Ferrari purosangue - just thrown away my Ferrari cap
Discussion
speedbird1000 said:
Enzo said he would never build a four door car, well now Ferrari is New York listed, the only rule they have left is to grab as much money as they can before the brand is permanently laughed at and irrelevant ?........
You think Enzo Ferrari didn't grab as much money as he could when he was alive and in charge?
The only customers Enzo Ferrari had any respect for, were those who bought his cars to race.
Ordinary road car buyers? - He used look upon them with derision, and laugh at how they queued up to be seen in one of his cars.
"Enzo Ferrari said he would never build a four door car" - So what?
Enzo Ferrari also said:
"The horse should always pull the cart, not push it!" - Implying that Ferrari would never build a road car with the engine behind the driver.
And:
"Aerodynamics are for people who can't build engines!" - Implying that Ferrari's would never rely on aerodynamics to help their performance.
He also thought Ferrari road cars should be V12's only (but happily raced Ferrari's fitted with straight 4's and V6's as well as V12's) , and didn't see the need for disc brakes on cars, be they race or road cars.
Strangely though, in the interest of selling road cars to fund his racing, he eventually fitted disc brakes, placed engines behind the driver, fitted V6's and V8's to his cars (but called them Dino's initially, until sales were too slow, when the Dino 308GT4 became the Ferrari 308 GT4 over night), and the very last road car project that he personally over saw, the F40, made use not only of a mid-engine V8, but also relied on aerodynamics for it's performance (albeit rudimentary aerodynamics by today's standards).
When Ferrari announced they were to badge V8 cars as Ferrari, rather than Dino, people claimed it was the end for Ferrari.
When FIAT bought into Ferrari, and took over the production car side of the business, people claimed it was the end for Ferrari.
When Ferrari ditched carburettors for fuel injection, people claimed it was the end for Ferrari.
When Ferrari announced they were to increase road car production to 7,000 cars a year, people claimed it was the end for Ferrari.
When Ferrari announced they were to increase road car production to 10,000 cars per year, people claimed it was the end for Ferrari.
When Ferrari announced that they would no longer manufacture manual gearbox cars, people claimed it was the end for Ferrari.
Every time Ferrari make a big change, certain owners throw a hissy fit, shout to the World that they've had it with Ferrari, that will never buy another car from Ferrari, that the name's been ruined, the brand's been ruined, and that it's the end of Ferrari.
Despite all of that, Ferrari have gone from strength to strength, increasing sales just about every year, and finding far more new customers, than old customers who leave in a strop.
The fact is, if Enzo Ferrari had needed to sell 4 door cars to enable his racing team to continue racing, he would have done it.
If Enzo Ferrari had needed to sell SUV's to enable his racing team to continue racing, he would have done it.
Enzo Ferrari would have done whatever it took to ensure his team could race, and he would have taken the pi$$ out of the people who happily queued up to pay over the odds, to buy the cars than enabled him to do it too!
willy wombat said:
I’m trying to be more positive about this. If the SUV makes as much money for Ferrari as Porsche has made out of theirs, it could be a positive. Porsche SUV production hasn’t hurt their GT2, GT3 etc models - the cash generated has positively helped them.
I'm told that Porsche would have gone bust without the Cayenne & Macan. But it lost it going mass production. Sadly though, Ferrari feel the need to enter that business. That is why I think older Ferraris, 360, 430, will appreciate. 355 already has.Drl22 said:
Lots of love for the Roma in this thread but none for the review thread the other day. Does this mean it’s pretty but of little real interest?
I struggle to think of spending more on a V8 Turbo mini-Ferrari GT than you can spend to own an 812, V12 full-fat GT.It looks nice in a non-offensive kind of way
footsoldier said:
I struggle to think of spending more on a V8 Turbo mini-Ferrari GT than you can spend to own an 812, V12 full-fat GT.
It looks nice in a non-offensive kind of way
I couldn’t have put it better myself. I mentioned in another thread that the design reminds me more of Aston Martin than Ferrari. It looks nice in a non-offensive kind of way
mwstewart said:
I have been a die-hard car (not Ferrari) enthusiast since childhood but the idea of new cars being objects of desire or enjoyment is dead to me. I've mostly switched off to them and will continue to enjoy my relics, somewhat out of habit, somewhat out of a genuine like for them.
On the eve of mass electrification now more than ever the manufacturers now need to do whatever they can to differentiate and turn a profit. It isn't a surprise nor concern to me that Ferrari have done this, as - for a while now - I've thought that modern supercar brands and their cars are rather irrelevant in this country.
I've stopped buying new cars and haven't bought a new car for 4 years come February. I look after my current Ferraris , Porsches, Mercedes, BMWs and classics fastidiously and they're all like new (some of my classics better than new). That's where I would rather put my money now. All my classified browsing and shortlisting for the 2 garage spaces I currently have are classics or vintage cars.On the eve of mass electrification now more than ever the manufacturers now need to do whatever they can to differentiate and turn a profit. It isn't a surprise nor concern to me that Ferrari have done this, as - for a while now - I've thought that modern supercar brands and their cars are rather irrelevant in this country.
I try but cant get excited about anything new these days. TBH that makes me a bit sad after a lifetime of car obsession.
dereksharpuk said:
willy wombat said:
I’m trying to be more positive about this. If the SUV makes as much money for Ferrari as Porsche has made out of theirs, it could be a positive. Porsche SUV production hasn’t hurt their GT2, GT3 etc models - the cash generated has positively helped them.
I'm told that Porsche would have gone bust without the Cayenne & Macan. But it lost it going mass production. Sadly though, Ferrari feel the need to enter that business. That is why I think older Ferraris, 360, 430, will appreciate. 355 already has.I know the Urus has been a success but Lamborghini didn’t have the Lusso as a four seater Clearly Ferrari will has done it’s research and it’ll be a massive seller in China and the Middle East but I wonder how much bigger the market is here for it than the Lusso.
I don't see a problem with the SUV cashcow for companies. Porsche would have gone bust years ago without the cayenne. As they are forced to move away from conventional engines Ferraris output of normal cars is bound to fall quote a lot.
Ferrari have long been a crossover lifestyle/aspirational brand so the step to making an SUV is much shorter than for example Lotus who are supposedly having a geely/volvo rebranded 4x4 which is a huge diversion for a small sporscar company but I would buy one.
All of the supercar and sportscar companies are facing a total nightmare over the next decade to find relevance. I'm glad to have IMHO one of their last desirable cars in the garage as times change first to turbos (sickn in mouth) and then electrification (yawn) its an impossible situation for these companies.
Ferrari have long been a crossover lifestyle/aspirational brand so the step to making an SUV is much shorter than for example Lotus who are supposedly having a geely/volvo rebranded 4x4 which is a huge diversion for a small sporscar company but I would buy one.
All of the supercar and sportscar companies are facing a total nightmare over the next decade to find relevance. I'm glad to have IMHO one of their last desirable cars in the garage as times change first to turbos (sickn in mouth) and then electrification (yawn) its an impossible situation for these companies.
I'm tempted to say "who cares" but there is a reason to care.
If people want sports cars that are at the absolute technological cutting edge and not lashed together anachronisms trading on past glories, you have to allow the manufacturers and their investors to make serious money to re-invest in R&D. That won't happen by selling a tiny handful of cars that remain pure to the ideal of the founder to diehard enthusiasts. If you go down that route, you wind up like Bristol.
Porsche, Mercedes, Rolls Royce, Bentley, Maserati, Aston Martin and Jaguar have all diversified out of their core product because that's where the money is for their investors.
I'm quite sure that Ferdinand Porsche and William Lyons would have been the first into hybrid electric SUVs back in the day if that's where they thought the money was
If people want sports cars that are at the absolute technological cutting edge and not lashed together anachronisms trading on past glories, you have to allow the manufacturers and their investors to make serious money to re-invest in R&D. That won't happen by selling a tiny handful of cars that remain pure to the ideal of the founder to diehard enthusiasts. If you go down that route, you wind up like Bristol.
Porsche, Mercedes, Rolls Royce, Bentley, Maserati, Aston Martin and Jaguar have all diversified out of their core product because that's where the money is for their investors.
I'm quite sure that Ferdinand Porsche and William Lyons would have been the first into hybrid electric SUVs back in the day if that's where they thought the money was
^^^ this really.
It’s a similar to when Porsche started putting water in their engines and lots of people got angry.
I am sure lots of us love and appreciate the history, heritage and pedigree, but they to survive and selling a handful of niche cars not do that anymore. It doesn’t stop us enjoying all that.
T9 my mind Ferrari as a brand is already pretty awful, these people wearing Ferrari branded clothing head to toe. Personally I don’t get it.
I don’t buy the brand, I buy the thing that I want, I am not interested in what others think.
To many, these cars are a pose. To me it’s a great drivers car and that’s what I bought it for. And I get to enjoy discovering the heritage. But it’s personal to me.
It’s a similar to when Porsche started putting water in their engines and lots of people got angry.
I am sure lots of us love and appreciate the history, heritage and pedigree, but they to survive and selling a handful of niche cars not do that anymore. It doesn’t stop us enjoying all that.
T9 my mind Ferrari as a brand is already pretty awful, these people wearing Ferrari branded clothing head to toe. Personally I don’t get it.
I don’t buy the brand, I buy the thing that I want, I am not interested in what others think.
To many, these cars are a pose. To me it’s a great drivers car and that’s what I bought it for. And I get to enjoy discovering the heritage. But it’s personal to me.
supersport said:
T9 my mind Ferrari as a brand is already pretty awful, these people wearing Ferrari branded clothing head to toe. Personally I don’t get it.
Wearing any Ferrari branded clothing is something I don’t get, it is the most cringey thing. It can only be made worse by getting out of a Ferrari whilst wearing it. 
Drl22 said:
Lots of love for the Roma in this thread but none for the review thread the other day. Does this mean it’s pretty but of little real interest?
Fortunate enough to drive a Roma last year courtesy of Maranello.It's a very, very well sorted car overall and handsome too.
It is the kind of thing I could drive when I grow up a little bit.
Only time will tell how much damage to the brand is being done by Ferrari now being a public company and bringing out new models at a faster rate than previously. My guess is a fair bit.
The original article in this thread is clearly written by someone who doesn't have a clue what he is talking about (e.g. SF90 is the successor to LaFerrari). Galleria's comment that spending £1.6m+ on a Monza is "a reward to our best clients" did make me smile though - early signs on Monza values are not great, and a fair few of those originally given the chance to buy one have since dropped out, so I'd say a few Ferrari collectors might be wondering whether much (any) of the new stuff is really worth collecting.
The original article in this thread is clearly written by someone who doesn't have a clue what he is talking about (e.g. SF90 is the successor to LaFerrari). Galleria's comment that spending £1.6m+ on a Monza is "a reward to our best clients" did make me smile though - early signs on Monza values are not great, and a fair few of those originally given the chance to buy one have since dropped out, so I'd say a few Ferrari collectors might be wondering whether much (any) of the new stuff is really worth collecting.
Agree with much of what's been said.
We live in a very different world now to the one when Enzo was alive. China is the big consumer now and unfortunately they seem to like grotesquely ugly giant SUVs. Like most Ferrari enthusiasts I also dread the prospect of them making one. Conversely the Italians do make better looking ones than anybody else. Witness the Maserati Levante although I'd never buy one.
To me a much bigger concern is electrification. The first ever Ferrari was a V12 and they've been central to the brand's identity ever since. Wasn't the last ever V12 F1 car a Ferrari? Now I hear they might be extinct in the road cars before long. Let's hope synthetic fuels will save the day. The world will be a much poorer place without a Ferrari V12.
What would Enzo make of it all now I wonder? Reckon he'd be pretty pissed off with the F1 team more than anything else...
We live in a very different world now to the one when Enzo was alive. China is the big consumer now and unfortunately they seem to like grotesquely ugly giant SUVs. Like most Ferrari enthusiasts I also dread the prospect of them making one. Conversely the Italians do make better looking ones than anybody else. Witness the Maserati Levante although I'd never buy one.
To me a much bigger concern is electrification. The first ever Ferrari was a V12 and they've been central to the brand's identity ever since. Wasn't the last ever V12 F1 car a Ferrari? Now I hear they might be extinct in the road cars before long. Let's hope synthetic fuels will save the day. The world will be a much poorer place without a Ferrari V12.
What would Enzo make of it all now I wonder? Reckon he'd be pretty pissed off with the F1 team more than anything else...
Van Dessel said:
I hope you're referring to the one where Joey finds a Porsche parked outside his apartment so he pretends it's his - poses with it and washes it and buys all this gaudy Porsche gear :-D
Still makes me laugh ...
I wasn’t specifically thinking of that at the time but that idea exactly.Still makes me laugh ...
I think Ferrari are probably the worst for the tacky merchandise.
I had an amusing moment at a Little Chef when a lorry driver came in, saw that there were only two people in the place and as one was wearing a Ferrari jacket and cap, so asked him to move his car. A few minutes later when it was clear that the Ferrari jackets Mondeo wasn’t in the way, the lorry driver asked me to move my car too.
I think anywhere outside of an F1 track on race weekend, there’s no place for Ferrari caps.
Lee Jones Jnr said:
I wasn’t specifically thinking of that at the time but that idea exactly.
I think Ferrari are probably the worst for the tacky merchandise.
I had an amusing moment at a Little Chef when a lorry driver came in, saw that there were only two people in the place and as one was wearing a Ferrari jacket and cap, so asked him to move his car. A few minutes later when it was clear that the Ferrari jackets Mondeo wasn’t in the way, the lorry driver asked me to move my car too.
I think anywhere outside of an F1 track on race weekend, there’s no place for Ferrari caps.
Live and let live! If a little kid who's a Ferrari fan wants to wear one would it offend?I think Ferrari are probably the worst for the tacky merchandise.
I had an amusing moment at a Little Chef when a lorry driver came in, saw that there were only two people in the place and as one was wearing a Ferrari jacket and cap, so asked him to move his car. A few minutes later when it was clear that the Ferrari jackets Mondeo wasn’t in the way, the lorry driver asked me to move my car too.
I think anywhere outside of an F1 track on race weekend, there’s no place for Ferrari caps.
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