Flemke - Is this your McLaren? (Vol 5)

Flemke - Is this your McLaren? (Vol 5)

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Discussion

Patrick Bateman

10,964 posts

123 months

Tuesday 7th January
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Sway said:
Oh my, thanks - hadn't seen that before.

In fact, don't recall seeing anything that gave an impression of the noise in the cabin giving it some beans - I think I've just had an accident...

Nine years - blimey. I had a full head of hair back then - and none on my back!
https://youtu.be/haVCTy8mfsQ?t=400

You're welcome.

Sway

13,192 posts

143 months

Tuesday 7th January
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And...

I'm spent.

Cheers! That deserves a beer if you're ever near Goodwood!

Veeayt

2,907 posts

154 months

Wednesday 8th January
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S1KRR said:
Sway said:
If I remember correctly, back in the "good old days" of EVO, Flemke's F1 was 'reviewed' (or perhaps, "experienced" is a better term).

Got a feeling Dickie Meaden was the driver.

Crikey, it feels like a long time ago - really racking my memory!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k7cKvZMLQnQ

Without the famous quote sadly.

"..but the engines quite good" biggrin

Edited by S1KRR on Tuesday 7th January 21:52
That article was the reason I joined pistonheads

lauda

1,740 posts

156 months

Wednesday 8th January
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I’ve just read John Barker’s piece in Octane this month on the evolution of Ferrari’s supercars from the 288 GTO to the LaFerrari (and a very good piece it is too, accompanied by stunning photography).

When discussing the F50, he notes that it’s ‘way better’ to drive than it’s contemporary, the McLaren F1.

Flemke, I know you don’t think the standard F1 is perfect but have you ever driven an F50? If so, would you consider it a better drive (ignoring brand, build quality and other factors that you’d consider as an owner but would be less important for someone who just wanted to drive the better car) than the F1, in both original spec and taking account of the modifications you’ve made to yours?

Caddyshack

1,759 posts

155 months

Wednesday 8th January
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A few people who drove Flemke's F1 and then drove the CGT said the CGT was the better drive (My friend Tim R drove them around the roads near the ring and the F1 scared him whereas he loved the CGT - I think he had a fair bit of seat time in both)

EVO had the CGT and F1 at Bedford and Gordon Murray hitched a ride home in the F1

I think this is all public knowledge as has been in the Mag so not breaking any confidences (but will delete if Flemke wants me to)

S1KRR

11,096 posts

161 months

Wednesday 8th January
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Caddyshack said:
A few people who drove Flemke's F1 and then drove the CGT said the CGT was the better drive (My friend Tim R drove them around the roads near the ring and the F1 scared him whereas he loved the CGT - I think he had a fair bit of seat time in both)

EVO had the CGT and F1 at Bedford and Gordon Murray hitched a ride home in the F1

I think this is all public knowledge as has been in the Mag so not breaking any confidences (but will delete if Flemke wants me to)
Not a massive surprise given the development periods laugh


trackdemon

10,375 posts

210 months

Wednesday 8th January
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Tbf the F1 had a different design philosophy from the outside anyway - the worlds greatest GT, it's astonishing performance just happening to be a byproduct of an outstanding and overachieving engine married to incredible detail in the design making it so light and compact. It had three seats for a reason. The CGT & F50 were more conventionally designed as out and out super sportscars, with all the compromises that entails. You could argue (as Flemke has!) that the F1 driving experience was compromised by it's chassis philosophy - too soft, lateral yaw, tall tyres, etc - which probably made it more habitable long distance.

Patrick Bateman

10,964 posts

123 months

Wednesday 8th January
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I'd imagine they would also help enjoy it more on the road too in terms of actually communicating with you.


flemke

22,212 posts

186 months

Wednesday 8th January
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Patrick Bateman said:
This may well have been asked before but have you ever considered lending your car to Harry Metcalfe for the day...?

A Harry's Garage on the McLaren F1 would be pinnacle.
I am not sure that I would "lend" (as in, "Off you go, see you in a few hours!") it to anyone.
I cannot recall what year it was, maybe 2006, but back when evo were doing their 100th issue, they had a readers' poll to determine what were the best or mostest or something cars. After the results were in, they did two features on examples of the ten cars. One feature was a track test at Bedford (where I made the comment to Richard Meaden; also where, as someone above referenced, we met up with Gordon and I gave him the ride from there back to his home in Surrey). The other was a two day group test up in Yorkshire.
Harry was the central figure in the latter event. He organised where we kept the cars, where we stayed, and what roads we used. A few of the evo guys came out with me in the F1. I recall Richard's and Jethro's coming with me. John Barker definitely did not come out with me. I cannot recall whether Harry did or did not do so.
I don't know what this "Harry's Garage" thing is. I suppose I should check it out.

bolidemichael

1,711 posts

150 months

Wednesday 8th January
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flemke said:
I don't know what this "Harry's Garage" thing is. I suppose I should check it out.
It's the youtube channel of Harry Metcalfe which capitalises on his genial nature and enthusiast of petrol driven vehicles (in the main). The video on the SL600 is a great watch, as are many others. It's one that I return to time and again - he isn't self-obsessed.

flemke

22,212 posts

186 months

Wednesday 8th January
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lauda said:
I’ve just read John Barker’s piece in Octane this month on the evolution of Ferrari’s supercars from the 288 GTO to the LaFerrari (and a very good piece it is too, accompanied by stunning photography).

When discussing the F50, he notes that it’s ‘way better’ to drive than it’s contemporary, the McLaren F1.

Flemke, I know you don’t think the standard F1 is perfect but have you ever driven an F50? If so, would you consider it a better drive (ignoring brand, build quality and other factors that you’d consider as an owner but would be less important for someone who just wanted to drive the better car) than the F1, in both original spec and taking account of the modifications you’ve made to yours?
The two cars were designed to quite different briefs, so you cannot necessarily say that one is "better" than the other.
At one stage, back in 2000, I thought about buying an F50 instead of an F1 (the F1 was my first choice, but at the time none was for sale anywhere). I went out to Bob Houghton's to see an F50 that he had for sale. I did not drive it.
There were things about the F50 that were very appealing (such as the engine and the seats), but the bonnet was too ugly and that monstrosity of a rear wing was just beyond the pale - it was a deal-breaker.
In general, I have found myself disagreeing with John Barker's car reviews probably more often than I have disagreed with the opinions of any other car reviewer. That doesn't mean that I'm right and he's wrong, but clearly we appreciate different things.

I'll offer an opinion on the F50 from a different expert. Back when the CGT was a new car, I was having dinner with that car's project manager. He was relating how he made some of the most fundamental decisions about the car.
He told me that, at first, Porsche were considering mounting the engine solidly to the chassis. To get a sense of how this would work in the real world, the project manager (IIRC, Michael Holscher) borrowed a customer's F50. He was loaned the car for an hour to drive around the German countryside.
He said that, after he had driven the F50 for only 15 minutes, it was obvious to him that "Porsche could not build a road car that was so harsh and unpleasant." He turned around and drove back to the starting point, handing back the car 30 minutes before it was due. He said that, although it might sound crazy that he would volunteer to give up the chance to drive an F50 for another half-hour, he was very happy to get out of the car and never have to get back into it again.
I can assure you that I have never felt that way about the F1!

flemke

22,212 posts

186 months

Wednesday 8th January
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Caddyshack said:
A few people who drove Flemke's F1 and then drove the CGT said the CGT was the better drive (My friend Tim R drove them around the roads near the ring and the F1 scared him whereas he loved the CGT - I think he had a fair bit of seat time in both)

EVO had the CGT and F1 at Bedford and Gordon Murray hitched a ride home in the F1

I think this is all public knowledge as has been in the Mag so not breaking any confidences (but will delete if Flemke wants me to)
The CGT and F1, like the F50 relative to the F1, are quite different.
All I can say, having driven a lot of miles in both, is that although the CGT is faster around the track, driving the F1 is much more involving. If I had 100 chances to drive either car, i would choose the F1 95 times and the CGT 5 times.
Driving the F1 is like driving nothing else, whereas all the other cars (within my experience) are variations of each other.

stevesingo

3,792 posts

171 months

Wednesday 8th January
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flemke said:
I am not sure that I would "lend" (as in, "Off you go, see you in a few hours!") it to anyone.
Not even swapsies for my car for an hour?

Oh well, £2 on a EuroMillions ticket it is then (more chance in that than me becoming sufficiently bright enough and hard working to earn the chance). frown

Caddyshack

1,759 posts

155 months

Thursday 9th January
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flemke said:
Caddyshack said:
A few people who drove Flemke's F1 and then drove the CGT said the CGT was the better drive (My friend Tim R drove them around the roads near the ring and the F1 scared him whereas he loved the CGT - I think he had a fair bit of seat time in both)

EVO had the CGT and F1 at Bedford and Gordon Murray hitched a ride home in the F1

I think this is all public knowledge as has been in the Mag so not breaking any confidences (but will delete if Flemke wants me to)
The CGT and F1, like the F50 relative to the F1, are quite different.
All I can say, having driven a lot of miles in both, is that although the CGT is faster around the track, driving the F1 is much more involving. If I had 100 chances to drive either car, i would choose the F1 95 times and the CGT 5 times.
Driving the F1 is like driving nothing else, whereas all the other cars (within my experience) are variations of each other.
I would agree that even with the values at peanuts I would still find the F1 more special in my eyes due to the design brief and central driving position etc. Always enjoyed seeing yours when I visited our friend in Egham. We keep meaning to go out in the CGT and he wants me to do something on it for the ride height switch at some stage so will see.

vincegail

2,110 posts

104 months

Thursday 9th January
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Went to see the "So British" exhibition in Autoworld museum Brussels today. I would be very annoyed if my 20 million quid car would have a blemished rearview mirror. Are those not stock items from a '80s or '90s regular middle class car? Can it not be replaced or repared?








hurstg01

2,677 posts

192 months

Thursday 9th January
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vincegail said:
Went to see the "So British" exhibition in Autoworld museum Brussels today. I would be very annoyed if my 20 million quid car would have a blemished rearview mirror. Are those not stock items from a '80s or '90s regular middle class car? Can it not be replaced or repared?







Lovely thing, it was BMW's own car on the stand

hurstg01

2,677 posts

192 months

Thursday 9th January
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I haven't driven either, but have been driven in both.

From a passengers point of view, as that is more likely an event than a drivers point of view for me anyway, the F1 was more special. The CGT made the hairs on the back of my neck rise up, but the F1 made me smile more and lasts my memory better, especially when the driver was testing his new brakes and then being followed a little later by the boys in blue for a while....;) (I think they just wanted a look rather than writing a ticket).

Both sounds were beautiful :the V10 a higher pitch than the throatier V12, and when I was in a road-converted GTR the gearbox whine was raucous especially 'at speed', but what surprised me most when out in any of the F1's was the deceleration when you are off the throttle, more than I was expecting.

When I was in the CGT it was only a short ride, a pootle round town and a quick blast along a few country roads [coincidentally ending up at a storage place that had some F1's in it] but I loved the experience and theatre of it.

F1GTRUeno

4,248 posts

167 months

Friday 10th January
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vincegail said:
Went to see the "So British" exhibition in Autoworld museum Brussels today. I would be very annoyed if my 20 million quid car would have a blemished rearview mirror. Are those not stock items from a '80s or '90s regular middle class car? Can it not be replaced or repared?







Did anywhere say how long the exhibition is on for?

vincegail

2,110 posts

104 months

Friday 10th January
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F1GTRUeno said:
Did anywhere say how long the exhibition is on for?
January 26th is the last day smile

F1natic

52 posts

5 months

Friday 10th January
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Odd question for the day - I am very curious about the passenger seating position and long distance comfort in the F1. If the driver is "making progress" how do passengers typically brace themselves for corners and braking? Do they raise their feet so that their toes are above the carbon fibre inner chassis spars and push themselves back into the seat thereby wedging themselves securely?

In those cases where the trip is more relaxed what distance can passengers handle typically before a rest stop and stretch is required?

I am not surprised that every video I have seen from the passengers viewpoint typically is out the front windshield or back at their grinning faces.