Jamie Chadwick - First competitive female driver in F1?

Jamie Chadwick - First competitive female driver in F1?

Author
Discussion

trackdemon

11,570 posts

245 months

Tuesday 8th November
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Burrow01 said:
If you have more female drivers, you have more female viewers, spectators, and therefore more sponsors bringing their money to the sport.
I'm sure there'd be a small increase in women actually watching the odd race out of curiosity (perhaps those who'd usually 'tolerate' it whilst their partner watches it live) to see how 'Jane Fast' is doing at Silverstone GP. But I very much doubt having a female F1 driver would suddenly make vast swathes of women previously uninterested in motor racing suddenly start watching it. Much like WSL is still mostly watched by men, despite there being some great successes including England winning the Euro's this year. If folks aren't interested in a particular sport then they just aren't.

Sandpit Steve

7,359 posts

58 months

Tuesday 8th November
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trackdemon said:
Little bit of contradiction going on there, no? hehe I'm not aware of sexism in F1, certainly not the post millennium version. There's LOADS of women employed in many and varied roles throughout the F1 community (and no, not just catering for the misogynists).
It was certainly true a couple of decades ago, that the ladies in the paddock were doing marketing, catering and modelling - but it’s very much true now, that there are women in every single position in the team.

There was even a lady team principal a few years back, Monisha Kaltenborn at Sauber. There’s a load of engineers, strategists, mechanics, personal trainers, journalists and more, visible every weekend. The only two jobs I think that don’t have any female representation, are technical directors and drivers.

andyA700

1,710 posts

21 months

Tuesday 8th November
quotequote all
Sandpit Steve said:
trackdemon said:
Little bit of contradiction going on there, no? hehe I'm not aware of sexism in F1, certainly not the post millennium version. There's LOADS of women employed in many and varied roles throughout the F1 community (and no, not just catering for the misogynists).
It was certainly true a couple of decades ago, that the ladies in the paddock were doing marketing, catering and modelling - but it’s very much true now, that there are women in every single position in the team.

There was even a lady team principal a few years back, Monisha Kaltenborn at Sauber. There’s a load of engineers, strategists, mechanics, personal trainers, journalists and more, visible every weekend. The only two jobs I think that don’t have any female representation, are technical directors and drivers.
I stand to be corrected, but I think there has only been one woman directly involved in a F1 pit crew (taking off a left rear) and that was back in 2006.

Burrow01

1,591 posts

176 months

Tuesday 8th November
quotequote all
trackdemon said:
Burrow01 said:
If you have more female drivers, you have more female viewers, spectators, and therefore more sponsors bringing their money to the sport.
I'm sure there'd be a small increase in women actually watching the odd race out of curiosity (perhaps those who'd usually 'tolerate' it whilst their partner watches it live) to see how 'Jane Fast' is doing at Silverstone GP. But I very much doubt having a female F1 driver would suddenly make vast swathes of women previously uninterested in motor racing suddenly start watching it. Much like WSL is still mostly watched by men, despite there being some great successes including England winning the Euro's this year. If folks aren't interested in a particular sport then they just aren't.
WSL is the equivalent of FW, women competing with other women.
Its already been mentioned that sponsors would be falling over themselves to be associated with a female F1 driver, and so even if a small percentage of women get interested in F1, it would be a significant increase in coverage.

trackdemon

11,570 posts

245 months

Tuesday 8th November
quotequote all
andyA700 said:
Sandpit Steve said:
trackdemon said:
Little bit of contradiction going on there, no? hehe I'm not aware of sexism in F1, certainly not the post millennium version. There's LOADS of women employed in many and varied roles throughout the F1 community (and no, not just catering for the misogynists).
It was certainly true a couple of decades ago, that the ladies in the paddock were doing marketing, catering and modelling - but it’s very much true now, that there are women in every single position in the team.

There was even a lady team principal a few years back, Monisha Kaltenborn at Sauber. There’s a load of engineers, strategists, mechanics, personal trainers, journalists and more, visible every weekend. The only two jobs I think that don’t have any female representation, are technical directors and drivers.
I stand to be corrected, but I think there has only been one woman directly involved in a F1 pit crew (taking off a left rear) and that was back in 2006.
I'm not sure picking out one solitary role out of the hundreds in F1 is doing much to reinforce your PoV against what was stated above. Barring driving, I'm not sure there's a higher profile role than TP.

alisdairm

83 posts

145 months

Tuesday 8th November
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Burrow01 said:
One reason is that because at the moment 50% of the worlds population is not really interested in F1
I would guess that at least 95% of the world's population are not interested in F1.

carl_w

8,247 posts

242 months

Tuesday 8th November
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Sandpit Steve said:
There was even a lady team principal a few years back, Monisha Kaltenborn at Sauber.
And Claire Williams, whose job title was "Deputy Team Principal" but in reality was the TP.

vulture1

10,658 posts

163 months

Wednesday 9th November
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Sandpit Steve said:
There was even a lady team principal a few years back, Monisha Kaltenborn at Sauber.
She had a history of hiring too many drivers.


Rumour has it she is seeing 3 therapists about it.

LukeBrown66

3,182 posts

30 months

Wednesday 9th November
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My point about female employment in F1 was this.

Teams are falling over themselves to employ women, same as police are falling over themselves to employ ethnic minorities, mainly because they are right for the role, but also because it ticks Hr boxes and looks good to shareholders and gives HR something to do and warrant their vast salaries.

Some of these people are great, some are perhaps not the best option for the role but get the nod for "other" reasons.
If you do not at least acknowledge this you are living in a very naïve world!

To me it is fair enough, shareholders and sponsors often make demands like this for teams to be better at it, so it is fine.

But traditionally you usually see women in PR and admin roles, at which they seem to dominate quite honestly.

alisdairm

83 posts

145 months

Friday 18th November
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F1 Academy: Formula 1 launches all-female championship


https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/63675446

MontyPythonX

414 posts

100 months

Friday 18th November
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alisdairm said:
F1 Academy: Formula 1 launches all-female championship


https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/63675446
To run alongside the W-Series....apparently!

MustangGT

9,921 posts

264 months

Friday 18th November
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alisdairm said:
F1 Academy: Formula 1 launches all-female championship


https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/63675446
Using F4 type cars. Each driver having to find Euro 150,000 to take part.

Needed to be a step up from FW, not backwards. I would be surprised if they can find enough (any) drivers with that price tag.

Tobermory

1,288 posts

13 months

Friday 18th November
quotequote all
MustangGT said:
alisdairm said:
F1 Academy: Formula 1 launches all-female championship


https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/63675446
Using F4 type cars. Each driver having to find Euro 150,000 to take part.

Needed to be a step up from FW, not backwards. I would be surprised if they can find enough (any) drivers with that price tag.
Yes, that's a step down in performance from the W series cars, strange choice. The real problem was not the W series but the lack of a clear path upwards from there.

andburg

5,907 posts

153 months

Friday 18th November
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MustangGT said:
Using F4 type cars. Each driver having to find Euro 150,000 to take part.

Needed to be a step up from FW, not backwards. I would be surprised if they can find enough (any) drivers with that price tag.
150k - peanuts for any f1 team wanting to show they are backing female talent

needs more lower level scheme. Jamie is the best of the current bunch but you get the feeling shes not rated against her male counterparts. That could be sexism or it could be shes the best of a bad/very average bunch.

Tobermory

1,288 posts

13 months

Friday 18th November
quotequote all
andburg said:
MustangGT said:
Using F4 type cars. Each driver having to find Euro 150,000 to take part.

Needed to be a step up from FW, not backwards. I would be surprised if they can find enough (any) drivers with that price tag.
150k - peanuts for any f1 team wanting to show they are backing female talent

needs more lower level scheme. Jamie is the best of the current bunch but you get the feeling shes not rated against her male counterparts. That could be sexism or it could be shes the best of a bad/very average bunch.
You've hit the nail on the head. The issues is numbers. There are so many young male drivers that amongst them there is going to be a very small number of truly outstanding talents who may, just may, make it through the ranks as far as F1. Finding such an exceptional driver amongst the much smaller pool of female drivers is always going to be much less likely, and then you have to factor in all the other additional obstacles that they face. As you say the best way of a female feeder series having credibility would be some funding from existing teams, I wonder how many will go for it.

andyA700

1,710 posts

21 months

Friday 18th November
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The only real way to see if a female driver is going to be competitive at F1, is to let them follow the same route as the blokes, the progression from F3 - F2 - F1.
Interesting to note that in 2019, Tatiana Calderon the Columbian driver competed in F2 and didn't manage to score a single point. She is now driving in Indycar.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2019_Formula_2_Champ...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tatiana_Calder%C3%B3...

freedman

4,899 posts

191 months

Friday 18th November
quotequote all
andyA700 said:
The only real way to see if a female driver is going to be competitive at F1, is to let them follow the same route as the blokes, the progression from F3 - F2 - F1.
Interesting to note that in 2019, Tatiana Calderon the Columbian driver competed in F2 and didn't manage to score a single point. She is now driving in Indycar.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2019_Formula_2_Champ...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tatiana_Calder%C3%B3...
She wasn't very good in F2 and she isn't very good in Indycar

LukeBrown66

3,182 posts

30 months

Friday 18th November
quotequote all
If you go back through this thread you will see varying degrees of opinion as to why this happens.

But the fact remains that in the last 30 or so years there have been zero female drivers good enough to be in top level single-seater racing.

The ones that have got close are reasonable drivers, but not amazing, even if they were blokes they would need to show something exceptional to be given a chance unless they were very rich, or perhaps have a famous father or mother!

But as yet the ones who are looking at trying, are simply not good enough, there are lots of reasons, the main one being the pool they come from is tiny, so anyone good shines, but vs male counterparts comes out as being just not quick enough.

Frimley111R

13,533 posts

218 months

Friday 18th November
quotequote all
LukeBrown66 said:
If you go back through this thread you will see varying degrees of opinion as to why this happens.

But the fact remains that in the last 30 or so years there have been zero female drivers good enough to be in top level single-seater racing.

The ones that have got close are reasonable drivers, but not amazing, even if they were blokes they would need to show something exceptional to be given a chance unless they were very rich, or perhaps have a famous father or mother!

But as yet the ones who are looking at trying, are simply not good enough, there are lots of reasons, the main one being the pool they come from is tiny, so anyone good shines, but vs male counterparts comes out as being just not quick enough.
There really is no need for a totally reasonable post, please stop and let people get back to avoiding common sense.

andburg

5,907 posts

153 months

Friday 18th November
quotequote all
its true

i wonder what percentage of male drivers who have raced karts make it to F1, it has to so close to zero its practically an impossibility.