Stupid maintenance requirements
Discussion
boyse7en said:
offset said:
Makes me smile, there is the reason why we love old cars, simple to fix, no ecus, no electric devices, (2cv,austin mini, etc)
You obviously never had to change the clutch in a Mini. You were lucky to walk away with any skin on your hands after several hours of swearing at inaccessible bolts.Renault are bad for this mk2 megane could do it without removing the wheel if you were prepared to bleed, mk3 megane 250 headlight out job but actually easy/quick to do. Mk3 clio RS 200 supposed to be a bumper off job but is possible by again being prepared to bleed and swear a lot and removing screen wash filler air intakes and battery/fuse box covers to give an extra few mm for big hands.
Johnnytheboy said:
Clio 172s/182s deserve an honourable mention for having an aux belt at 3 year intervals AND a cambelt at 5 year intervals. The latter IIRC was something like £600.
The good news being that more often than not when the aux belt goes it wipes out the cam belt 😂Aux belt is an easy job in comparison to the cam belt. Wheel off and arch liner removed at a maximum
SimeRS said:
Renault are bad for this mk2 megane could do it without removing the wheel if you were prepared to bleed, mk3 megane 250 headlight out job but actually easy/quick to do. Mk3 clio RS 200 supposed to be a bumper off job but is possible by again being prepared to bleed and swear a lot and removing screen wash filler air intakes and battery/fuse box covers to give an extra few mm for big hands.
Yeah the headlight is easy to unfasten from the body and it would slide out... except they give you about 1 inch of slack on the loom and the plug is orientated with the clip on the bottom where you can't easily get your finger to it. Brilliant, thanks for that.Pales into insignificance compared to changing a pollen filter... simple job I assume on a LHD drive one where it's accessed from the passenger footwell. Not so much on a RHD. You have to remove the clutch pedal and then thread the filter through a hole smaller than the filter itself, and you have to do it blind/by feel while contorted in the footwell.
Edited by Nealio on Sunday 21st March 12:40
The C6 RS6 comes to mind here.
50p oil pump o ring, most wont do it without removing the engine. 50p part, £3,500 labour. Luckily there are metal fluid lines behind the driver side wheel liner which corrode like hell. Also an engine out job.
The official Audi service documents also say that to change the rear two spark plugs, you have to lift the engine about an inch. Can be done simply with just sliding some extensions in one at a time iirc.
Q7 4L requires passenger seat removed to get to the battery I think?
50p oil pump o ring, most wont do it without removing the engine. 50p part, £3,500 labour. Luckily there are metal fluid lines behind the driver side wheel liner which corrode like hell. Also an engine out job.
The official Audi service documents also say that to change the rear two spark plugs, you have to lift the engine about an inch. Can be done simply with just sliding some extensions in one at a time iirc.
Q7 4L requires passenger seat removed to get to the battery I think?
Freaking side light on a Suzuki Grand Vitara, I don’t know much about cars but I can do most jobs with a little guidance from the inter webs.
I didn’t know a side light fault was a MOT failure and stupidly thought all I would have to do was open the bonnet and swap the bulb from the holder. Googled it and realise it was an MOT failure and cue me stripping the dam bumper grill and god knows what else in the dark for the retest.
Any car manufacturer that can’t design an easy bulb change needs flogging!
I didn’t know a side light fault was a MOT failure and stupidly thought all I would have to do was open the bonnet and swap the bulb from the holder. Googled it and realise it was an MOT failure and cue me stripping the dam bumper grill and god knows what else in the dark for the retest.
Any car manufacturer that can’t design an easy bulb change needs flogging!
RizzoTheRat said:
Somewhat out of scope of the thread, but I came across an article the other day on US Coast Guard Icebreaker that had an engine fire and had to replace the engine. This involved cutting out a massive section of the hull and welding it back up afterwards Makes working on cars seem simple.
Definitely out the scope of this thread but still the same about ill thought out design. My wife used to run an oil rig out in the North Sea. They had two Jet turbine engines onboard to produce power. One of them st the bed whist she was on shift. Unfortunately the turbine was underneath an additional module they had laced on top of the rig.
Apparently they ended up cutting holes through floors and ceilings of multiple levels of the new module so they could get the crane in to pull the unserviceable engine out.
The other option was to completely remove a whole module from a North Sea oil platform to gain access. I don’t want to know what the bill was for that job.
Renault Modus is a nightmare to do almost anything on. It's basically a Clio with the windscreen moved 8 inches forward.
Front bumper off to access most of the bulbs. Scuttle panels off (two of them, on top of each other) to even get to the oil filler cap (the yellow cap in the pic is the dipstick). Oil filter is crammed down the front of the engine and God help you if it's been put on tight because there's no room to get tools on it. Once I had to hammer a screwdriver onto the dimpled edges of the filter case to get it to loosen enough to remove by hand. Once it's loose you have to basically drop it into the bottom of the bumper and collect it from underneath. No point wearing gloves because they'll be doilies by the time you pull your arm out. I was definitely a rank amateur DIYer back when I was working on these but I wouldn't ever touch another.
Charming little cars; my parents had three Moduses (Modii?) at one stage. But I'm glad I don't have to work on them any more!
Gooose said:
Freaking side light on a Suzuki Grand Vitara, I don’t know much about cars but I can do most jobs with a little guidance from the inter webs.
I didn’t know a side light fault was a MOT failure and stupidly thought all I would have to do was open the bonnet and swap the bulb from the holder. Googled it and realise it was an MOT failure and cue me stripping the dam bumper grill and god knows what else in the dark for the retest.
Any car manufacturer that can’t design an easy bulb change needs flogging!
You’re welcome to come and have a go at designing and packaging a lamp into a car anytime you like. It’ll take about 3 years from sketch to launch though so bring some sandwiches and a flask.I didn’t know a side light fault was a MOT failure and stupidly thought all I would have to do was open the bonnet and swap the bulb from the holder. Googled it and realise it was an MOT failure and cue me stripping the dam bumper grill and god knows what else in the dark for the retest.
Any car manufacturer that can’t design an easy bulb change needs flogging!
Don’t forget you need to consider the styling, the performance, the lighting layout regulations, the pedestrian safety, the layout of all the other oily engine bits behind it and the Nov doubt existing platform you’re mating it to, the vehicle crash tests, the assembly method, oh and the budget and development schedule.
Trust me, the design engineers don’t make bulbs difficult to change on purpose, it’s just that the serviceability just ends up somewhere on a long list of priorities to be considered during the design process and inevitably compromises end up being made.
Most of the exterior design guys I know are into cars and regularly fight with our own vehicles. We know what an arse it is in when they’re difficult to work on.
Edited by Cyder on Sunday 21st March 23:06
Cyder said:
Trust me, the design engineers don’t make bulbs difficult to change on purpose, it’s just that the serviceability just ends up somewhere on a long list of priorities to be considered during the design process and inevitably compromises end up being made.
Most of the exterior design guys I know are into cars and regularly fight with our own vehicles. We know what an arse it is in when they’re difficult to work on.
But they don't make it easy either do they? Most of the exterior design guys I know are into cars and regularly fight with our own vehicles. We know what an arse it is in when they’re difficult to work on.
Edited by Cyder on Sunday 21st March 23:06
I had to change an Angel Eye bulb on a BMW E90 a couple of years ago and it was a real PITA.
In reality I suspect the design guys are told anything they come up with only has to outlast the warranty anyway.
I just hope some of them run older cars so they get the later-user experience first hand!
Cyder said:
Gooose said:
Freaking side light on a Suzuki Grand Vitara, I don’t know much about cars but I can do most jobs with a little guidance from the inter webs.
I didn’t know a side light fault was a MOT failure and stupidly thought all I would have to do was open the bonnet and swap the bulb from the holder. Googled it and realise it was an MOT failure and cue me stripping the dam bumper grill and god knows what else in the dark for the retest.
Any car manufacturer that can’t design an easy bulb change needs flogging!
You’re welcome to come and have a go at designing and packaging a lamp into a car anytime you like. It’ll take about 3 years from sketch to launch though so bring some sandwiches and a flask.I didn’t know a side light fault was a MOT failure and stupidly thought all I would have to do was open the bonnet and swap the bulb from the holder. Googled it and realise it was an MOT failure and cue me stripping the dam bumper grill and god knows what else in the dark for the retest.
Any car manufacturer that can’t design an easy bulb change needs flogging!
Don’t forget you need to consider the styling, the performance, the lighting layout regulations, the pedestrian safety, the layout of all the other oily engine bits behind it and the Nov doubt existing platform you’re mating it to, the vehicle crash tests, the assembly method, oh and the budget and development schedule.
Trust me, the design engineers don’t make bulbs difficult to change on purpose, it’s just that the serviceability just ends up somewhere on a long list of priorities to be considered during the design process and inevitably compromises end up being made.
Most of the exterior design guys I know are into cars and regularly fight with our own vehicles. We know what an arse it is in when they’re difficult to work on.
Edited by Cyder on Sunday 21st March 23:06
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