Lewis Hamilton G.O.A.T. ?

Lewis Hamilton G.O.A.T. ?

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Blue Meanie

73,668 posts

221 months

Saturday 13th November 2010
quotequote all
heebeegeetee said:
AndrewW-G said:
but seems to lack consistency and the ability to get the best from an underperforming car,
I'd have thought he's disproved those two over the past two years. We really don't know where this year's McL is, given the disparity in McL's two wdc drivers.
There isn't THAT much disparity though, is there?

Mermaid

21,492 posts

137 months

Saturday 13th November 2010
quotequote all
Conian said:
Adrian W said:
Taz46 said:
Any one else agree with me that Lewis has the ability to be regarded as the greatest of all time? Seems to me he can get the car near or on the front regardless whether the cars 100 % (with the exception of the beginning of last year but let's face it the mclaren was a complete dog of a car) most talented driver on the grid my opinion, what's yours!?
Lets have this conversation in ten years time
i'd say 15
or once he has won the most world championships.

AndrewW-G

11,968 posts

183 months

Saturday 13th November 2010
quotequote all
heebeegeetee said:
AndrewW-G said:
but seems to lack consistency and the ability to get the best from an underperforming car,
I'd have thought he's disproved those two over the past two years. We really don't know where this year's McL is, given the disparity in McL's two wdc drivers.
My take on last year, is that his performance only really improved when the car did, it's very much a subjective topic and no doubt one more suited to discussion in a pub over several pints. . . . . PH's pro hamilton bias only serves to distort any discussion on here. . . . . .

hotmelt

861 posts

139 months

Saturday 13th November 2010
quotequote all
AndrewW-G said:
heebeegeetee said:
AndrewW-G said:
but seems to lack consistency and the ability to get the best from an underperforming car,
I'd have thought he's disproved those two over the past two years. We really don't know where this year's McL is, given the disparity in McL's two wdc drivers.
My take on last year, is that his performance only really improved when the car did, it's very much a subjective topic and no doubt one more suited to discussion in a pub over several pints. . . . . PH's pro hamilton bias only serves to distort any discussion on here. . . . . .[/quot

Or pro Button bias

stephen300o

15,463 posts

194 months

Saturday 13th November 2010
quotequote all
Seen the stewards twice already, definitely goat.

AndrewW-G

11,968 posts

183 months

Saturday 13th November 2010
quotequote all
hotmelt said:
AndrewW-G said:
heebeegeetee said:
AndrewW-G said:
but seems to lack consistency and the ability to get the best from an underperforming car,
I'd have thought he's disproved those two over the past two years. We really don't know where this year's McL is, given the disparity in McL's two wdc drivers.
My take on last year, is that his performance only really improved when the car did, it's very much a subjective topic and no doubt one more suited to discussion in a pub over several pints. . . . . PH's pro hamilton bias only serves to distort any discussion on here. . . . . .
Or pro Button bias
Or pro McLaren / Anti Ferrari bias, any which way you slice it, there is still a bias that will negativly effect any discussion . . . . but thats just the internet for you smile

Edited by AndrewW-G on Saturday 13th November 18:03

mattikake

4,888 posts

165 months

Saturday 13th November 2010
quotequote all
Depends what everyone's definition of a great is. As you can see from the replies to the OP, the number of variations in this is only matched by the level of short-sightedness and self-obsession of some of the posters.

There is generally one great per era who is always the clear best talent of an era. So if it is not going to be Hamilton from around 2006 (end Schumi era) - 2020, who else is it?

Vettel? Alonso? Kubica? Rosberg? Button?

Can't say any of them stand up to it, given they've all been beaten by Hamilton in equal machinery in one formula or another.

Edit: as for G.O.A.T, not yet but potentially. He has the speed, aggression and over-taking craft which seems to be unmatched by anyone else, but the F1 cars may be all too close to rack up the all-important results.

Edited by mattikake on Saturday 13th November 18:09

StevenJJ

541 posts

175 months

Saturday 13th November 2010
quotequote all
Greatest F1 or simply Greatest?

Graham Hill won the F1 title twice, the Indy 500 and Le Mans 24hr so at the moment based on championships Lewis is behind Graham for 'Greatest F1' and a long way behind for 'Greatest' (albeit, all things being well, with many seasons of racing left in him). I'm not sure many would consider GH the Greatest F1 or Greatest so there is a long way to go really.

Even if were to win no more titles Hamilton has secured his reputation by destabilising the current champion Alonso in his debut season and winning in his second anyway though.

heebeegeetee

27,130 posts

214 months

Saturday 13th November 2010
quotequote all
AndrewW-G said:
heebeegeetee said:
AndrewW-G said:
but seems to lack consistency and the ability to get the best from an underperforming car,
I'd have thought he's disproved those two over the past two years. We really don't know where this year's McL is, given the disparity in McL's two wdc drivers.
My take on last year, is that his performance only really improved when the car did, it's very much a subjective topic and no doubt one more suited to discussion in a pub over several pints. . . . . PH's pro hamilton bias only serves to distort any discussion on here. . . . . .
Well, I thought his first drive of the year was absolutely fantastic, in a dog of a car albeit quick in a straight line. He capitalised on mistake after mistake by others, making none himself despite the car. Then when Trulli went off he seemed to be the only one in the team who knew the rules.

Then it all blew up in his face big time when faced with a senior member of his team lieing to the stewards. Didn't Charlie Whiting say it was the first time he'd seen a black guy turn red? hehe

Continueing on with the season I thought he just got on with the job pretty much, although the frustration was apparent at times. But he and the team plugged on and turned the mongrel into a top breed and Lewis won the second half of the championship IIRC. And he grew up a lot too, as he has continued to do this year.

I've thoroughly enjoyed watching his time in F1. His missus is gorgeous too. smile

kambites

61,487 posts

187 months

Saturday 13th November 2010
quotequote all
I think he's got a loooong way to go to even be the best of his generation, let alone the best of all time.

Athlon

4,351 posts

172 months

Saturday 13th November 2010
quotequote all
I don't know yet, but tell you what, I love watching him drive! we need more racers like him.

deadslow

6,943 posts

189 months

Saturday 13th November 2010
quotequote all
He is very good, but fails to dominate, like only the very best can.

superkartracer

8,959 posts

188 months

Saturday 13th November 2010
quotequote all
No, but MS might be if he keeps up the advances he's making, 2011 will be another cracking year for f1 fans.

Gwagon111

4,422 posts

127 months

Saturday 13th November 2010
quotequote all
You have to remember that Lewis was brought into F1 in a top end team from the start of his top flight career. This has virtually no precedence in the sport. He was given the best car on the grid, and only won the WDC because Timo Glock "threw the towel in" ( Rob Smedleys words, not mine). He failed to outperform a bad car, which he had at the beginning of last season. If he had of smashed as many of my cars up as he has Mclarens, I'd have had some serious words with him by now. He's not a bad driver, but in my opinion hes a "win it or bin it" driver. These guys look spectacular but rarely achieve G.O.A.T status. In the good old bad old days drivers like Lewis didn't live long enough.

team underdog

938 posts

195 months

Saturday 13th November 2010
quotequote all
I know it's Hamilton and this is Pistonheads, but are we really debating whether a driver with 70 races, 1 championship and 14 wins is the greatest of all time?

It's pretty simple. No he is not, by a long way. Does he have the potential? Yes.

Mazda Baiter

37,068 posts

154 months

Saturday 13th November 2010
quotequote all
No.

Rosemeyer
Carraciola
Seaman
Nuvolari
Fangio
Ascari
Moss
Brabham
Clark
Stewart
Peterson
Prost
Senna
Schumacher

Sorry, but Hamilton isn't in that list yet. Not by a long way.

AndrewW-G

11,968 posts

183 months

Saturday 13th November 2010
quotequote all
Mazda Baiter said:
No.

Rosemeyer
Carraciola
Seaman
Nuvolari
Fangio
Ascari
Moss
Brabham
Clark
Stewart
Peterson
Prost
Senna
Schumacher

Sorry, but Hamilton isn't in that list yet. Not by a long way.
curse You forgot Gilles Villeneuve

Mini1275

11,098 posts

148 months

Saturday 13th November 2010
quotequote all
He has the potential, like mentioned above, judge in 10-15 years time.

Speedy11

503 posts

174 months

Saturday 13th November 2010
quotequote all
It all comes down to how you determine what makes the best driver. Is it the fastest, most points etc At this point in time it is too early in Lewis' career for all time greatest all you can do is to look at how he compares to the drivers he races against. The general consensus is that Alonso and Hamilton are the two best drivers at the min but in which order I am not sure. And I think most people would agree that if Lewis or Fernando had been driving a Red Bull (but not as team matessmile)they would of won the championship all ready.

One thing that is for sure is how Lewis polarises opinions amongst fans which I don't quite understand, maybe its because some people think he has had it to easy or visits the stewards to much and for some people maybe it just because he is black, who knows. One simple stat is that in all but one the seasons Hamilton has been in F1 he has been a championship contender up to the last race. Now this either shows that Lewis is a good driver always at the top, or shows that he can't get the job done, which one it is I don't know.

Instead I feel the question to ask is not will he be the greatest, but in your opinion why won't he be. For me at the min he makes to many mistakes which gets him into to much trouble with the Stewards.


kiteless

9,924 posts

170 months

Saturday 13th November 2010
quotequote all
GOAT?

God Of All Time?

Sorry, but that title has been patented (vicariously through Colin Edwards) by this guy:



Sorry to piss on your chips, OP.