458 Speciale vs. 991.2 manual GT3 advice please
Discussion
isaldiri said:
RSVP - STOP! the car you really want is the big boxster. buying a speciale (great car as it is and it really is good) is just going to distract you from the one you really really want 
Ha Ha.. CGT best car ever and my ultimate dream car however Speciale a very credible second..Trouble is the former costs way more than twice the latter..The CGT for me sadly is the ship that sailed past me in the darkness..At £600K its so far beyond my means it must remain a dream..You guys who bought one at more sensible prices are very lucky indeed..
DT398 said:
It’s a lot of money to be tied up for early morning drives avoiding attention imho, but we are not all the same and it’s pretty much guaranteed you would have a silly grin on your face as you tucked it back in the garage!
Buy one in a dark colour and it’s a lot less attention grabbing than, say, a 991.2RS with its frankly preposterous rear wing (sorry Taffy!)
There are one or two decent independents and DK Engineering spring to mind and they have one at the moment for reasonable money but a 2 year main dealer warranty is probably worth having on these cars. You probably wouldn’t go wrong with the likes of Tom Hartley or Romans either but again the warranty thing is out there. Bramley is another one but they seem to be similar pricing to main dealers. If it’s SOR you may be able to inherit the existing warranty, not sure.
It’s horses for courses in the end and I’ve been through a similar thought process but not done anything about it yet. If you can avoid agonising over whether it’s “worth it” or not, there’s no doubt it would be an epic car to own. I know a few that have them and they are all smitten.
Cheers , good point re warranty / dealers cheers Buy one in a dark colour and it’s a lot less attention grabbing than, say, a 991.2RS with its frankly preposterous rear wing (sorry Taffy!)
There are one or two decent independents and DK Engineering spring to mind and they have one at the moment for reasonable money but a 2 year main dealer warranty is probably worth having on these cars. You probably wouldn’t go wrong with the likes of Tom Hartley or Romans either but again the warranty thing is out there. Bramley is another one but they seem to be similar pricing to main dealers. If it’s SOR you may be able to inherit the existing warranty, not sure.
It’s horses for courses in the end and I’ve been through a similar thought process but not done anything about it yet. If you can avoid agonising over whether it’s “worth it” or not, there’s no doubt it would be an epic car to own. I know a few that have them and they are all smitten.
browngt3 said:
Ha ha, I'm going to add to the growing list of Porsche owners lurking here!
I have recently added a classic 308GTB QV to my little collection of Porsches. Whilst we can't compare it to the 991.2GT3 in any way it does come out very well indeed compared to its contemporary - the Carrera 3.2. It has a delicacy of touch, an elegance and a charm that the old 911 simply doesn't have. If this is the case when comparing a 458 to a 991.2 GT3 then call me converted!
I'm also reevaluating the GT3. Have you considered a manual F430? Harry Metcalfe, being his usual enthusiastic self, in his recent video review, reckons it a better proposition than the Scuderia. It's also a similar performance to the GT3, similar price point and more than fast enough for our roads. He makes a compelling case. However, if you want to track it then I guess that changes things. In my opinion a GT3 is a better bet for this as to track a Speciale must be outrageously expensive not to mention the psychological risk of tracking a car literally twice as valuable.
Sounds lovely - rightly or wrongly, I’m Speciale or nothing if it’s a Ferrari I have recently added a classic 308GTB QV to my little collection of Porsches. Whilst we can't compare it to the 991.2GT3 in any way it does come out very well indeed compared to its contemporary - the Carrera 3.2. It has a delicacy of touch, an elegance and a charm that the old 911 simply doesn't have. If this is the case when comparing a 458 to a 991.2 GT3 then call me converted!
I'm also reevaluating the GT3. Have you considered a manual F430? Harry Metcalfe, being his usual enthusiastic self, in his recent video review, reckons it a better proposition than the Scuderia. It's also a similar performance to the GT3, similar price point and more than fast enough for our roads. He makes a compelling case. However, if you want to track it then I guess that changes things. In my opinion a GT3 is a better bet for this as to track a Speciale must be outrageously expensive not to mention the psychological risk of tracking a car literally twice as valuable.
isaldiri said:
RSVP - STOP! the car you really want is the big boxster. buying a speciale (great car as it is and it really is good) is just going to distract you from the one you really really want
You’re obviously right, it I though this might be a credible second place for less than 1/2 the money. Also struggling to find one - no hurry though - I can wait - thought the 458 Spec might be a nice stop gap - have a strong buyer form my GT3 if I wanted to sell, but need to decide very soon- I think the 458 is a fall back position if I sell the GT3 & can’t get a good CGT for my budget - always fancied one RSVP911 said:
Hi there - can anyone tell me roughly how much a decent spec car was new ? Cheers
About £235-240k iirc. Depending on how much cf one specced or went overboard with fancy paint it could be a fair bit more. Or that figure was what I had my order specced up to before slightly stupidly cancelling in late 2014..isaldiri said:
About £235-240k iirc. Depending on how much cf one specced or went overboard with fancy paint it could be a fair bit more. Or that figure was what I had my order specced up to before slightly stupidly cancelling in late 2014..
Oops - funny that, now you come to mention it, I was offered a brand new car that was already made for I think £230 back in the day - and I passed as it felt like crazy money at the time - oops indeed RSVP911 said:
Lots of helpful comments, thanks
A few thoughts :
Firstly I couldn’t care less about brand cache, actually to me, this part of ownership would be a turn off & probably explains why I’ve not had one before - I’d be very embarrassed about attention it would bring; I’d tend to use it for very early morning blasts and then tuck it up again out of sight. I’m only interested in the actual product itself and ownership proposition from a technical & driver interaction perspective.
Couple of other thoughts ; as the dealer spread is huge, you’d think there would be a good market owner to owner (maybe not, due to finance requirements from some buyers) - as I say if anyone doesn’t want theirs anymore please pm me.
Also there must be really good trusted Indy’s that broker these cars more competitively ? If so, please can someone let me know who the good guys are (I know who I would and wouldn’t buy a second hand Porsche from for example)
Taffy, eally interesting to hear your thoughts on tactility and dynamics - my main worry is moving from manual to PDK (not sure what Ferrari call this) so the fact that you find your 458 really engaging is really good to hear
All thoughts welcome, as I’m a Ferrari nube
Evening Lord R, my overwhelming thought is this : A few thoughts :
Firstly I couldn’t care less about brand cache, actually to me, this part of ownership would be a turn off & probably explains why I’ve not had one before - I’d be very embarrassed about attention it would bring; I’d tend to use it for very early morning blasts and then tuck it up again out of sight. I’m only interested in the actual product itself and ownership proposition from a technical & driver interaction perspective.
Couple of other thoughts ; as the dealer spread is huge, you’d think there would be a good market owner to owner (maybe not, due to finance requirements from some buyers) - as I say if anyone doesn’t want theirs anymore please pm me.
Also there must be really good trusted Indy’s that broker these cars more competitively ? If so, please can someone let me know who the good guys are (I know who I would and wouldn’t buy a second hand Porsche from for example)
Taffy, eally interesting to hear your thoughts on tactility and dynamics - my main worry is moving from manual to PDK (not sure what Ferrari call this) so the fact that you find your 458 really engaging is really good to hear
All thoughts welcome, as I’m a Ferrari nube
The application of additional vinyl
I know this is an emotive subject for you, and think it’s something you need to give due consideration before proceeding with the purchase of said vehicle ...
I am also a Porsche owner considering dipping my toe into the Ferrari Speciale fold. Drove my 997 GT3 RS 4.0 back to back with a friends Ferrari Speziale Apperta. Two completly different cars and my conclusion was, that it's not the one against the other but you probably you "need" both. ! I would't swap GT3 RS 4.0 for a Speziale though. I think these Ferrari's still have a way to go (down) price wise. As said above, dealers seem to hang on to them faily long so the list prices do not reflect the current state of the market. Ask and bid are far apart and there are relatively many of them around so the bubble will burst eventually. 458 Speziale Aperta - the one to have !
hornbaek said:
I am also a Porsche owner considering dipping my toe into the Ferrari Speciale fold. Drove my 997 GT3 RS 4.0 back to back with a friends Ferrari Speziale Apperta. Two completly different cars and my conclusion was, that it's not the one against the other but you probably you "need" both. ! I would't swap GT3 RS 4.0 for a Speziale though. I think these Ferrari's still have a way to go (down) price wise. As said above, dealers seem to hang on to them faily long so the list prices do not reflect the current state of the market. Ask and bid are far apart and there are relatively many of them around so the bubble will burst eventually. 458 Speziale Aperta - the one to have !
Interesting - do you (or anyone else) know how many Speciale (non Alperta’s) we’re made ? Even better if someone knows LHD / RHD split Thanks,
Richard
Looks to be 2-2.5k Speciale hardtops. Some UK info...
https://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/threads/uk-speci...
https://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/threads/uk-speci...
hornbaek said:
I am also a Porsche owner considering dipping my toe into the Ferrari Speciale fold. Drove my 997 GT3 RS 4.0 back to back with a friends Ferrari Speziale Apperta. Two completly different cars and my conclusion was, that it's not the one against the other but you probably you "need" both. ! I would't swap GT3 RS 4.0 for a Speziale though. I think these Ferrari's still have a way to go (down) price wise. As said above, dealers seem to hang on to them faily long so the list prices do not reflect the current state of the market. Ask and bid are far apart and there are relatively many of them around so the bubble will burst eventually. 458 Speziale Aperta - the one to have !
Desperate people will sell and lower the price. No way is a tidy low mileage Speciale worth south of £250k.. they are simply to good!I have a 997 4.0L and a Speciale. Both best of their breed and not one better than the other.
If you recognise my username from what seems like years hanging around the Porker forums I had been hankering after a 991.1 or 2 GT3 for a good while I jumped on the chance to buy a regular 458 as an alternative at the same price point. Far more of an event - better steering/gearbox etc. I have never had the experience of a Speciale hopefully at some point I will get a drive of one I would be intrigued to see what another 150k buys you over the standard car.
forcedinduction7 said:
Looks to be 2-2.5k Speciale hardtops. Some UK info...
https://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/threads/uk-speci...
Not sure I can make head ir tail of this - manybe I’m being think ? https://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/threads/uk-speci...
thanks though
DT398 said:
I haven’t had a manual 991.2gt3 but I’ve had the Gen1 plus both variants of the 991RS and I now have a 458 spider. The Ferrari is way more special than any of them despite not being as sharp a drive imho.
The 991 GT cars are total bargains for what they do but they don’t have the Ferrari secret sauce imho.
The Speciale is in a different league to the GT3 (and is obviously priced accordingly) but as Taffy says, it’s probably a car you want to buy to keep as dealer margins will be large and we might also be in for a bit of a correction, so selling it after a year or two might be painful.
As an alternative, you could more or less straight swap your 991gt3 for a 458 Italia which will get you 90% of the experience. I know everyone raves about the 991 Gen2 engine but that Ferrari V8 at full chat is a thing of beauty.
I’d have an Italia over a 991gt3/RS of any persuasion all day long. 992 will be out soon, etc etc but the 458 will never be replaced or repeated by Ferrari if you see what I mean. All just imho of course!
Thanks - I missed this somehow The 991 GT cars are total bargains for what they do but they don’t have the Ferrari secret sauce imho.
The Speciale is in a different league to the GT3 (and is obviously priced accordingly) but as Taffy says, it’s probably a car you want to buy to keep as dealer margins will be large and we might also be in for a bit of a correction, so selling it after a year or two might be painful.
As an alternative, you could more or less straight swap your 991gt3 for a 458 Italia which will get you 90% of the experience. I know everyone raves about the 991 Gen2 engine but that Ferrari V8 at full chat is a thing of beauty.
I’d have an Italia over a 991gt3/RS of any persuasion all day long. 992 will be out soon, etc etc but the 458 will never be replaced or repeated by Ferrari if you see what I mean. All just imho of course!
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