F430 manifolds..... again

F430 manifolds..... again

Author
Discussion

prettyboyben

Original Poster:

168 posts

135 months

Monday 13th January
quotequote all
Hey guys, just a little question, sorry if this is really boring now.

So, I bought my f430 spider in June with the twelve month new power 15 warranty from a main dealer. I’ve done around six thousand miles in that time, mainly on a road trip around the French Riviera and into Italy (which was fantastic). The problem is, my left hand manifold has started blowing. Now, the right hand one was repaired by Ferrari before I bought the car, but the left was t touched. Initially the dealer was saying they weren’t going to do anything to help, but they’ve now agreed to pay to have the left hand manifold repaired as well, but I have to pay for the removal and refitting. My question is, does everyone think this is acceptable, and how recently have people been getting results with getting manifolds replaced etc?

Thanks
Ben

dereksharpuk

109 posts

124 months

Monday 13th January
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When I purchased my F430 in late November 2018, I had the manifolds inspected by Ferrari. I was told that they were find and that I should leave well alone as the situation could be made worse by taking them off. So I think your dealership was right in saying 'leave well along'. However, I'm not sure if the power warranty actually covers manifolds. What is the age of your F430 as I believe the manifolds were changed to a better version in about 2006. Maybe someone can correct mea on that.

MDL111

4,652 posts

133 months

Monday 13th January
quotequote all
I’d be delighted - I have to pay for both my manifolds on the Scuderia, which is under warranty
They are currently being manufactured ....

FezSpider

642 posts

188 months

Wednesday 15th January
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dereksharpuk said:
When I purchased my F430 in late November 2018, I had the manifolds inspected by Ferrari. I was told that they were find and that I should leave well alone as the situation could be made worse by taking them off.
Dont dealers talk st. I would love to know how they check the manifolds without removing them and taking of the heat shields that encase the header tubes.
Just staring at heat shield covers while there still in the engine bay will tell one very little.
This tells you nothing about the condition of the tubes under it. One can look at perfectly shiny manifold covers but underneath the tubes are getting ready to burn through.
Taking of the manifolds cant possibly make the tubes within the manifolds worse. Dealers rolleyes
Back to the OPs original question, I would say that if the dealer is paying for the manifold repair, then just pay for the removal and replace, that wont be many hours work to pay for.
Be sure you ask what exactly has been done to the manifold, because the company that will repair it just may replace the single tube that's blown leaving the other 3 tubes with the potential to blow later down the line. Were as a fully reconditioned manifold will have all 4 of the tubes replaced with better thicker gauge metal/materials.
The standard factory metal is the thinnest weakest crap available.
Bear in mind the dealer will always try to save money.


Edited by FezSpider on Wednesday 15th January 23:01

ANOpax

214 posts

122 months

Thursday 16th January
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Don’t bother repairing or replacing with Ferrari manifolds. They will simply burn through again in time and with the pre-cats still in place, you are still driving a ticking time bomb when it come to cat ingestion and engine destruction.

Just get the decatted capristo manifolds + heat shields and be done with it. They are less likely to break and there’s no risk of cat ingestion. In order to reduce the likelihood of the manifolds breaking, you should also change out the back box and its mounting system.

This advice came to me from my Indy when I was looking to buy a F430. He basically said that unless the manifolds have been replaced with aftermarket ones (without the pre-cats) then I should budget for a manifold change and change the back box mounting system for extra security.

Given how well documented the design flaw of the F430 exhaust system is, I’m surprised at how many buyers get the wool pulled over their eyes by dealers who sell cars with a flaw which requires 5-10k to fix.

‘They all do that sir’ simply isn’t good enough in an age when the truth is a google search away.

If you want to lessen the pain of that 5-10k outlay, get a Kline back box. It transforms the sound from acceptable to awesome



Edited by ANOpax on Thursday 16th January 06:52

prettyboyben

Original Poster:

168 posts

135 months

Thursday 16th January
quotequote all
Brill, thanks for the responses guys, the car is now in with Italia Autosport as I’d read so many good things about them on here. They’re going to give the car a check over and make sure the quality of the manifold repairs are up to scratch etc.

FezSpider

642 posts

188 months

Thursday 16th January
quotequote all
prettyboyben said:
Brill, thanks for the responses guys, the car is now in with Italia Autosport as I’d read so many good things about them on here. They’re going to give the car a check over and make sure the quality of the manifold repairs are up to scratch etc.
Mate, it does not matter how good a reputation any specialist has. What I wrote still applies 100%.

ANOpax

214 posts

122 months

Thursday 16th January
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FezSpider said:
prettyboyben said:
Brill, thanks for the responses guys, the car is now in with Italia Autosport as I’d read so many good things about them on here. They’re going to give the car a check over and make sure the quality of the manifold repairs are up to scratch etc.
Mate, it does not matter how good a reputation any specialist has. What I wrote still applies 100%.
I’ll second that. Prettyboy, are you aware that by leaving the Ferrari manifolds on the car, you are leaving yourself open to destroying your engine? If the pre-cats break down, they get ingested into the engine and that’s it - game over. It’s a major design flaw which some Lamborghini models also suffer from I believe.

Don’t be cheap. Just replace the manifolds with decatted ones. Capristo for Europeans, Fabspeed for Americans. This is such a well documented issue that I can’t believe you’re even having to think about it.

MDL111

4,652 posts

133 months

Friday 17th January
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ANOpax said:
FezSpider said:
prettyboyben said:
Brill, thanks for the responses guys, the car is now in with Italia Autosport as I’d read so many good things about them on here. They’re going to give the car a check over and make sure the quality of the manifold repairs are up to scratch etc.
Mate, it does not matter how good a reputation any specialist has. What I wrote still applies 100%.
I’ll second that. Prettyboy, are you aware that by leaving the Ferrari manifolds on the car, you are leaving yourself open to destroying your engine? If the pre-cats break down, they get ingested into the engine and that’s it - game over. It’s a major design flaw which some Lamborghini models also suffer from I believe.

Don’t be cheap. Just replace the manifolds with decatted ones. Capristo for Europeans, Fabspeed for Americans. This is such a well documented issue that I can’t believe you’re even having to think about it.
Not really an option though if you want to keep your warranty (Although having spoken to my dealer yesterday who indicated my bill will be in the region of 11k plus vat, I am not sure I will keep mine much longer ....)

FezSpider

642 posts

188 months

Friday 17th January
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MDL111 said:
Not really an option though if you want to keep your warranty (Although having spoken to my dealer yesterday who indicated my bill will be in the region of 11k plus vat, I am not sure I will keep mine much longer ....)
11k for your manifolds mate? Bloody hell!

MDL111

4,652 posts

133 months

Friday 17th January
quotequote all
FezSpider said:
MDL111 said:
Not really an option though if you want to keep your warranty (Although having spoken to my dealer yesterday who indicated my bill will be in the region of 11k plus vat, I am not sure I will keep mine much longer ....)
11k for your manifolds mate? Bloody hell!
it hopefully also includes an annual service and a battery for another car (and hopefully the warranty extension, he was not sure about that) - so not just the manifolds - or at least I really hope so.... will post up the breakdown once I receive the bill (so far only one manifold has arrived - nice going given the car has been with the dealer since October / not their fault, just Ferrari seemingly not having spare parts stocked)

ANOpax

214 posts

122 months

Friday 17th January
quotequote all
MDL111 said:
Not really an option though if you want to keep your warranty (Although having spoken to my dealer yesterday who indicated my bill will be in the region of 11k plus vat, I am not sure I will keep mine much longer ....)
Not a problem for you keeping the Ferrari manifolds on the Scud. Ferrari learnt their lesson and there are no pre-cats in the scud manifolds...

FezSpider

642 posts

188 months

Friday 17th January
quotequote all
MDL111 said:
it hopefully also includes an annual service and a battery for another car (and hopefully the warranty extension, he was not sure about that) - so not just the manifolds - or at least I really hope so.... will post up the breakdown once I receive the bill (so far only one manifold has arrived - nice going given the car has been with the dealer since October / not their fault, just Ferrari seemingly not having spare parts stocked)
I spent 28 years in the close protection Industry, a lot of the work was part of extortion and KNR policy.
We used to call what's happening to you a "racket" as in racketeering biggrin

MDL111

4,652 posts

133 months

Friday 17th January
quotequote all
FezSpider said:
MDL111 said:
it hopefully also includes an annual service and a battery for another car (and hopefully the warranty extension, he was not sure about that) - so not just the manifolds - or at least I really hope so.... will post up the breakdown once I receive the bill (so far only one manifold has arrived - nice going given the car has been with the dealer since October / not their fault, just Ferrari seemingly not having spare parts stocked)
I spent 28 years in the close protection Industry, a lot of the work was part of extortion and KNR policy.
We used to call what's happening to you a "racket" as in racketeering biggrin
excellent smile
when I still lived in London I had my car taken care of for less than 60 pounds per hour, while now it is something like 180 euros - painful

supersport

3,039 posts

183 months

Friday 17th January
quotequote all
Does removing the pre-cat have any impact on the MOT?

MDL111

4,652 posts

133 months

Friday 17th January
quotequote all
supersport said:
Does removing the pre-cat have any impact on the MOT?
In the U.K. I managed to get my 355 MOT'd without any cats (c 10 years ago)
In germany it would likely fail TÜV

ANOpax

214 posts

122 months

Friday 17th January
quotequote all
supersport said:
Does removing the pre-cat have any impact on the MOT?
It shouldn’t do.

My understanding is that the pre-cat is there for cold emissions tests as it warms up quickly due to its proximity to the engine. Your MOT will be performed on an already hot engine so shouldn’t present any problems.



WF36

520 posts

114 months

Friday 17th January
quotequote all
ANOpax said:
It shouldn’t do.

My understanding is that the pre-cat is there for cold emissions tests as it warms up quickly due to its proximity to the engine. Your MOT will be performed on an already hot engine so shouldn’t present any problems.
Thought this was the case, going to pull the trigger on some AP Manifolds and get them coated by Zircotec!

chillo

717 posts

178 months

Sunday 1st March
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WF36 said:
Thought this was the case, going to pull the trigger on some AP Manifolds and get them coated by Zircotec!
I got AP on mine and used bandages at first, had them coated by Zircotec (performance white) a few years back and the reduction in heat soak effect is astounding! Transformed the running of the car.

WF36

520 posts

114 months

Monday 2nd March
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chillo said:
I got AP on mine and used bandages at first, had them coated by Zircotec (performance white) a few years back and the reduction in heat soak effect is astounding! Transformed the running of the car.
Agreed, had mine fitted a couple of weeks now and the heat in the engine bay after a drive is massively reduced!