How do you store your keyless fob?

[911Spanker]

Love keyless.

Sometimes getting the energy to move my hand into my pocket to lift up my key is just too much.

[JQ]

jdw100 said:

Is it genuinely that high a risk?

No, it’s not even low risk.

It’s the equivalent of a chartered accountant from Beaconsfield permanently wearing a bullet proof vest in the UK. People do get shot, but the chance of it being you is tiny and not worth worrying about.

[Hol]

Pica-Pica said:

Why? I don’t find it so. I leave home, so I have just locked the front door, and the house key and car remote are on the same key-ring and still in my hand. So I just ‘blip’ the car unlocked and put the set (house key and car remote) into my pocket and get in. Then start with the button. On arrival back home, I have to remove the set to open the house door. I can then lock the car at the same time, or even when I have got inside. When out, I can reach in my pocket, and it’s easy to locate the lock or unlock button by feel, barely breaking stride. I never leave my key anywhere in the car other than in my pocket, if there is an emergency, I can leap out, knowing I will have the key on my person.

Exactly this. The only difference is pushing button to get in.

On my wife’s current car you still have to lock the door with the fob anyway.
When we had a fully keyless entry/exit car nobody ever missplaced the key fob and went looking for it, so I call bks on that argument too.

[Hol]

DanL said:

I have a faraday box to keep the keys by the front door when at home. If visiting family and staying overnight I’ll put the keys in a pouch, for the same reason - they keys are near the car and a relay theft would be possible.

Otherwise, they’re in my pocket without any particular protection, and I’m not worried about it. The keys and I will be a good distance from the car wherever I’ve parked, and it’s unlikely the car will be taken as a result. If it is, well - it’s insured.

Same. A faraday box at home for all the family keyless entry fobs.
All other current keyfobs get hung in a small wall key box by the door, and their spares are just loose in a drawer.

If we stay in a hotel we keep a faraday bag in the glovebox just in case the car is outside the room in the car park.

[Puzzles]

Never give it a second thought, I love keyless and don’t use any protection.

[slopes]

Have a faraday pouch for both cars, wasn't so much of an issue when i was in a second floor flat, they would have needed to be Stretch Armstrong to make one of those wand things work there.
New place is different, cars are over the road and there are very few street lights so more of an opportunity if someone really wanted a 2018 Mazda 3 and a 2023 CX-60.

[Gericho]

jdw100 said:

This is all utter madness.

Foil bags?

Is it genuinely that high a risk?

We leave our fob in the car most of the time.

Why don’t the police do something?

Well it clearly is a risk given that so many cars get stolen because of keyless technology. Now instead of going around the residential estates hoping that someone has left their keys unprotected and near enough to the car so you can steal their car, wouldn't it be more fruitful to visit any car park that is close to other buildings and just take it because the over-confident (and willfully ignorant) owners have their keys in their pocket and think nothing is ever going to happen to them.

Why would you leave the key in the car? That is a new level of lunacy I haven't come across before.

[JQ]

Gericho said:

Well it clearly is a risk given that so many cars get stolen because of keyless technology. Now instead of going around the residential estates hoping that someone has left their keys unprotected and near enough to the car so you can steal their car, wouldn't it be more fruitful to visit any car park that is close to other buildings and just take it because the over-confident (and willfully ignorant) owners have their keys in their pocket and think nothing is ever going to happen to them.

Why would you leave the key in the car? That is a new level of lunacy I haven't come across before.

I understand the threat of relay theft at home - the thieves have the cover of darkness (will be wearing gloves and balaclavas), they know roughly where the keys are likely to be stored (by the front door) and they know exactly where the car is that the keys open. So they simply go to houses with attractive cars, with laptop and various electrical gubbins and try to get a signal from the front door. If they fail to get a signal they just move on to the next house.

You're going to have to slowly walk me through how you think this works when I'm in Sainsburys or wandering round town and why you think that's a similar level of risk.

[Robertb]

Mercedes keyless, umm, keys (from 2014 vintage at least) can be deactivated easily with a quick double-click on the lock button which should prevent someone cloning the key signal. It then reactivates when you unlock the car with the unlock button.

[Supersam83]

Sheepshanks said:

Supersam83 said:

Why don't car manufacturers use a pin/password or face ID/touch ID to open and start the car?

If it works for the billions of smartphones worldwide, why can't it work on cars?

Mercedes tried touch ID in some markets. They discontinued it after thieves chopped an owners finger off.

Yeah but that's an extreme case.

Otherwise people would have chopped fingers all over the country when someone steals their mobile phone.

If it was such a problem then I'm sure companies like Apple, Samsung, Google, etc wouldn't be using it.

It seems like a cheap fix for the keyless vehicle issue?

Fingerprint unlock on door handle and fingerprint/face ID unlock to start the car.

[slopes]

JQ said:

Gericho said:

Well it clearly is a risk given that so many cars get stolen because of keyless technology. Now instead of going around the residential estates hoping that someone has left their keys unprotected and near enough to the car so you can steal their car, wouldn't it be more fruitful to visit any car park that is close to other buildings and just take it because the over-confident (and willfully ignorant) owners have their keys in their pocket and think nothing is ever going to happen to them.

Why would you leave the key in the car? That is a new level of lunacy I haven't come across before.

I understand the threat of relay theft at home - the thieves have the cover of darkness (will be wearing gloves and balaclavas), they know roughly where the keys are likely to be stored (by the front door) and they know exactly where the car is that the keys open. So they simply go to houses with attractive cars, with laptop and various electrical gubbins and try to get a signal from the front door. If they fail to get a signal they just move on to the next house.

You're going to have to slowly walk me through how you think this works when I'm in Sainsburys or wandering round town and why you think that's a similar level of risk.

I'm guessing here but you know how thieves use portable contactless machines to scan your wallet and can take £30 a time? I presume that there is a similar thing for car keys, they walk past you and can grab the code from your key fob, then use some technical doohickey, can get into and take your car.

I am guessing here but i am assuming that is what that poster was referring to. I have no idea if that is even possible

[Horbury56]

I have some small metal jars that sweets came in. I keep the keys in one of those in a draw at home at home (although I think they are of the generation that turn themselves off if immobile). When out and about I just keep the fob in my wallet. I live near Bradford, but don't actually go there of course.

[Jimjimhim]

911Spanker said:

Love keyless.

Agreed and with a tiny chance of theft because the car is keyless so it really isn't worth getting bothered about.

[JQ]

slopes said:

JQ said:

Gericho said:

Well it clearly is a risk given that so many cars get stolen because of keyless technology. Now instead of going around the residential estates hoping that someone has left their keys unprotected and near enough to the car so you can steal their car, wouldn't it be more fruitful to visit any car park that is close to other buildings and just take it because the over-confident (and willfully ignorant) owners have their keys in their pocket and think nothing is ever going to happen to them.

Why would you leave the key in the car? That is a new level of lunacy I haven't come across before.

I understand the threat of relay theft at home - the thieves have the cover of darkness (will be wearing gloves and balaclavas), they know roughly where the keys are likely to be stored (by the front door) and they know exactly where the car is that the keys open. So they simply go to houses with attractive cars, with laptop and various electrical gubbins and try to get a signal from the front door. If they fail to get a signal they just move on to the next house.

You're going to have to slowly walk me through how you think this works when I'm in Sainsburys or wandering round town and why you think that's a similar level of risk.

I'm guessing here but you know how thieves use portable contactless machines to scan your wallet and can take £30 a time? I presume that there is a similar thing for car keys, they walk past you and can grab the code from your key fob, then use some technical doohickey, can get into and take your car.

I am guessing here but i am assuming that is what that poster was referring to. I have no idea if that is even possible

I'm no technical wizard, the issues are logistical. If you're the car thief and I'm wandering round Primark :

How do you know where my car is parked?
How do you know what car I drive?
How do know the key you've scanned is mine? I will likely be surrounded by countless people many of whom also have keys in their pockets, how do you precisely target my key?
What will you wear, I would imagine wandering round town in a balaclava waving an antenna at people might garner some attention, or do you plan to provide a perfect photo of yourself to all the CCTV cameras in the shops and car parks?

The reality is, it's far far easier for a thief to trawl round houses under cover of darkness without fear of being disturbed than start following people into shops and pubs.

I would hazard a guess that you're as likely to be struck by lightening as you are to have you car key cloned and car stolen when going about your ordinary day away from your home. Happy to be proven wrong if someone has some stats to suggest this is a huge issue.

Edited by JQ on Friday 29th November 15:23

[slopes]

JQ said:

slopes said:

JQ said:

Gericho said:

Well it clearly is a risk given that so many cars get stolen because of keyless technology. Now instead of going around the residential estates hoping that someone has left their keys unprotected and near enough to the car so you can steal their car, wouldn't it be more fruitful to visit any car park that is close to other buildings and just take it because the over-confident (and willfully ignorant) owners have their keys in their pocket and think nothing is ever going to happen to them.

Why would you leave the key in the car? That is a new level of lunacy I haven't come across before.

I understand the threat of relay theft at home - the thieves have the cover of darkness (will be wearing gloves and balaclavas), they know roughly where the keys are likely to be stored (by the front door) and they know exactly where the car is that the keys open. So they simply go to houses with attractive cars, with laptop and various electrical gubbins and try to get a signal from the front door. If they fail to get a signal they just move on to the next house.

You're going to have to slowly walk me through how you think this works when I'm in Sainsburys or wandering round town and why you think that's a similar level of risk.

I'm guessing here but you know how thieves use portable contactless machines to scan your wallet and can take £30 a time? I presume that there is a similar thing for car keys, they walk past you and can grab the code from your key fob, then use some technical doohickey, can get into and take your car.

I am guessing here but i am assuming that is what that poster was referring to. I have no idea if that is even possible

I'm no technical wizard, the issues are logistical. If you're the car thief and I'm wandering round Primark :

How do you know where my car is parked?
How do you know what car I drive?
How do know the key you've scanned is mine? I will likely be surrounded by countless people many of whom also have keys in their pockets, how do you precisely target my key?
What will you wear, I would imagine wandering round town in a balaclava waving an antenna at people might garner some attention, or do you plan to provide a perfect photo of yourself to all the CCTV cameras in the shops and car parks?

The reality is, it's far far easier for a thief to trawl round houses under cover of darkness without fear of being disturbed than start following people into shops and pubs.

I would hazard a guess that you're as likely to be struck by lightening as you are to have you car key cloned and car stolen when going about your ordinary day away from your home. Happy to be proven wrong if someone has some stats to suggest this is a huge issue.

Edited by JQ on Friday 29th November 15:23

Like i said, i was guessing but that is the only thing i can think they meant and like you, if someone wants to prove me wrong with stats then all well and good.
And if they want to go to that trouble for a 6 year old 86,000 mile Mazda 3 automatic, then i'll let them get on with it.

[GetCarter]

Jimjimhim said:

911Spanker said:

Love keyless.

Agreed and with a tiny chance of theft because the car is keyless so it really isn't worth getting bothered about.

Indeed. Depends where you are I guess. Most people leave their keys in the car here and there has never been a reported car theft from this postcode. When on holiday or very occasional biz trips, I put the key in a Faraday pouch. Wouldn't even dream about doing so at home.

[Gericho]

JQ said:

I'm no technical wizard, the issues are logistical. If you're the car thief and I'm wandering round Primark :

How do you know where my car is parked?
How do you know what car I drive?
How do know the key you've scanned is mine? I will likely be surrounded by countless people many of whom also have keys in their pockets, how do you precisely target my key?
What will you wear, I would imagine wandering round town in a balaclava waving an antenna at people might garner some attention, or do you plan to provide a perfect photo of yourself to all the CCTV cameras in the shops and car parks?

The reality is, it's far far easier for a thief to trawl round houses under cover of darkness without fear of being disturbed than start following people into shops and pubs.

I would hazard a guess that you're as likely to be struck by lightening as you are to have you car key cloned and car stolen when going about your ordinary day away from your home. Happy to be proven wrong if someone has some stats to suggest this is a huge issue.

Edited by JQ on Friday 29th November 15:23

I don't need to know any of that and your questions are based on misunderstanding the premise. Let's say there's a pub car park with some nice keyless motors parked up. There is a very high chance the owners of those cars are in the pub which is only a few meters away. I can just try my luck on any of them and see if a relay boost works. If it does, then that's the car I take.

It's not massively different to finding a set of keys in a small car park and just trying it out until a car flashes and responds.

A multistory car park or somewhere else is different and unlikely to be feasible to do this kind of thing, but definitley smaller places would be easy.

[wyson]

https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/cars/article-1...

Most stolen car in the UK in 2021, 2022 and 2023 was the Ford Fiesta. Top 10 is mostly made up from common boggo motors.

If you read other people's car theft stories on PH, the Police don't care if there is CCTV footage, it's not something they prioritise. One guy, gave tracker details, pinpointing the exact location of his stolen car to the Police, they told him to go and sort it out himself.

Not sure where this notion that the crims care about CCTV came from?

They'll steal a few motors, ps off back to what ever st hole they came from, rinse and repeat, knowing the chance of being caught is very low.

Edited by wyson on Friday 29th November 21:31

[wyson]

Calinours said:

Like so much new tech, full keyless was a solution to a problem that just didn't exist and sadly, as we are all now painfully aware introduced big problems.

What is daft is keyless that needs a key. Full keyless which uses a phone like Tesla, that would make tons of sense. I already leave my wallet at home because of Google Pay.

My phone is backed up to the cloud so if I ever were to lose it, I could just buy a new one and restore everything in 40mins.

I appreciate the pub car park scenario is low risk, but it isn't no risk. Relay theft can be done really subtly. There is one video, the guy wears the antenna under his clothes and waves his arms a bit, like he is stretching. The other guy opens the car door. Whole scenario takes literally 10 seconds and they drive off with the car. In a public place, I don't think I'd even notice them. I couldn't find the stats, beyond articles that state most relay thefts occur overnight from owners driveways. It does mean some occur elsewhere.

Personally, I don't think its ridiculous to buy a faraday bag for £6.99 and use it once in a while to guard against a low risk scenario.

First bit of the video below, they demo how a car can be followed and stolen in a public car park. Guy seems to be on some sort of laptop, waits for the owner to walk away, opens the car, then sticks something in the OBD port. Car is then his.

https://youtu.be/uHIwtiA963M

Edited by wyson on Friday 29th November 22:01

[Geertsen]

troc said:

I wrap my house in tinfoil and only open the door if the security cameras show there is nobody within 200m.

I keep the keys in a safe, underground in a nuclear-proof bunker below my cellar which is lead-lined.

I remove the battery from the key before storing it.

I also surround my car with concrete blocks after parking which I pay the local builder to do. I then insist he gives me the keys to his crane so nobody else can move them.

I employ permanent security to guard the neighbourhood and they are instructed to taser anyone who looks suspicions. Or who might look suspicious on a Tuesday.

So far nobody has stolen my ford fiesta.

Best laugh I’ve had in a while