How can two 981s be so different?

How can two 981s be so different?

Author
Discussion

TB303

1,008 posts

161 months

Sunday 6th June
quotequote all
Passive damping has more feel, and that of course affects the steering. Like I said, I noticed it on my 987, and there’s a reason they don’t put PASM on the Spyders.

AlexNJ89

Original Poster:

566 posts

46 months

Sunday 6th June
quotequote all
TB303 said:
Passive damping has more feel, and that of course affects the steering. Like I said, I noticed it on my 987, and there’s a reason they don’t put PASM on the Spyders.
Would you also say passive damping has more weight to it too?

It would be good to know if it is PASM so I don't waste so much time on test drives.

TB303

1,008 posts

161 months

Sunday 6th June
quotequote all
AlexNJ89 said:
Would you also say passive damping has more weight to it too?

It would be good to know if it is PASM so I don't waste so much time on test drives.
I wouldn’t be confident to say that without comparing back to back, but I did notice an extra layer of disconnection from the driving experience.

Milemuncher

241 posts

82 months

Sunday 6th June
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Sorry, I’m not trying to be rude and forgive me if I’ve missed something… but if you liked the original one you tried so much, why don’t you just buy it?

AlexNJ89

Original Poster:

566 posts

46 months

Sunday 6th June
quotequote all
Milemuncher said:
Sorry, I’m not trying to be rude and forgive me if I’ve missed something… but if you liked the original one you tried so much, why don’t you just buy it?
It didn't have the sport design steering wheel and I like the paddles over the buttons.

It also wasn't a colour combination I liked.

AlexNJ89

Original Poster:

566 posts

46 months

Sunday 6th June
quotequote all
Oh this is interesting.

Perhaps on car had Power Steering Plus and the other didn't?

https://www.planet-9.com/threads/is-power-steering...

PaulD86

1,278 posts

93 months

Monday 7th June
quotequote all
Three possibilities spring to mind:

1. PASM - this would be the one I suspect
2. Power Steering Plus - I'm not sure what it is supposed to do, but I am sure I remember a Henry Catchpole video where he said it negatively impacted steering feel (although I could be wrong on that one)
3.Tyres/geo. If my first experience of a Porsche had been on Pirellis in the damp I'd never have bought one. Had it been on Michelins, I would have. And did. Geo can make quite a difference to the feel too.

I think option 1 is the probable one, however.

Maxym

1,307 posts

203 months

Monday 7th June
quotequote all
My vote would go to geo: maybe the second car's was out or maybe the first one's had been tweaked. Tyres? Possibly.

Having driven a variety of Porsche - owners and loaners - in my experience there's not a lot of difference between cars of the same model in 'normal' driving. (In stark contrast, back in the day I had an Escort XR3i which was considered to be a rather good car at the time and I liked pretty much everything about it. I drove one on a Brands experience half-day and the steering was as dull as fk; it was like driving a different car.)

Something like a SD steering wheel can be retro-fitted BTW.

AlexNJ89

Original Poster:

566 posts

46 months

Tuesday 8th June
quotequote all
PaulD86 said:
Three possibilities spring to mind:

1. PASM - this would be the one I suspect
2. Power Steering Plus - I'm not sure what it is supposed to do, but I am sure I remember a Henry Catchpole video where he said it negatively impacted steering feel (although I could be wrong on that one)
3.Tyres/geo. If my first experience of a Porsche had been on Pirellis in the damp I'd never have bought one. Had it been on Michelins, I would have. And did. Geo can make quite a difference to the feel too.

I think option 1 is the probable one, however.
This is the conclusion I'm coming to too.

I think I'll only know once I've driven a few.

The reason I don't think it is geo is that the first I drove had heavier steering even on gravel, so unless I have misunderstood the impact of geometry I don't think it'll be that.

Schmed

2,520 posts

39 months

Tuesday 8th June
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When I upgraded to the 718 from my old 981 2.7 the steering was considerably improved. I think there are several versions of EPAS in operation and the earlier ones in the 981 were improved upon significantly in the more recent variants. Ymmv, of course..

Funkydunc

139 posts

79 months

Saturday 12th June
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My money would be on the geometry being way out, or was it the difference between being able to twiddle the steering with one finger or having to use both hands?

Correct/good geometry massively changes the perception and feel of a car, more so in the turn in to a corner

AlexNJ89

Original Poster:

566 posts

46 months

Sunday 13th June
quotequote all
Funkydunc said:
My money would be on the geometry being way out, or was it the difference between being able to twiddle the steering with one finger or having to use both hands?

Correct/good geometry massively changes the perception and feel of a car, more so in the turn in to a corner
The weighting was even different going at 1mph

Red 5

810 posts

147 months

Sunday 13th June
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AlexNJ89 said:
The weighting was even different going at 1mph
The only things I can think of then, are power steering plus, that adds assistance as speeds drop, or VERY high tyre pressures.

There are also by design, ZERO pops and bangs in sport+, so the second car might have been tinkered with.
Re-map to add this feature, might also point to fettling in other areas on car two.

AlexNJ89

Original Poster:

566 posts

46 months

Sunday 13th June
quotequote all
Red 5 said:
The only things I can think of then, are power steering plus, that adds assistance as speeds drop, or VERY high tyre pressures.

There are also by design, ZERO pops and bangs in sport+, so the second car might have been tinkered with.
Re-map to add this feature, might also point to fettling in other areas on car two.
I think it could be power steering plus too. I'm the kind of guy who likes steering feel even at low speeds.

I've watched a few videos on YouTube where sport+ does have pops and bangs.

Here's a timestamped example:
https://youtu.be/yWxm2FX5dAs?t=486

Red 5

810 posts

147 months

Sunday 13th June
quotequote all
AlexNJ89 said:
I think it could be power steering plus too. I'm the kind of guy who likes steering feel even at low speeds.

I've watched a few videos on YouTube where sport+ does have pops and bangs.

Here's a timestamped example:
https://youtu.be/yWxm2FX5dAs?t=486
Strange isn’t it!
Porsche have specifically added them to sport mode along with the artificially sharp throttle, just for fun/drama and test drive apeal.

Sport+ is supposed to have progressive throttle map, plus zero pops, so the cars can be used on track without contravening SPL limits (as much)
They occurr at frequencies most likely to excite a trackside meter.

I do know it’s one of the most popular things to program in, during remap type fettling.

Milnsey

171 posts

187 months

Sunday 13th June
quotequote all
Red 5 said:
Strange isn’t it!
Porsche have specifically added them to sport mode along with the artificially sharp throttle, just for fun/drama and test drive apeal.

Sport+ is supposed to have progressive throttle map, plus zero pops, so the cars can be used on track without contravening SPL limits (as much)
They occurr at frequencies most likely to excite a trackside meter.

I do know it’s one of the most popular things to program in, during remap type fettling.
Mine (unmodified) pops and bangs in Sport plus, always has done

AlexNJ89

Original Poster:

566 posts

46 months

Sunday 13th June
quotequote all
When I get an 981 I may even see if I can map out the pops and crackles.

I wonder if it's a PSE thing?

Schmed

2,520 posts

39 months

Sunday 13th June
quotequote all
Sport activates the PSE if you have it, I had thought activating S+ turned it off. Which presumably makes sense if it's mainly a track mode.

So I guess you can override it and toggle the PSE switch back on in S+ if so desired.


Royal Jelly

2,962 posts

165 months

Monday 14th June
quotequote all
Sport+ activates PSE if fitted, PASM in sport mode and adds more pops & bangs on mine.

All can be toggled on/off so in S+ you can just have the bits of it you want with the much crisper throttle response S+ gives. It’s an option I wouldn’t do without now. Previously I didn’t give it too much stock but it’s rare for me to drive in any other mode - I just turn PASM/PSE to normal to suit.

Only on a motorway run would I use S or normal modes. Otherwise it’s hard to see why you wouldn’t want the throttle response alone unless you’re concerned about fuel consumption.

Edited by Royal Jelly on Monday 14th June 07:10

DJMC

3,067 posts

70 months

Monday 14th June
quotequote all
Firstly, forget any with push/pull buttons on the steering wheel. Go for the paddles. Nobody will want one with the buttons when you come to sell.

I tried five standard suspension cars before the PASM version I bought. Standard was OK, but PASM gave more comfort in normal mode, which suits me, and a firmer ride in Sport setting.

Maybe you didn't like either of these and preferred the middle setting of the standard suspension? I'd rate PASM as one of my top three "must haves" in speccing a car. PSE wouldn't even reach my bottom three - awful droning at 70mph. Gave me a headache in a courtesy car.

Have you tried a 2.7? I preferred it to the 3.4, but then I preferred normal and 14 way seats!