RE: Land Rover Defender | Frankfurt 2019

[anonymous-user]

Love it.

Green 110SE incoming to replace Mrs B’s FFRR

[spreadsheet monkey]

abzmike said:

wl606 said:

It looks rather nice.

And what is the 4x4 of choice these days for a not overly rich farmer?

Judging by the farmers round my way a Mitsubishi.

Yep. Farmers can have a Hilux or L200, which serves their needs well. LR is (rightly or wrongly) not targeting the £20k utility 4x4 market.

Richard Porter summarises the Defender and its pricing very accurately here. It’s for upper middle class families, not farmers.

https://www.evo.co.uk/opinion/22767/it-s-time-ever...

[petemurphy]

doesnt seem to come in a british racing type green just that orrible light green

[Kawasicki]

Great job, Land Rover!

[Jader1973]

snake_oil said:

They've nailed it. I love that. Should have been the new Disco though!

It is. Gerry McGovern said that the Defender will allow them to do look at what the Discovery is.

So basically they’ve replaced the old Discovery with the new Defender, and now they can move Discovery in a different direction, which they’d already done with the D5 anyway.

[petemurphy]

oooh hamster has reviewed it

https://drivetribe.com/p/ive-been-to-see-the-new-l...

[Ed.]

bakerstreet said:

anonymous said:

[redacted]

It is, but LR's future can't be pinned on this new Defender and they know that. My guess is they will be saved by the SUV built on a compact BMW platform.

Is a future with the cash cows being built abroad good UK jobs or does it make the UK seem less viable?

Hope it sells well and the 85 ecu's behave themselves.

[SloWill]

It might be very good but I can't see how it fits into the existing range unless it takes sales away from other models.
I looked around to see if it was just me but this guy seems to think so:
https://www.am-online.com/opinion/2019/03/08/new-l...

[Matt-gygen]

"with off-road tyres fitted"

They sell them without?

[Sandpit Steve]

spreadsheet monkey said:

Yep. Farmers can have a Hilux or L200, which serves their needs well. LR is (rightly or wrongly) not targeting the £20k utility 4x4 market.

Richard Porter summarises the Defender and its pricing very accurately here. It’s for upper middle class families, not farmers.

https://www.evo.co.uk/opinion/22767/it-s-time-ever...

So it’s a slightly poorer man’s G-wagen - along with numerous other vehicles from a whole host of manufacturers, designed to look good outside the school gates rather than with two sheep in the back.

Shame they chose that route IMO, would have preferred something closer to the utilitarian original to compete with the Japanese rather than the Germans.

[Nerdherder]

petemurphy said:

love it will be ordering when funds allow

Just jumped on the configurator.
It's a NO for me in terms of cost unfortunately. (Dutch prices)

covmutley said:

Looks amazing. Would be a brilliant family vehicle.
Shame I cant afford it. I'm surprised it's so much more than the disco sport.

Yeah, so it will be a sport for me as well. Hope they'll revise the sport to make it look more like the new Disco in its next generation!

Edited by Nerdherder on Tuesday 10th September 10:36

[Augustus Windsock]

Quite warming to it overall but not the price I’m afraid.
Personally the only tweak I’d have wished for was the front having an obvious link to the old Defender, for instance fully-round headlights and indicators/ side lights stacked individually and vertically on the front wing
Oh and being silly, a spare wheel & tyre on the bonnet (surely it would help in collisions with pedestrians, giving them something softer to smack their swedes on...?)

[cidered77]

spreadsheet monkey said:

Yep. Farmers can have a Hilux or L200, which serves their needs well. LR is (rightly or wrongly) not targeting the £20k utility 4x4 market.

Richard Porter summarises the Defender and its pricing very accurately here. It’s for upper middle class families, not farmers.

https://www.evo.co.uk/opinion/22767/it-s-time-ever...

I do think they might have nailed this one. It looks like a modern recreation of a Defender to me - much better than early concept attempts, and don't those steelies look great?

it's also i think without obvious competitors - what else can give you semblance of comfort *and* be this good offroad? G Wagen? Much more money...

And of course very few people who buy it will need or use the offroad abilities - but that's hardly JLR's fault. They need to build cars people will buy - not build on principles or misplaced nostalgia from a past that isn't coming back.

I know a few people with supercars (McLarens, Ferraris, and the like): and none/few of them take them on track, or if they do - its once in a blue moon. So you have cars that can corner at 1.5G+, have active aero, can lap the ring in sub 7:30 - and they spend their lives on sundays drives or being shown off at Cars and Coffee events. Those cars aren't being used for the capabilities they were designed for - do i have a problem with it? No! I still turn my head like a car mad 10 year from the 80s when one goes by...

I have modest road cars because all spare income goes into racing. But that's my thing, and i don't expect everyone to think the same way. If you're in need of a truly hardcore offroader because you compete or you are one of these fabled farmers - you arent going to buy new no matter what, you're going to get something cheap, sturdy, repairable, light - and very unrefined. Just like my racecar is relative to a 488 (and it's faster too ).

People have more disposable income now and finance is cheap... and there is way more competition than when the original turned up. So it's pitched at the middle classes who don't *need* this ability, but will want it anyway. Look at all the niches and sub niches that are around today (Cayenne coupe!?); they're made because whether Pistonheads likes it or not, people want to express themselves and show off through ever more personalised purchases. 40 years ago most of us picked from about 40 different kids names and 3 different types of cars made by maybe 10 manufacturers - you can add zeros to those now.

Whether we like it or not - it's happening, so JLR are cashing in on it. I reckon they'll sell plenty...

[monarodom]

6 cylinder in a base spec 90 would do for me, not that it looks like you can spec it that way at the minute!

[Water Fairy]

I fear this has lost the ethos of the original

[RacerMike]

For me, base spec 90 on steelies would be the winner. And they start at £40,290 which seems really pretty reasonable, and given the fact the residuals are probably going to be strong, I bet you it will be very, very affordable on finance.

[anonymous-user]

Water Fairy said:

I fear this has lost the ethos of the original

Because the addressable market has lost a requirement for the original in any meaningful volumes

[austinsmirk]

it's decades off being cheap enough for Trevor to buy, put some yellow light bars on, get a CB radio and be able to tug people off in winter time.

With the security of a weak lemon drink in his unbreakable snoopy thermos flask. that his mum made. that he still lives with.

[spreadsheet monkey]

Brooking10 said:

Water Fairy said:

I fear this has lost the ethos of the original

Because the addressable market has lost a requirement for the original in any meaningful volumes

^^ Exactly this

Richard Porter in Evo said:

This is how Land Rover will survive in these tricky times, by making an expensive car that sells to well-heeled people for more than it costs to make, not by delivering on some deluded 1950s yeomanry fantasy for PC-bound pundits who aren’t going to buy one anyway.

I know nothing about the actual spec of the new Defender, but I’m going to say with confidence, it won’t be cheap, it won’t be basic and it won’t like it at all if you turn a hose on the interior. If you’re holding out for any of that you’re ignoring what will make it sell and what will keep the company making it alive.

[covmutley]

Looks amazing. Would be a brilliant family vehicle.

Shame I cant afford it. I'm surprised it's so much more than the disco sport.