Finding the right 458

Finding the right 458

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Discussion

Chad_Hugo

655 posts

181 months

Thursday 30th May
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First of, a you've made a great choice in picking a 458 Italia! I'm biased as a current owner but they are phenomenal cars and mine looks to be a keeper..

My advice in finding the right car:

First off, definitely keep an open mind on authorised dealer vs independent garage and be as flexible as you can budget wise as some reasonable degree of budget creep here can often yield a much better car, and therefore a more enjoyable ownership experience. The 'premium' can sometimes be not that great, especially after you factor in 2 years of power warranty, and all the other benefits. A car being sold by the Ferrari network has had a Ferrari inspection, before they add the warranty (instead of you having to personally organise and pay for a PPI), it is also very likely to be a car which has never been serviced outside of the network and often will have spent a large portion of its life under warranty.

That does have some value and does speak to the way the car has been looked after, it should not be disregarded automatically, as it all points to a car that has been well cared for, and had money spent on it when needed. It will also tend to be a car with lower number of owners, and lower miles.

Please don't listen to anyone that tells you 'number of owners and miles does not matter'

A car with 3 owners and 20,000 miles is far, far less likely to have been tracked hard, launched, abused, rented out, etc than a car with 11 owners and 45,000 miles...

I'm not saying you should only consider authorised dealer cars (not at all), but at the very least you should go and view some, compare them with the rest and see what you think based off of personal experience. Be open to cars from both sales channels.

When I first started my search for a Ferrari a few years ago (it was actually initially a F12) I was surprised at some of the strange and dubious places with shocking reviews which F12's, 458, 599, 488, California T's, etc end up in. Buy the dealer as much as the car, don't just go on price vs age/miles/spec. Avoid places that have none to little experience with Ferrari's and if not via the network at least buy via a trusted specialist who sells these cars regularly, knows them well, and has built their reputation around them, rather than a garage that sells SUV's and Mini's day in day out and has taken a punt on a 458...

I would advise driving more than one car if possible, as that itself is a good way to gauge certain things, which you cannot pick up on from pictures or just seeing a car sat in a showroom. I personally wanted a car from 2012-2013 period as felt they represented the best value overall, e.g. not first years of production but not so late into the cycle as to be paying a big premium for one of the later cars.

Spec wise:

The carbon fibre drive zone and LED's for me was a must, and is widely considered important for resale. It does make a big difference aesthetically IMO.

Having carbon fibre is a big plus especially interior wise where it really brings the interior to life and enhances everything. The aluminium finish which you get instead of the carbon fibre is nowhere near as nice, and lets the car down and cheapens the interior in my opinion. It was one of the main things on my list- carbon fibre central drive zone, dashboard inserts, drive zone, sills, etc. I managed to find a 458 which even had the 458 speciale carbon fibre door inserts, carbon fibre engine covers, and wheel caps. The exterior carbon is nice too, especially at the back. Was not on my list as such but glad to have it.

Rear camera is a big plus, even if the view from it is not the best. Its at a very strange angle I find.

The lift is 100% NOT needed. You will be surprised at how high the 458 sits, I have driven it in numerous city centres and never even had the slightest scrape and that includes various car parks, inc some multistorey. It is not a long car and does not have long bonnet or 'nose' for want of a better word so you will be fine on that front.

The JBL stereo upgrade is good option to have as well.

Bucket vs Sports seats- I like the way they look and of course some people prefer them but they were not on my list, I actually prefer the standard sports seats because of how adjustable they are and the extra comfort that brings. Don't get me wrong I would have bought a car with the buckets if everything else was right and they are very nice but not a must at all. The sports seats with contrast stitching are very nice. The leather is very sensitive though and can mark easily, so be careful, that also applies to black interiors in my experience.

The upgrade 20" sports forged alloys IMO are a big improvement on the standard wheels cast iron, which were apparently much heavier but also to me aesthetically did not look as good.


Good luck in finding your car and enjoy it when you do!

ANOpax

867 posts

169 months

Thursday 30th May
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Chad_Hugo said:
Please don't listen to anyone that tells you 'number of owners and miles does not matter'

A car with 3 owners and 20,000 miles is far, far less likely to have been tracked hard, launched, abused, rented out, etc than a car with 11 owners and 45,000 miles...
Consider your first car with 3 owners and 20,000 miles.

Let's assume that it's an early car so 15 years old and has been serviced outside the network since the 7 year service ran out. It's technically averaged 1,300 miles a year but the current owner works overseas and the car has hardly moved between MOTs in the last 4 years (that's why he's selling via an independent on SOR). Service record paperwork is complete but a couple were missed while the owner was away and advisories haven't been complied or dealt with. Paint is stone chipped.

Consider your second car with 11 owners and 45,000 miles

Let's assume that it's 11 years old and has been kept in the Ferrari network since the 7 year servicing ran out. It's averaged 4,000 miles a year and had PPF on from new so the paint is pristine. Since it's been jobbed on every year by the PCP crowd to clock up the 11 owners, it has remained in the network and always been under warranty so all the service advisories have been dealt with including a DCT rebuild two years ago for a failed speed sensor. It's been to the 'ring a couple of times so the CCBs and pads have just been replaced by Ferrari (who are selling it).

Which car are you going to buy (oh, and the low miler carries a £20k premium for the miles)? Based on your logic, you'd take the low owner/low miler.
I'd take the high miler in a heartbeat beer






Edited by ANOpax on Thursday 30th May 20:22

fridaypassion

8,843 posts

231 months

Thursday 30th May
quotequote all
Try sticking a wanted ad on the UK FB page you might well find something thats not on the market.

Get the best condition lowest mileage oner you can find. You have to keep an eye on resale and 458 buyers are all spec wes they are not the easiest cars to move on if the specs not there. If you can get one with carbon seats this will make your life much easier ditto resale red.

You categorically do not need lift. there are hardly any cars were specced with lift so you are unnecessarily really limiting yourself with this. I have the most awkward driveway in the world my GT4 scuffs every time I come in and out. The 458 could have been lowered 10cm and still wouldn't have scraped. They are like a bloody 4x4 ride height.

It's a really tough market at the moment so I wouldn't be afraid of making a bid on one thats been sat a while. Most will be on sale or return with these bigger dealers and they can always forward a bid to the owner.

This ones been for sale for ages and would be my pick for having a sensible conversation with the owner

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202307300...

Not resale red but looks value

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202311214...

It's a golden time to buy at the moment with the market still not amazing for these things. I've not looked at 458s for a while (will be getting another one when my 600LT sells) but most of whats on auto trader was there last time I looked a few months back. The market will surely come back at some point for the last NA V8 Ferrari!

andyr

369 posts

287 months

Thursday 30th May
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Prices holding up well. That first spider on at 145k is identical to mine, but mine is a 2013 and it was on 15k miles when I bought it for 150k

Not that it’s sold at 145k yet - but I would be happy to get a similar price if I was ever to sell mine.

Edited by andyr on Thursday 30th May 22:01

supersport

4,142 posts

230 months

Thursday 30th May
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I prefer the Grigio Silverstone car, 458 looks amazing in that colour. But then I’m slightly biased hehe

I wouldn’t be going for the lowest mileage possible, they need to be driven. 20k upwards seems sensible, and that’s still low for one that’s actually been used.

NickyF

42 posts

88 months

Friday 31st May
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I agree that I'd avoid very low miles examples, maybe due to them sitting around not being great, but mainly they have a big premium that disappears as soon as you put the miles on. They are for collectors. Mine has 25k and is a 2015, she's been super reliable in the 3 years I've had it. Not sure where I stand on the lift thing, I have it and have been grateful for it a few times. I've come across some massive speed bumps that have needed the lift but it is rare. Anything even vaguely normal is fine but if you find yourself comfronted with something that needs a lift and you haven't got it you're a bit stuck.

I agree with one of the previous posters regarding options, more carbon the better, particularly on the inside and the driver zone is a must. I don't have the racing seats and I'm jealous but the standard seats are fine. Regardless of number of owners /miles find a car that's clearly been looked after. Despite having done 16k miles when I bought it mine could have passed for brand new (almost). The previous owner(s) clearly maintained it regardless of cost and that's more important than anything..

Such a great car though, good choice! I've recently added an 812GTS and while it's more "awesome" on the road I'd argue the 458 is more fun. Such an easy car to drive fast and you can really have some fun without it feeling like it might kill you at any moment.

murphyaj

721 posts

78 months

Friday 31st May
quotequote all
ANOpax said:
Consider your first car with 3 owners and 20,000 miles.

Let's assume that it's an early car so 15 years old and has been serviced outside the network since the 7 year service ran out. It's technically averaged 1,300 miles a year but the current owner works overseas and the car has hardly moved between MOTs in the last 4 years (that's why he's selling via an independent on SOR). Service record paperwork is complete but a couple were missed while the owner was away and advisories haven't been complied or dealt with. Paint is stone chipped.

Consider your second car with 11 owners and 45,000 miles

Let's assume that it's 11 years old and has been kept in the Ferrari network since the 7 year servicing ran out. It's averaged 4,000 miles a year and had PPF on from new so the paint is pristine. Since it's been jobbed on every year by the PCP crowd to clock up the 11 owners, it has remained in the network and always been under warranty so all the service advisories have been dealt with including a DCT rebuild two years ago for a failed speed sensor. It's been to the 'ring a couple of times so the CCBs and pads have just been replaced by Ferrari (who are selling it).

Which car are you going to buy (oh, and the low miler carries a £20k premium for the miles)? Based on your logic, you'd take the low owner/low miler.
I'd take the high miler in a heartbeat beer






Edited by ANOpax on Thursday 30th May 20:22
1000% this

For a given spec the top 3 things you need to look for in order are:
1) condition
2) condition
3) condition

There are low mileage dogs out there, and high mileage cars that owners have kept in pristine condition and addressed every issue because they have to when they rely on the car to get about. I'm also not sure about the logic that high miles means it's more likely to have been tracked, is anybody doing 10,000 miles around castle combe? Surely a high mile car is more likely to have been used for long european tours rather than track days.

And that's before we get into the clocking issue. It's hardly a secret that the mileage on the dash doesn't necessarily tell you how far the car has been driven, so that massive premium you are paying for the 20k car in this example might be just a reward for some c**t fitting a mileage blocker.

Condition, condition, condition

https://mileage-blocker.co.uk/product-category/fer...
https://mileage-corrections.co.uk/cars/ferrari-mil...
https://milesback.co.uk/product-category/ferrari/


WCZ

10,639 posts

197 months

Friday 31st May
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buckets + condition are what i'd personally care about the most smile

maura

196 posts

26 months

Friday 31st May
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Agree, higher mileage low owners was what I was looking for when buying my F12. Don’t be put off by private sellers with an excellent car either still under Ferrari Warranty, unless you need p/x finance or the showroom experience. You learn a lot from the owner. I buy cars to drive not store and I knew the V12’s get better with miles on them, so as above, don’t be put off by a car that’s averaged 2 to 3 k miles per year. Sweet spot for me would be 20k miles and low owners. Good luck, enjoyable times.

fridaypassion

8,843 posts

231 months

Friday 31st May
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Come resale all this talk of higher mileage cars is pure fantasy. Ferrari owners are firstly spec wes and secondly mileage wes! I personally think the use of mileage blockers is probably less widespread than you would think. You can generally look at the condition of a car and see if its drastically out or not. Ferraris have a lot of clues in paint/glass/underside/suspension/engine bay/brakes you would easily be able to see if it was more tired than it should be. Always get them inspected for peace of mind anyway.


Ra11rah

Original Poster:

8 posts

2 months

Friday 31st May
quotequote all
Evening all, I’ve missed the thread for a while (seemed to die off and haven’t checked it). Actually put a deposit on a car today after viewing - 30k miles, rosso corsa nero roof, buckets, lift, nav, JBL’s etc. full dealer service history. Couple of small things dealer is sorting then delivery!!

GT4_Tom

36 posts

180 months

Friday 31st May
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Ra11rah said:
Evening all, I’ve missed the thread for a while (seemed to die off and haven’t checked it). Actually put a deposit on a car today after viewing - 30k miles, rosso corsa nero roof, buckets, lift, nav, JBL’s etc. full dealer service history. Couple of small things dealer is sorting then delivery!!

Guessing the one from Autolounge?

Ra11rah

Original Poster:

8 posts

2 months

Friday 31st May
quotequote all
GT4_Tom said:

Guessing the one from Autolounge?
Might be 👍🏻😂

andyr

369 posts

287 months

Saturday 1st June
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fridaypassion said:
Come resale all this talk of higher mileage cars is pure fantasy. Ferrari owners are firstly spec wes and secondly mileage wes! I personally think the use of mileage blockers is probably less widespread than you would think. You can generally look at the condition of a car and see if its drastically out or not. Ferraris have a lot of clues in paint/glass/underside/suspension/engine bay/brakes you would easily be able to see if it was more tired than it should be. Always get them inspected for peace of mind anyway.
Agreed the CCDs are a useful guide. They should approx wear at 1% per 1000 miles. The fronts and backs wear differently due to traction control at the rear. You could also look at pad wear between services - if Ferrari serviced then that is stored on their system as is CCD condition. Each gear also records a mileage on the 458.

If buying now, I would prob go for one between 20 and 30k miles. I bought mine at 15k miles 3 years ago - I felt that was about where the best value was.

fridaypassion

8,843 posts

231 months

Saturday 1st June
quotequote all
My next one will be totally different I went down the sensible FTB route resale red 17000 miles carbon seats. I want to build a fast road 458 so will be looking for something not high mileage or cat cars etc but something we can have a bit of fun with. Girodisc/repaint none OEM colour/put some race buckets in that sort of thing.

GT4_Tom

36 posts

180 months

Saturday 1st June
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Ra11rah said:
Might be ??????
All the best bud, looks a good specification. 👍

andyr

369 posts

287 months

Saturday 1st June
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JJ77. Yes about right i would say. Similar to mine at 18k miles.

If they were at say 70% then there might be some mismatch vs mileage. They are expensive to replace so I think they are a good guide to clocked cars.

My experience is that the ccds wear at different rates based on the traction control. I believe the 458 uses rear breaking quite extensively- so could be a guide to tracked cars or ones that have been pushed a lot. Nothing wrong in that, but it’s something to consider.

JJ77

87 posts

51 months

Saturday 1st June
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It’s actually a F12 and I know the owner, it’s never been tracked. So a 4% difference front back is spot on then with the traction control.