What separates the excellent from the elite?

What separates the excellent from the elite?

Author
Discussion

angrymoby

1,736 posts

151 months

Wednesday 1st December 2021
quotequote all
HARTLEYHARE1 said:
There is only one name everyone

Michael Schumacher

Everyone before and especially after have just been lucky
certainly separated himself from the rest with his ability to cheat at an elite level

only driver to have been excluded from a championship

105.4

1,658 posts

44 months

Wednesday 1st December 2021
quotequote all
Muzzer79 said:
What's autism got to do with the price of bread? confused

Stirling Moss was unquestionably elite. He could charm the pants off anyone and was about as far removed from autistic as you could get.
Single mindedness, stubbornness, pure, absolute focus on minor details.

I’m happy to be corrected, but don’t all of those attributes feature on the autism scale?

PH User

21,238 posts

81 months

Wednesday 1st December 2021
quotequote all
HARTLEYHARE1 said:
There is only one name everyone

Michael Schumacher

Everyone before and especially after have just been lucky
laugh

Milkyway

2,537 posts

26 months

Wednesday 1st December 2021
quotequote all
PH User said:
HARTLEYHARE1 said:
There is only one name everyone

Michael Schumacher

Everyone before and especially after have just been lucky
laugh
Don’t Bite... smash
https://thetightyorkshireman.files.wordpress.com/2...

Muzzer79

5,917 posts

160 months

Wednesday 1st December 2021
quotequote all
105.4 said:
Muzzer79 said:
What's autism got to do with the price of bread? confused

Stirling Moss was unquestionably elite. He could charm the pants off anyone and was about as far removed from autistic as you could get.
Single mindedness, stubbornness, pure, absolute focus on minor details.

I’m happy to be corrected, but don’t all of those attributes feature on the autism scale?
So does

Avoidance of eye contact
Reliance on rules and routines
Difficulty interacting socially
Over-sensitivity to loud noises

Functioning autistic people are generally noticeably socially awkward appearing, insular and isolated.

Does any of that sound like Senna, Clark, Stewart, Villeneuve or Hill?

Racing drivers by their nature are fiercely competitive therefore focus their attention on a task in order to win. It doesn't mean they are autistic though.


StevieBee

Original Poster:

10,526 posts

228 months

Wednesday 1st December 2021
quotequote all
Muzzer79 said:
105.4 said:
Muzzer79 said:
What's autism got to do with the price of bread? confused

Stirling Moss was unquestionably elite. He could charm the pants off anyone and was about as far removed from autistic as you could get.
Single mindedness, stubbornness, pure, absolute focus on minor details.

I’m happy to be corrected, but don’t all of those attributes feature on the autism scale?
So does

Avoidance of eye contact
Reliance on rules and routines
Difficulty interacting socially
Over-sensitivity to loud noises

Functioning autistic people are generally noticeably socially awkward appearing, insular and isolated.

Does any of that sound like Senna, Clark, Stewart, Villeneuve or Hill?

Racing drivers by their nature are fiercely competitive therefore focus their attention on a task in order to win. It doesn't mean they are autistic though.
At least two and a half of your list could apply to Senna.

I'd also suggest Lauda displayed certain similar traits.

The theory was explored a few posts back starting with my observation of Senna displaying certain traits we know today to exist amongst those on the spectrum. That doesn't mean that you need to be on the spectrum be a great driver but does not necessarily harm one's prospects if you are and possibly affords an advantage.



raftom

1,073 posts

234 months

Wednesday 1st December 2021
quotequote all
I would certainly put Senna, Lauda, Schumacher and Stewart somewhere on the spectrum. Senna even had motor skills problems as a small child.

cgt2

2,431 posts

161 months

Wednesday 1st December 2021
quotequote all
raftom said:
I would certainly put Senna, Lauda, Schumacher and Stewart somewhere on the spectrum. Senna even had motor skills problems as a small child.
Schumacher, who I met on several occasions, was extremely gregarious, friendly and outgoing, you could tell he was an absolute laugh to be around and people who worked with him loved that aspect of his personality. Quite different to how the media portrayed him in the 90s.

patmahe

5,469 posts

177 months

Wednesday 1st December 2021
quotequote all
Minimising losses on the tough days seems to be a huge factor. If wins are roughly equal with a rival, the days you finished second, third etc are what makes the difference.

PhilAsia

493 posts

48 months

Thursday 2nd December 2021
quotequote all
cgt2 said:
Schumacher, who I met on several occasions, was extremely gregarious, friendly and outgoing, you could tell he was an absolute laugh to be around and people who worked with him loved that aspect of his personality. Quite different to how the media portrayed him in the 90s.
Agreed. He seemed quite agreeable until you got near him with a helmet on...

DodgyGeezer

29,474 posts

163 months

Thursday 2nd December 2021
quotequote all
I guess what we can (mostly) agree on is that whilst natural ability/talent does exist it must be coupled to (ruthless?) dedication to your 'craft' otherwise it'll be unfulfilled. Taking a different sport look at rugby both Gavin Henson and (especially IMO) Danny Cipriani should have had far longer international careers than they did. Their 'replacements' may not have been as good to watch but they eschewed the celebrity lifestyle and were focused

sparta6

2,968 posts

73 months

Thursday 2nd December 2021
quotequote all
PhilAsia said:
cgt2 said:
Schumacher, who I met on several occasions, was extremely gregarious, friendly and outgoing, you could tell he was an absolute laugh to be around and people who worked with him loved that aspect of his personality. Quite different to how the media portrayed him in the 90s.
Agreed. He seemed quite agreeable until you got near him with a helmet on...
Good footballer too


Muzzer79

5,917 posts

160 months

Thursday 2nd December 2021
quotequote all
StevieBee said:
Muzzer79 said:
105.4 said:
Muzzer79 said:
What's autism got to do with the price of bread? confused

Stirling Moss was unquestionably elite. He could charm the pants off anyone and was about as far removed from autistic as you could get.
Single mindedness, stubbornness, pure, absolute focus on minor details.

I’m happy to be corrected, but don’t all of those attributes feature on the autism scale?
So does

Avoidance of eye contact
Reliance on rules and routines
Difficulty interacting socially
Over-sensitivity to loud noises

Functioning autistic people are generally noticeably socially awkward appearing, insular and isolated.

Does any of that sound like Senna, Clark, Stewart, Villeneuve or Hill?

Racing drivers by their nature are fiercely competitive therefore focus their attention on a task in order to win. It doesn't mean they are autistic though.
At least two and a half of your list could apply to Senna.
Which ones?

Muzzer79

5,917 posts

160 months

Thursday 2nd December 2021
quotequote all
raftom said:
I would certainly put Senna, Lauda, Schumacher and Stewart somewhere on the spectrum.
What characteristics would compel you to put those drivers on the spectrum?

angrymoby

1,736 posts

151 months

Thursday 2nd December 2021
quotequote all
sparta6 said:
Good footballer too
yet he did some questionable things there too

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tGq7VcaHoqo

LukeBrown66

1,738 posts

19 months

Thursday 2nd December 2021
quotequote all
Having read Niki's books over the years I would not say he was on any spectrum, he was however very good at compartmentalising stuff and putting it in boxes, meaning he was a fabulous car developer and able to make very rational decisions.

As for those who may have been, Stewart was dyslexic, which could have figured why he was so pushed to be good at shooting and racing, Senna clearly had issues, maybe out of the sport that forced him to be very focussed, look at his obsession with RC stuff.

Others were massive risk takers like Bellof, Villeneuve Depailler, and you could see it in the way they drove

I find is also fascinating how others changed their careers to be better, like Scheckter, always considered a rough driver, ended up being very safe and calculated and won a world title as a result,

swisstoni

12,286 posts

252 months

Thursday 2nd December 2021
quotequote all
Pitch for a game show: Psychiatry Corner.

Two teams compete to diagnose famous drivers using nothing but some random examples and hunches…


Milkyway

2,537 posts

26 months

Thursday 2nd December 2021
quotequote all
swisstoni said:
Pitch for a game show: Psychiatry Corner.

Two teams compete to diagnose famous drivers using nothing but some random examples and hunches…
Sounds good... try Dave.
What’s the prize though... doubt it will be much.

PhilAsia

493 posts

48 months

Thursday 2nd December 2021
quotequote all
Milkyway said:
swisstoni said:
Pitch for a game show: Psychiatry Corner.

Two teams compete to diagnose famous drivers using nothing but some random examples and hunches…
Sounds good... try Dave.
What’s the prize though... doubt it will be much.
It'll be either 12 dolphins or an old lady. Can't decide which...

Milkyway

2,537 posts

26 months

Thursday 2nd December 2021
quotequote all
PhilAsia said:
Milkyway said:
swisstoni said:
Pitch for a game show: Psychiatry Corner.

Two teams compete to diagnose famous drivers using nothing but some random examples and hunches…
Sounds good... try Dave.
What’s the prize though... doubt it will be much.
It'll be either 12 dolphins or an old lady. Can't decide which...
How about this... quite cheap. scratchchin
https://www.physioparts.co.uk/brain-section-model-...