they elected to wait for the next revision but the customer teams didn’t?

Of course, if the customer teams were fully informed of the timing of PU3+ is another question and could be dodgy?
Or perhaps the customer teams were motivated to make certain timing decisions by factors they thought it was best to go along with... Who knows what goes on behind the scenes? I'm sure it's possible to undermine the rules without actually breaking them, as ever in F1..
The Ferrari PU normally (mid season planned change) goes to the customer teams one race in advance, so that’s the case here too, no surprises.

Like the deuce , I don’t think it’s necessary rule breaking (although it would be deemed to be outside of the sporting regs), but certainly sets a precedent for other works teams if de rated PU start going to the customer teams.

Anyway FP 1 soon!!!

Derek Smith

33,987 posts

193 months

Friday 6th September
quotequote all
TheDeuce said:
Derek Smith said:
The problem with the Ferrari team is that, at times of high expectation, they tend to lose concentration. A new PU. New is bad news. Ferrari and new sort of don't go together.

Merc need a challenge from them.

I wondered last week whether Merc could have turned up the wick on Hamilton's car in the latter stages of the race, to get him on terms, rather like RB did with Verstappen. They bottled out because, at least after Monza, there are tracks where they should walk it and an engine failure would be a bad idea.
Due to watching from a construction site last week, I missed a lot of detail. I had assumed because of Hamilton's charge at the end they had turned it up.. Was it just the mercs superior tyre management that aided his charge? It never looked like he would pass CLC to me, but another 1-2 laps and he would have been able to make a serious few attempts I think.
We were using the FIA's live timing and it seemed to us that there was no hammer time. Whilst he was creaming the middle sector in comparison to CLC, on the fast bits his speed only increased at the rate you'd expect as the fuel dropped. There was an occasional spurt (tell me about it) and we got excited, only for the next lap to drop back to 'normal'.

I doubted he could make a pass without CLC's tyres going off. That didn't happen. Had his times dropped considerably half-a-dozen laps from the end, perhaps he would be allowed to turn up the wick.

The conversation on this point went on long after the race, with various 'facts' being brought in. What we all agreed on was that not pushing the engine was probably the best option for him at this stage in the season. Mind you, very few of my mates work for the race teams' tactics units.

We are available, though.


FourWheelDrift

77,834 posts

229 months

Friday 6th September
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Wet practice 1, I was going to say will anyone go out. Grosjean is already.

LaurasOtherHalf

15,416 posts

141 months

Friday 6th September
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LEC’s tyres were dropping off last week at the end Derek, I was timing them from Pouhon.

I still think HAM would have had a chance we’re it not for GIO & NOR’s yellow flags on the last lap-he would have at least closed enough to have a go into bus stop on the final lap.

Petrus1983

2,446 posts

107 months

Friday 6th September
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Kimi in the wall - red flag.

REALIST123

11,799 posts

98 months

Friday 6th September
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Can’t believe what I’m hearing Croft et al discussing; no grid penalties for future engine usage, keep place on grid, race as normal, go on podium if in top 3.

Then have the points you’ve won taken away from both team and driver.

Why bother hammering the new engine, taking the risks etc for no points?

I don’t like the current penalties but the above seems even more stupid to me.

FourWheelDrift

77,834 posts

229 months

Friday 6th September
quotequote all
Norris, Gasly and Verstappen at the back with engine penalties taken.

https://www.crash.net/f1/news/928513/1/norris-join...

Evangelion

5,174 posts

123 months

Friday 6th September
quotequote all
REALIST123 said:
Can’t believe what I’m hearing Croft et al discussing; no grid penalties for future engine usage, keep place on grid, race as normal, go on podium if in top 3.

Then have the points you’ve won taken away from both team and driver.

Why bother hammering the new engine, taking the risks etc for no points?

I don’t like the current penalties but the above seems even more stupid to me.
Why bother racing at all in that case? Just trundle round at the back and have a fresh engine for next time.

Frimley111R

9,970 posts

179 months

Friday 6th September
quotequote all
FourWheelDrift said:
Norris, Gasly and Verstappen at the back with engine penalties taken.

https://www.crash.net/f1/news/928513/1/norris-join...
Poor Lando, robbed of 5th place on the last lap and now starting from the back of the grid. It's Mark Webber type luck!

Graveworm

2,372 posts

16 months

Friday 6th September
quotequote all
I would allow one extra ICE etc per season, if it's taken following a mechanical retirement from a points scoring position, qualifying or in the first half of the race.

FourWheelDrift

77,834 posts

229 months

Friday 6th September
quotequote all
Graveworm said:
I would allow one extra ICE etc per season, if it's taken following a mechanical retirement from a points scoring position, qualifying or in the first half of the race.
Give concessions to manufacturers like they do in MotoGP. Give a win 5 points, a podium 2 points. Any engine manufacturer that has less than 6 points amassed over the past two years gets more components and extra in-season testing days.

LaurasOtherHalf

15,416 posts

141 months

Friday 6th September
quotequote all
Love Lando’s Rossi tribute helmet biggrin

https://www.formula1.com/en/latest/article.lando-n...

iandc

2,464 posts

151 months

Friday 6th September
quotequote all
REALIST123 said:
Can’t believe what I’m hearing Croft et al discussing; no grid penalties for future engine usage, keep place on grid, race as normal, go on podium if in top 3.

Then have the points you’ve won taken away from both team and driver.

Why bother hammering the new engine, taking the risks etc for no points?

I don’t like the current penalties but the above seems even more stupid to me.
I heard that too. Bunch of muppets chatting endlessly about what a good idea it was! Sky coverage is so crap. I know FP1 is not the most exciting part of the race meeting but boy do they chatter on and on with little in-jokes and banter about what they ate last night!

Drew106

843 posts

90 months

Friday 6th September
quotequote all
iandc said:
REALIST123 said:
Can’t believe what I’m hearing Croft et al discussing; no grid penalties for future engine usage, keep place on grid, race as normal, go on podium if in top 3.

Then have the points you’ve won taken away from both team and driver.

Why bother hammering the new engine, taking the risks etc for no points?

I don’t like the current penalties but the above seems even more stupid to me.
I heard that too. Bunch of muppets chatting endlessly about what a good idea it was! Sky coverage is so crap. I know FP1 is not the most exciting part of the race meeting but boy do they chatter on and on with little in-jokes and banter about what they ate last night!
What I understood they were saying is that the driver/constructor would lose a portion of their points comparative to a grid/time penalty. Not all of their points for that race...

Still think it's a ste idea mind.

SmoothCriminal

2,539 posts

144 months

Friday 6th September
quotequote all
Hamilton seems switched right on from the start.

jb2410

183 posts

56 months

Friday 6th September
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Anyone see the Alonso interview on sky a few minutes ago?

All smiles and a glint in his eye, definitely something in the works I reckon. He was talking up how nice it was to be back in Italy, in for Vettel?

REALIST123

11,799 posts

98 months

Friday 6th September
quotequote all
Drew106 said:
What I understood they were saying is that the driver/constructor would lose a portion of their points comparative to a grid/time penalty. Not all of their points for that race...

Still think it's a ste idea mind.
I missed that if they did and I rewound and watched again because I couldn’t believe what I heard.

It sounded and read as if they’d both lose all points.

The other ste they were talking was about Albon’s change of helmet from Bell to Arai and how it’s all critical in terms of aero.

I’ve since been reliably informed that they don’t optimise for helmets or position, they had a radio issue with the Bell last week, they couldn’t reliably hear Albon, hence the change.

FourWheelDrift

77,834 posts

229 months

Friday 6th September
quotequote all
REALIST123 said:
I missed that if they did and I rewound and watched again because I couldn’t believe what I heard.

It sounded and read as if they’d both lose all points.

The other ste they were talking was about Albon’s change of helmet from Bell to Arai and how it’s all critical in terms of aero.

I’ve since been reliably informed that they don’t optimise for helmets or position, they had a radio issue with the Bell last week, they couldn’t reliably hear Albon, hence the change.
https://nl.motorsport.com/f1/news/max-verstappen-h...

"For the Red Bull team, however, Verstappen's switch to a different brand of helmet was not ideal. “We have had a contract with Arai for many years. Not only for the drivers at Red Bull Racing, but also for the engineers, for Toro Rosso and for the Red Bull Junior Team. But because the Verstappen helmet did not fit properly and we were under time pressure, we had to make an exception, "says Marko. More importantly, when designing the RB15, the characteristics of the helmet of Arai were taken into account, not Schuberth's. "The Arai helmet was taken as the starting point for the concept of the car," Marko confirms"

Graveworm

2,372 posts

16 months

Friday 6th September
quotequote all
FourWheelDrift said:
Give concessions to manufacturers like they do in MotoGP. Give a win 5 points, a podium 2 points. Any engine manufacturer that has less than 6 points amassed over the past two years gets more components and extra in-season testing days.
Anything is worth a try but giving Renault and Mclaren added advantages over Williams and Haas might not seem fair.