RE: BMW M140i Finale says bye to rear-drive six-pot

[SOL111]

nickfrog said:

You're not the only one to say this but I don't agree, I think it's well judged for a "mini-GT", wheel and camber control were pretty good, but it's soft and probably slightly under damped but not catastrophically so IME. They had to optimise traction because of the lack of LSD, which is a must on those cars, like on many cars IME. I do think the LCI cars were an improvement on the suspension kinematics front though, so perhaps yours was a pre LCI ?

I guess it's down to personal preference but the floatiness was one of the worst aspects of the car. Hit a slight dip in the road at speed and the car felt horrific and less than confidence inspiring.

I drive mainly back roads to work, with a lot of dips, crests, sweeping bends and changes in surface quality. I got tired of pushing it as it just wasn't enjoyable. Shame really as I've driven many less sorted cars over the years and my M140 was the worst of the lot.

[bodhi]

kambites said:

Did you really just say one car is faster than another car as long as the other car doesn't bother to accelerate?

If the other guy were to wait for a couple of seconds before flooring it, by which time the old fashioned N/A was already wound up into the fun part, then yes it would be quicker

It's worth doing a similar exercise coming off a roundabout at the same time as an i3 just outside Birmingham, makes you wonder where these claims it's the fastest accelerating car BMW have ever made come from

[JackReacher]

The suspension issues are well documented, and many seem to go Bilstein B12/B16 or the Birds route. I'll get there eventually.

[xjay1337]

joedesi said:

Bad points -

- thirsty

Average MPG over 8,000 miles for me (including 4 trackdays) is 32.2
What's yours been bud?

[nickfrog]

SOL111 said:

I guess it's down to personal preference but the floatiness was one of the worst aspects of the car. Hit a slight dip in the road at speed and the car felt horrific and less than confidence inspiring.

I drive mainly back roads to work, with a lot of dips, crests, sweeping bends and changes in surface quality. I got tired of pushing it as it just wasn't enjoyable. Shame really as I've driven many less sorted cars over the years and my M140 was the worst of the lot.

Fitting M4 LCAs is a quick and cheap fix. It transforms the front end and adds steering feel. It also makes the car (almost) neutral.

[HM-2]

bodhi said:

kambites said:

Did you really just say one car is faster than another car as long as the other car doesn't bother to accelerate?

If the other guy were to wait for a couple of seconds before flooring it, by which time the old fashioned N/A was already wound up into the fun part, then yes it would be quicker

An F20 M140i is a full two seconds faster 30-70 than an E87 130i. A "couple of seconds" is a pretty long time; if the M140i driver were to accelerate within a second or so (and the road was dry enough to maintain traction ) they'd have no trouble reeling back in either a 130i or a 125i with a remap.

[TWPC]

I hope one day I will have a used M135i or M140i and will take it to Birds to sort the suspension. Don't mind the gawky looks and love the whole big engine/rear drive/small car concept. Will it ever be repeated?

My neighbour had a Merc C63 estate (the last generation with a nasp 6.2l V8). He replaced it with an M140i which he said he preferred and felt was as quick as the C63.

[SOL111]

nickfrog said:

Fitting M4 LCAs is a quick and cheap fix. It transforms the front end and adds steering feel. It also makes the car (almost) neutral.

That's the thing, or was for me.

I've read about the M4 LCAs and also how Bilsteins transform the car (amongst other relatively cheap upgrades).

BMW could have done this easily bit feel they didn't, purposely to maintain a distance from the M2.

[Luke.]

TWPC said:

My neighbour had a Merc C63 estate (the last generation with a nasp 6.2l V8). He replaced it with an M140i which he said he preferred and felt was as quick as the C63.

Interesting, did he say why he preferred it?

[nickfrog]

SOL111 said:

nickfrog said:

Fitting M4 LCAs is a quick and cheap fix. It transforms the front end and adds steering feel. It also makes the car (almost) neutral.

BMW could have done this easily bit feel they didn't, purposely to maintain a distance from the M2.

Correct. And the beauty of it is that the parts are just £200, can be fitted in an hour either at home or probably for less than £100 Labour and alignment. What's not to like ?

[3795mpower]

“Ultimate hero spec 1series” is a manual is it ?

From the same mob that moan about notchy manual boxes ?

Make your minds up !

[cerb4.5lee]

bodhi said:

ITP said:

Must say, much as I like the idea of the m135/140 I think what may be a more fun road car would be a nice 2dr 125i coupe from the 08-13 era, the one with the 3.0 N52. A manual of course. With the remap to make it the same as the 130i. I think that would be plenty fast enough, and more fun using the revs rather than torque surfing of the turbo cars.
Less bork factor too and much less likely to be robbed as an extra benefit.

I'd ignore Lee's theory the old N/A lump doesn't have any torque. I've got a 125i with the remap and with anything above 1500 rpm you can put your foot down and it will go - and they are quick enough at the top end to leave an M140i for dead if they aren't entirely paying attention

Don't ask me how I know however....

Granted I do have a slight issue with the torque(but that's only because I've been used to more torquey cars so perhaps unfair). What does annoy me with Bmw's N/A engines is that max power is so high 6600rpm(N52)/7900rpm(S54)/8300rpm(S65)...so you have to be absolutely thrashing them to death to get the best from them. Plus they have nothing low down because of it.

Those characteristics are great for a track but for me they don't work that well on the road. I appreciate why most do find a N/A engine more rewarding overall. They're just not for me personally and I like an engine to feel gutsy and give you plenty of shove when you put your foot down...rather than you having to drop several cogs to get the revs right up.

Maybe I've just got lazy as I've got older though!

[aww999]

Luke. said:

TWPC said:

My neighbour had a Merc C63 estate (the last generation with a nasp 6.2l V8). He replaced it with an M140i which he said he preferred and felt was as quick as the C63.

Interesting, did he say why he preferred it?

I had a 6.2 C63 estate for a while and my current M140 is much quicker across the rev range. It doesn't sound anywhere near as good though, and has zero steering feel! I don't drive it enough to comment on suspension and damping though.

[freeform]

A bit late in the thread with this sentiment but....

The only possible justifcation to buy a small BMW is soon to vanish.

From that day on, any luke-warm to hot hatch will do just as well.

Edited by freeform on Tuesday 12th February 12:18

[J4CKO]

TWPC said:

I hope one day I will have a used M135i or M140i and will take it to Birds to sort the suspension. Don't mind the gawky looks and love the whole big engine/rear drive/small car concept. Will it ever be repeated?

My neighbour had a Merc C63 estate (the last generation with a nasp 6.2l V8). He replaced it with an M140i which he said he preferred and felt was as quick as the C63.

Believable as the M140i does 0-100 in 9.9 vs 9.2 for the C63 standard vs standard, and they are the same drive layout, slight advantage to the Merc having a limited slip diff.

Its not night and day differences, plus the M140i can have a map or tuning box and gain somewhere between 50 and 80 bhp.

Not to take anything from the C63 as straight line performance is only part of the story, the BMW sounds quite nice, but the Merc sounds apocalyptic.

Anyway, I like the looks of the one Series, never understood what all the fuss was about its ugliness, still do like it. Its a great all rounder if a little aloof at times, I am using manual mode on the auto a lot more and its not like having a manual but it helps.

I think they will perhaps end up a bit of a cult car, plenty to go at, 6000 odd M135i's and 9000 M140is listed on Howmanyleft.

[JackReacher]

J4CKO said:

I think they will perhaps end up a bit of a cult car, plenty to go at, 6000 odd M135i's and 9000 M140is listed on Howmanyleft.

Agree I think they will, quite big sales numbers, but haven't quite reached the levels of the EP3 type R which got to 19,000.

Interestingly only 15% of the BMWs are manual, I wonder how that will play out longer term on values. Just 471 m240i manuals and 1,100 m140.

[PTF]

JackReacher said:

J4CKO said:

I think they will perhaps end up a bit of a cult car, plenty to go at, 6000 odd M135i's and 9000 M140is listed on Howmanyleft.

Agree I think they will, quite big sales numbers, but haven't quite reached the levels of the EP3 type R which got to 19,000.

Interestingly only 15% of the BMWs are manual, I wonder how that will play out longer term on values. Just 471 m240i manuals and 1,100 m140.

Still lots. There were only 80 or so 130i sold in SE spec without the //M badges everywhere.

[JackReacher]

PTF said:

Still lots. There were only 80 or so 130i sold in SE spec without the //M badges everywhere.

True, but you could remove the badges from a m140i, fit body coloured mirrors and you have something that looks like a 120d but goes like a 911 (on the straights at least)

[Cups Renault]

A sad day that has been in the offing for a year or two.

A unique car and as previously said here, good on BMW for doing it. A very underrated car in a see of 4 pot over turboed 4wds.
The sound and ingear acceleration is beyond cars of its ilk, the rwd a challenge accepted by drivers not wanting to drive like they are playing a computer game.

Started with a manual 135i coupe which admittedly I sold too soon and another future classic. It was a true mini GT. The m135i was great but flawed as others have said by dampening but the zf box a revelation for mixed use, work and firing through the gears on a blat.

My m140i with adaptive is certainly part way to sorting the suspension issues but perhaps needs springs still, lsd would be good but costwise and Vs money going into a Litchfield tune I cannot stretch to it.
The noise with a BMW performance box is a thing of wonder and I will be keeping it on in a year when the finance runs down.

Nothing out there at all that comes close to balancing butish performance of the b58, the noise, (and the economy on a run!),the rwd and the sense of difference Vs other over hyped 4 pot fart and pop wagons. Some of the ingear and track times have been utterly at odds with some of the reviews by press possibly given some good bunce layed out by vag and ford.

BMW seem to compound their poor decesions over and over at present.
But cheers for creating a sweet spot for many including myself. A great car of character.

[ITP]

freeform said:

A bit late in the thread with this sentiment but....

The only possible justifcation to buy a small BMW is soon to vanish.

From that day on, any luke-warm to hot hatch will do just as well.

Edited by freeform on Tuesday 12th February 12:18

I do agree with this.
The USP will be gone. I’ve had 4 BMW’s, all straight 6, really can’t get excited about a 4 cyl one. There is no point paying a premium to me, the build quality isn’t any better than mainstream brands, hasn’t been for a long time.

Not singling our BMW here, Mercedes quality dipped 20 years ago.