The Official F1 2023 silly season *contains speculation*

The Official F1 2023 silly season *contains speculation*

Author
Discussion

jsf

26,814 posts

216 months

Friday 5th August
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Pflanzgarten said:
Correct on Seb, he was sponsored by Red Bull early doors and his position in BMW was on their behalf.

Max most certainly want however.

I do sometimes wonder if the Seb story was the main reason for the eventual driver progress program at Red Bull but it simply hasn’t worked with anyone else.

I think it’s a flawed system anyway.
Having a toxic personality running it doesn't help.

TheDeuce

14,933 posts

46 months

Friday 5th August
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CoolHands said:
super7 said:
Ricciardo out of McLaren and Piastri is in eek
woop! fia confirmed contract. I presume that means it's legit.

https://twitter.com/formularacers_/status/15554721...
Seems likely combined with Piastri himself stating "I will not be driving for Alpine next year". That's fairly unequivocal.

DR to Williams? rofl (although not to much laughing, it could be his only choice!?)


TheDeuce

14,933 posts

46 months

Friday 5th August
quotequote all
jsf said:
Pflanzgarten said:
Correct on Seb, he was sponsored by Red Bull early doors and his position in BMW was on their behalf.

Max most certainly want however.

I do sometimes wonder if the Seb story was the main reason for the eventual driver progress program at Red Bull but it simply hasn’t worked with anyone else.

I think it’s a flawed system anyway.
Having a toxic personality running it doesn't help.
Easily the most distasteful aspect of the RB brand. Other than the drinks, of course.

Sandpit Steve

6,604 posts

54 months

Friday 5th August
quotequote all
Peter Windsor, trying to make sense of the last couple of days.

https://youtube.com/watch?v=aVOy7lr2D-E

The one bit I think he missed, is what is the status of the contract between Piastri and Alpine? Was there a loophole to make it lapse, or has the driver broken it. Renault have invested millions in their young driver, can they sue him for it to be returned?

TheDeuce

14,933 posts

46 months

Friday 5th August
quotequote all
Sandpit Steve said:
Peter Windsor, trying to make sense of the last couple of days.

https://youtube.com/watch?v=aVOy7lr2D-E

The one bit I think he missed, is what is the status of the contract between Piastri and Alpine? Was there a loophole to make it lapse, or has the driver broken it. Renault have invested millions in their young driver, can they sue him for it to be returned?
Such logical thinking might be irrelevant. Driver salaries are outside the cost-cap so teams can pay big if they want a driver, including buying one out of what at best is probably a fairly low-level contract in value terms, he was just a reserve after all. Whatever millions Renault spent, it was their decision to keep him as reserve so they can only apportion so much of that investment as 'lost' due to this.

And would they try and go the legal route when they themselves presumably broke contractual terms by publicly announcing he would drive for them with no consultation with the guy? The whole thing seems unbelievably scrappy to me.


Milkyway

4,667 posts

33 months

Friday 5th August
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Nampahc Niloc

904 posts

58 months

Friday 5th August
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Milkyway said:
He is out of contract this year.

Sandpit Steve

6,604 posts

54 months

Friday 5th August
quotequote all
TheDeuce said:
Such logical thinking might be irrelevant. Driver salaries are outside the cost-cap so teams can pay big if they want a driver, including buying one out of what at best is probably a fairly low-level contract in value terms, he was just a reserve after all. Whatever millions Renault spent, it was their decision to keep him as reserve so they can only apportion so much of that investment as 'lost' due to this.

And would they try and go the legal route when they themselves presumably broke contractual terms by publicly announcing he would drive for them with no consultation with the guy? The whole thing seems unbelievably scrappy to me.
It’s a little more than that. Alpine have invented let’s say £10m in Piastri, and have a contract with him until the end of 2024. The contract states that they’ll either race him or place him in 2023, and he’ll race for Alpine in 2024.

Alpine were intending to place him with WIlliams in 2023, then Alonso walked so they agreed to race him.

The question is, was there somehow a total break clause in the contract, that allows the driver to walk away from all that investment and go drive somewhere else, on 1st August? If so, Alpine need to fire their lawyer. There’s apparently been several hundred hours of private testing in 2018 cars this spring and summer, at a cost of several million.

Edit: LOL at the out-of-contract Boris Johnson getting the Alpine drive. Not sure he has enough Super Licence points though.

cgt2

3,817 posts

168 months

Friday 5th August
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Milkyway said:
He's way too fat to get his backside in an F1 car.

ajprice

23,329 posts

176 months

Friday 5th August
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cgt2 said:
Milkyway said:
He's way too fat to get his backside in an F1 car.
He'll need the 3 seater to himself.

TheDeuce

14,933 posts

46 months

Friday 5th August
quotequote all
Sandpit Steve said:
TheDeuce said:
Such logical thinking might be irrelevant. Driver salaries are outside the cost-cap so teams can pay big if they want a driver, including buying one out of what at best is probably a fairly low-level contract in value terms, he was just a reserve after all. Whatever millions Renault spent, it was their decision to keep him as reserve so they can only apportion so much of that investment as 'lost' due to this.

And would they try and go the legal route when they themselves presumably broke contractual terms by publicly announcing he would drive for them with no consultation with the guy? The whole thing seems unbelievably scrappy to me.
It’s a little more than that. Alpine have invented let’s say £10m in Piastri, and have a contract with him until the end of 2024. The contract states that they’ll either race him or place him in 2023, and he’ll race for Alpine in 2024.

Alpine were intending to place him with WIlliams in 2023, then Alonso walked so they agreed to race him.

The question is, was there somehow a total break clause in the contract, that allows the driver to walk away from all that investment and go drive somewhere else, on 1st August? If so, Alpine need to fire their lawyer. There’s apparently been several hundred hours of private testing in 2018 cars this spring and summer, at a cost of several million.

Edit: LOL at the out-of-contract Boris Johnson getting the Alpine drive. Not sure he has enough Super Licence points though.
Like I said, it's all a bit weird and scrappy. I assume Piastri has his own legal brief and perhaps (very likely) was looking for a potential get-out when he learned he was to be farmed out to Williams. The fact they then announced as knee jerk reaction that he would drive for Alpine without him knowing almost feels like trying to force through an intent that might not be enforceable by contract for whatever reason.

All very weird. But McLaren apparently have an FIA ratified contract with him now so... I suppose that's evidence that there was a way out. Perhaps a paid way out but I can't imagine McLaren paid off tens of millions to a competitor to bag a rookie, more likely Alpine were on unstable ground and whatever deal has gone through was simply a better option to accept than to fight.

And we'll never know for sure whatever actually went on smile



cgt2

3,817 posts

168 months

Friday 5th August
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I for one cannot wait to see how Piastri does alongside Norris. What a phenomenal pairing McLaren will have.

PhilAsia

1,340 posts

55 months

Saturday 6th August
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cgt2 said:
I for one cannot wait to see how Piastri does alongside Norris. What a phenomenal pairing McLaren will have.
Indeed. I thought Lewis and Russell was rock solid driver abilities. I really rate Norris as well, but Piastri looks to have the minerals too!

Can't wait!!

ajprice

23,329 posts

176 months

Saturday 6th August
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vulture1

10,281 posts

159 months

Saturday 6th August
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PhilAsia said:
cgt2 said:
I for one cannot wait to see how Piastri does alongside Norris. What a phenomenal pairing McLaren will have.
Indeed. I thought Lewis and Russell was rock solid driver abilities. I really rate Norris as well, but Piastri looks to have the minerals too!

Can't wait!!
I still think the Lewis russel pairing is thr strongest russel has a good few years experience so equal to or better than Lando. And piastri new vs Lewis. But its still a very good lineup.

Callum43

253 posts

32 months

Saturday 6th August
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So many names being bandied about . So much speculation. History suggests F1 is a graveyard for most of those who ever get a seat and don’t capitalise on it very early on . Maybe Piastri will prove to be a Lewis Hamilton and make us drop our jaws at his performances. If so then Norris better start watching out as he’ll be next in line for abuse and derision.If Ricciardo is yesterday’s man and the future is with these young hot shots then there are many others that should join him in uncertain futures . History again suggests that most will not meet the overblown expectations of them obtained in F2 etc and the churn will continue ad infinitum . It’s a dog eat dog world in F1 and never more so than now.

Fundoreen

3,095 posts

63 months

Saturday 6th August
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With a bit of luck Alpine will bury the hatchet with Richiardo. I think Mclaren just made a car for Norris,and the reality is its still not a good car as he's not winning is he?

Smollet

8,108 posts

170 months

Saturday 6th August
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cgt2 said:
I for one cannot wait to see how Piastri does alongside Norris. What a phenomenal pairing McLaren will have.
Vandoorne was hailed as the wunderkind and where is he now?

Gtom

1,291 posts

112 months

Saturday 6th August
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Wasn’t Pascal Wehrlein highly rated as well?

vaud

Original Poster:

45,392 posts

135 months

Saturday 6th August
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Gtom said:
Wasn’t Pascal Wehrlein highly rated as well?
Yes but didn’t he fall out with Mercedes rather than any speed issue?