911 - I've seen the light!
Discussion
So I've never been a Porsche kind of guy. Don't know why, but apart from nearly buying my bosses 911 3.2 Supersport in the red braces era, I've never even thought about having one.
I've got an EV coming in around 6-9 months, and like many people I imagine, during an idle moment in lockdown I constructed a 'bucket list' of cars to have before the petrol dies. I thought (and my friends nagged me) that I really should try a 911. My BMW 650i had been a fabulous daily driver but it was time to let it go after 8 years and 90,000 miles. So I did the only thing a true petrolhead could do and bought a manual 997.1 (arctic silver 61K miles, immaculate condition). I chose this very deliberately as I wanted a 911 that I could daily drive so that I got the most out of it in the 9 months or so I plan to have it, and that ruled out anything older for me. Likewise I didn't want or need the performance of anything newer so I judged that a 997.1 was probably the sweet spot.
I did not drive it before buying, as I don't think that you can tell much from a test drive and usually I hate new cars because they just feel unfamiliar, but I did get it inspected. With the report I was able to negotiate into the asking price discs and pads and new tyres all round, a new tandem pump and fixing a few broken trim clips. Other than that it didn't need anything, The cam deviation data suggested that the IMS bearing was fine and no signs of bore scoring. I will get a low temp thermostat as a precaution at some point soon.
I picked it up today. Why didn't anyone tell me! (Well actually they did, but I didn't listen.) This thing is fabulous. I've had and have some reasonably sporty cars (currently a BAC Mono and I've owned a gen 1 NSX for 15 years), but the 997 can absolutely hold it's head high. I've only had a couple of hours in it so far, but I can see already why people rate them so highly.
Things it has in common with the NSX are a feeling of lightness and an utterly rigid body. Likewise the absence of any slack in the drivetrain. The 997 has more low down torque although the NSX encourages you to rev higher to get that VTec wail. Both feel very analogue and mechanical. The 997 feels tiny and so easy to place and in both the 997 and the NSX you see the humps at the edge of the bonnet which allow you to judge the position perfectly. The 997 has PAS unlike the NSX, and so is easier to park, but the steering feel is still excellent and on a par with the NSX. The interior quality in both is excellent and there isn't a single rattle or squeak. (I've Gliptoned the slight bit of wear on the drivers seat already.)
I'm not sure it needs it but I've got it booked into Center Gravity for a full geo and corner weight setup in a few weeks as I went to make sure it is 100% right. It feels pretty good to me so far though.
I'm going to enjoy driving some familiar B roads and comparing the two, but given how much an NSX costs these days the 997 seems an absolute bargain. I haven't driven a 991, but Porsche engineers must have had a few late nights wondering how to improve on this one.
I've got an EV coming in around 6-9 months, and like many people I imagine, during an idle moment in lockdown I constructed a 'bucket list' of cars to have before the petrol dies. I thought (and my friends nagged me) that I really should try a 911. My BMW 650i had been a fabulous daily driver but it was time to let it go after 8 years and 90,000 miles. So I did the only thing a true petrolhead could do and bought a manual 997.1 (arctic silver 61K miles, immaculate condition). I chose this very deliberately as I wanted a 911 that I could daily drive so that I got the most out of it in the 9 months or so I plan to have it, and that ruled out anything older for me. Likewise I didn't want or need the performance of anything newer so I judged that a 997.1 was probably the sweet spot.
I did not drive it before buying, as I don't think that you can tell much from a test drive and usually I hate new cars because they just feel unfamiliar, but I did get it inspected. With the report I was able to negotiate into the asking price discs and pads and new tyres all round, a new tandem pump and fixing a few broken trim clips. Other than that it didn't need anything, The cam deviation data suggested that the IMS bearing was fine and no signs of bore scoring. I will get a low temp thermostat as a precaution at some point soon.
I picked it up today. Why didn't anyone tell me! (Well actually they did, but I didn't listen.) This thing is fabulous. I've had and have some reasonably sporty cars (currently a BAC Mono and I've owned a gen 1 NSX for 15 years), but the 997 can absolutely hold it's head high. I've only had a couple of hours in it so far, but I can see already why people rate them so highly.
Things it has in common with the NSX are a feeling of lightness and an utterly rigid body. Likewise the absence of any slack in the drivetrain. The 997 has more low down torque although the NSX encourages you to rev higher to get that VTec wail. Both feel very analogue and mechanical. The 997 feels tiny and so easy to place and in both the 997 and the NSX you see the humps at the edge of the bonnet which allow you to judge the position perfectly. The 997 has PAS unlike the NSX, and so is easier to park, but the steering feel is still excellent and on a par with the NSX. The interior quality in both is excellent and there isn't a single rattle or squeak. (I've Gliptoned the slight bit of wear on the drivers seat already.)
I'm not sure it needs it but I've got it booked into Center Gravity for a full geo and corner weight setup in a few weeks as I went to make sure it is 100% right. It feels pretty good to me so far though.
I'm going to enjoy driving some familiar B roads and comparing the two, but given how much an NSX costs these days the 997 seems an absolute bargain. I haven't driven a 991, but Porsche engineers must have had a few late nights wondering how to improve on this one.
Good man
To be fair after 90,000 miles in a 6 series BMW the 997 is going to feel rather good
Steering feel is a beautiful thing to have and much missed in all the newer stuff. Whenever I take my Cayman R out for a drive it’s always the same the first thing I notice before I am at the end of the drive is the bloody lovely steering.
It’s never yet been bettered by anything modern in my fleet.
To be fair after 90,000 miles in a 6 series BMW the 997 is going to feel rather good
Steering feel is a beautiful thing to have and much missed in all the newer stuff. Whenever I take my Cayman R out for a drive it’s always the same the first thing I notice before I am at the end of the drive is the bloody lovely steering.
It’s never yet been bettered by anything modern in my fleet.
Funny the same happened to me this week. Except i have seen the light… again.. this is going to be my 5th 911… after 997.1, a 991.1 a GT3 991.1 then a 991.1 for finally a 991.2 Touring.. after a few years.. i decided i needed something nice but sensible, drivable but not too old.. and got myself a 997.2 C2S in Arctic Silver like yours.
I wanted some purity, some involvement, something compact enough. Reliable enough (…) and that would not break the bank as I don’t have much time to drive my cars anymore.. and i hate to know something nice is there sitting unused.
Car is being prepped a bit like yours, very similar items that needed attention and dealer is getting it ready. 2009 manual car with 44k miles. Inspection gave it the green light.
It needs a new exhaust as the 997.2 is just too quiet in standard form. A new steering wheel because the manuals until 2010 MY came with that godawful triangle one.. and then am thinking some bits and pieces but those are the 2 urgent ones.
Am also thinking a place like centre gravity but maybe closer to London to make sure it’s in tip top shape.. the inspection did not highlight any needs in the suspension department but pretty sure a place like CG would..
I wanted some purity, some involvement, something compact enough. Reliable enough (…) and that would not break the bank as I don’t have much time to drive my cars anymore.. and i hate to know something nice is there sitting unused.
Car is being prepped a bit like yours, very similar items that needed attention and dealer is getting it ready. 2009 manual car with 44k miles. Inspection gave it the green light.
It needs a new exhaust as the 997.2 is just too quiet in standard form. A new steering wheel because the manuals until 2010 MY came with that godawful triangle one.. and then am thinking some bits and pieces but those are the 2 urgent ones.
Am also thinking a place like centre gravity but maybe closer to London to make sure it’s in tip top shape.. the inspection did not highlight any needs in the suspension department but pretty sure a place like CG would..
rosino said:
Funny the same happened to me this week. Except i have seen the light… again.. this is going to be my 5th 911… after 997.1, a 991.1 a GT3 991.1 then a 991.1 for finally a 991.2 Touring.. after a few years.. i decided i needed something nice but sensible, drivable but not too old.. and got myself a 997.2 C2S in Arctic Silver like yours.
I wanted some purity, some involvement, something compact enough. Reliable enough (…) and that would not break the bank as I don’t have much time to drive my cars anymore.. and i hate to know something nice is there sitting unused.
Car is being prepped a bit like yours, very similar items that needed attention and dealer is getting it ready. 2009 manual car with 44k miles. Inspection gave it the green light.
It needs a new exhaust as the 997.2 is just too quiet in standard form. A new steering wheel because the manuals until 2010 MY came with that godawful triangle one.. and then am thinking some bits and pieces but those are the 2 urgent ones.
Am also thinking a place like centre gravity but maybe closer to London to make sure it’s in tip top shape.. the inspection did not highlight any needs in the suspension department but pretty sure a place like CG would..
Yes, likewise mine feels just fine, but I'm sure that CG will make absolutely sure it's in top spec. It's only a couple of hours from me so I will make it a day trip. I want to get the full fat 997 experience.I wanted some purity, some involvement, something compact enough. Reliable enough (…) and that would not break the bank as I don’t have much time to drive my cars anymore.. and i hate to know something nice is there sitting unused.
Car is being prepped a bit like yours, very similar items that needed attention and dealer is getting it ready. 2009 manual car with 44k miles. Inspection gave it the green light.
It needs a new exhaust as the 997.2 is just too quiet in standard form. A new steering wheel because the manuals until 2010 MY came with that godawful triangle one.. and then am thinking some bits and pieces but those are the 2 urgent ones.
Am also thinking a place like centre gravity but maybe closer to London to make sure it’s in tip top shape.. the inspection did not highlight any needs in the suspension department but pretty sure a place like CG would..
BTW apparently it's 'center' not 'centre' because the temp got the spelling wrong when they were setting up and by the time anyone noticed too much promotional material had been created for them to want to change it
Edited by anonymous-user on Friday 13th May 00:07
How come CG get all the love and there is never any for
https://rpmtechnik.co.uk/geometry-setups/
...just curious. Are they no good at it? ..as they are much closer to me.
https://rpmtechnik.co.uk/geometry-setups/
...just curious. Are they no good at it? ..as they are much closer to me.
julian987R said:
How come CG get all the love and there is never any for
https://rpmtechnik.co.uk/geometry-setups/
...just curious. Are they no good at it? ..as they are much closer to me.
CG specialise in geo set up and alignment, it's all they do day in, day out, week in, week out month in mo ...., you get the picture. https://rpmtechnik.co.uk/geometry-setups/
...just curious. Are they no good at it? ..as they are much closer to me.
Put bluntly, RPMT don't. And if RPMT were to spend as much time as CG do on getting everything right prior to doing a set up, and then spend as much time actually carrying out the setup, RPMT's charges would be, how can I put this ? eye watering.
None of which is saying "they're no good at it", just that CG are on another level.
Billy_Whizzzz said:
Coming from an M2 Competition (and other M Cars) into a 997.2 was a revelation: so delicate, so poised, so beautiful - and THAT steering.
Completely. I remember back in 2009 I test drove the latest M3, C63 and RS4 over a couple of days. All great cars but they didn't quite do it for me. The wife then suggested I try a 911. The next day I test drove a two year old 997.1. Within five minutes I knew I absolutely had to have it. It just felt so good to drive.Tobermory said:
Edited by Tobermory on Friday 13th May 00:07
Mine had Carnewal cross over pipes that do away with the mid box behind the bumper, I bought it with this done years earlier but its perfect. Its a bit too noisey on cold start mode for 30secs but after that its the way it should be from factory, I wouldn't want it quieter, I'd want louder still if anything.
Tobermory said:
I picked it up today. Why didn't anyone tell me! (Well actually they did, but I didn't listen.) This thing is fabulous. I've had and have some reasonably sporty cars (currently a BAC Mono and I've owned a gen 1 NSX for 15 years), but the 997 can absolutely hold it's head high. I've only had a couple of hours in it so far, but I can see already why people rate them so highly.
....
I'm not sure it needs it but I've got it booked into Center Gravity for a full geo and corner weight setup in a few weeks as I went to make sure it is 100% right. It feels pretty good to me so far though.
I think that is exactly same as I felt after getting my 996 after 15years out of 911s and driving more modern stuff. What hits immediately is the driver involvement (perfect driving position for me), compactness and tactility of the experience irrespective of the speed or performance you are extracting.....
I'm not sure it needs it but I've got it booked into Center Gravity for a full geo and corner weight setup in a few weeks as I went to make sure it is 100% right. It feels pretty good to me so far though.
Once you get the geo done and a bit of time at the wheel, you'll experience another level of satisfaction. Nailing a tricky bend is a bit like middling a ball at cricket or making a perfect volley.
Slippydiff said:
CG specialise in geo set up and alignment, it's all they do day in, day out, week in, week out month in mo ...., you get the picture.
Put bluntly, RPMT don't. And if RPMT were to spend as much time as CG do on getting everything right prior to doing a set up, and then spend as much time actually carrying out the setup, RPMT's charges would be, how can I put this ? eye watering.
None of which is saying "they're no good at it", just that CG are on another level.
What are we typically getting done at CG for a road car...assume the road package? Chassis Tuning looks a bit more track focussed.Put bluntly, RPMT don't. And if RPMT were to spend as much time as CG do on getting everything right prior to doing a set up, and then spend as much time actually carrying out the setup, RPMT's charges would be, how can I put this ? eye watering.
None of which is saying "they're no good at it", just that CG are on another level.
julian987R said:
Boring Mediocre Wagon
I actually really liked my 650i, they’re great effortless cruisers and despite the comical lack of rear seat space, the boot is vast. The sound is a sort of muted Nascar rumble though they are definitely not the best handling cars, fast swapping corners would have you gripping the steering wheel nervously!Still a nice way to cover long distances but the 997 is on a different planet, engagement wise.
My further thoughts on the 997, it’s so small and easy to place, and the drivetrain is so well engineered that it’s ridiculously fast in the real world. I did not expect that.
I was also a little worried that going for a manual might be a mistake as my daily commute ends with 20 mins of crawling through 20mph zones but the 997 is so silky smooth that’s it’s no problem at all, and then when you hit the hood roads you’ve got the joy of the manual box.
I’ve ordered some replacements for the sticky knobs and climate switches and also new floor mats, other than that there’s nothing more to do cosmetically. I’ll fit the Bluetooth module at the same time.
julian987R said:
Tobermory said:
julian987R said:
Boring Mediocre Wagon
I actually really liked my 650i, the boot is vast.Gassing Station | 911/Carrera GT | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff