Living with a McLaren 650s Spider as an (almost) daily
Discussion
Car has been (mostly) fault free since I got it back from Ascot ~10 days ago. The roof seal still looks badly fitted to me - but the heavy rain on Saturday seems to have proved that they have stopped it leaking, so that's a big plus.
The headlights are still crap, and frankly not fit for purpose in their current state. I was driving down some dark country lanes at the weekend - the type that are only about 1.5 cars wide - and I could see absolutely f**k all. We were only doing 30-40mph, and my passenger asked me why I wasn't using high beam. My answer was that I was. This absolutely must be sorted at the service in December - I mailed Ascot yesterday to make them aware.
Incidentally - I've seen posts saying the sat nav is crap, but it worked well for me at the weekend. It even warned me of congestion, and offered an alternative route which is not something I was aware it could do.
The noise from the dashboard has been mostly fixed, but the much louder noise from the passenger door wasn't there when I dropped the car off! So that needs to be sorted out in the service too.
DAB is crap - whether it's worse in my car than it should be, I don't know but will get Ascot to take a look in December. Incidentally - the ~£800 for a minor / £1500 for a major seems to be an overly simplistic view of the service cost. I've been told that my (5 year) service isn't a major - but isn't a minor either, it's somewhere in between - and the book price is ~£1,450.
I don't really want to continue tyre-pressure gate, but it looks like the right rear was slightly lower than the other 3. I topped it up yesterday and had no warning this morning, although it may not have been cold enough.
Did a long run at the weekend, but still didn't see the kind if mpg that some people do - only managed ~23mpg and I can't imagine ever seeing anywhere close to 30. That was ~120 miles of mostly motorway at about the speed limit on cruise control.
Overall, I covered ~300 miles on Sunday and was very impressed with the car. I've mentioned before that one of the great things about it is that if you're really not in the mood, you can just stick it in auto mode and relax - which is exactly what I did on the drive home. Did get into a minor bit of trouble when the g/f noticed that the number plate had changed - and even more trouble when she discovered I did that a month ago and didn't tell her.
Had a lovely drive in to work this morning - roof down, and luckily got a clear run.
I've now done ~1,900 miles since buying the car on 24th August - so I really do need to try harder to keep the mileage down a bit and leave some spare for the summer. But this is where the situation with the car is actually a bit confusing. I want to drive it all the time - 2 months / 2k miles later, I still find excuses to go out in it. I love driving it, and I think it looks great. It does almost everything very very well, and is genuinely better at 90% of things than all the cars I've owned before.
But for some reason, I still don't know how long I'll keep the car. I still don't want to sell the Ferrari - even though I've only used it once in the last 2 months (I should probably check it's still in the garage!). I'm not sure why this is - the car is brilliant - if you ignore the niggles it's had - it should be a car that I want to keep until it (or I) disintegrate from old age. But I haven't reached that point yet.
It might be the cost. I sank a lot of my capital into the car, and I'm aware that it's value is dropping faster than a Boeing 737 - but I knew that before I bought it, so I don't really think it's that. Maybe it's that I'm worried about the running costs - most things are "free" other than the servicing - but that's because of the warranty, which isn't exactly cheap. But again, I knew that - and the warranty is paid until August 2021 so I'm not really expecting any nasty surprises for almost 2 years - and if I decide that's too much, I could swap to Thorney which is half the cost.
Maybe I just haven't had the car long enough to properly fall for it. I can't imagine selling it - I can't think of anything that could replace it - so in that respect, I guess I do appreciate it. But that magical spark that some cars have (including my recently neglected 360) is still missing for me. I hope it turns up soon.
The headlights are still crap, and frankly not fit for purpose in their current state. I was driving down some dark country lanes at the weekend - the type that are only about 1.5 cars wide - and I could see absolutely f**k all. We were only doing 30-40mph, and my passenger asked me why I wasn't using high beam. My answer was that I was. This absolutely must be sorted at the service in December - I mailed Ascot yesterday to make them aware.
Incidentally - I've seen posts saying the sat nav is crap, but it worked well for me at the weekend. It even warned me of congestion, and offered an alternative route which is not something I was aware it could do.
The noise from the dashboard has been mostly fixed, but the much louder noise from the passenger door wasn't there when I dropped the car off! So that needs to be sorted out in the service too.
DAB is crap - whether it's worse in my car than it should be, I don't know but will get Ascot to take a look in December. Incidentally - the ~£800 for a minor / £1500 for a major seems to be an overly simplistic view of the service cost. I've been told that my (5 year) service isn't a major - but isn't a minor either, it's somewhere in between - and the book price is ~£1,450.
I don't really want to continue tyre-pressure gate, but it looks like the right rear was slightly lower than the other 3. I topped it up yesterday and had no warning this morning, although it may not have been cold enough.
Did a long run at the weekend, but still didn't see the kind if mpg that some people do - only managed ~23mpg and I can't imagine ever seeing anywhere close to 30. That was ~120 miles of mostly motorway at about the speed limit on cruise control.
Overall, I covered ~300 miles on Sunday and was very impressed with the car. I've mentioned before that one of the great things about it is that if you're really not in the mood, you can just stick it in auto mode and relax - which is exactly what I did on the drive home. Did get into a minor bit of trouble when the g/f noticed that the number plate had changed - and even more trouble when she discovered I did that a month ago and didn't tell her.
Had a lovely drive in to work this morning - roof down, and luckily got a clear run.
I've now done ~1,900 miles since buying the car on 24th August - so I really do need to try harder to keep the mileage down a bit and leave some spare for the summer. But this is where the situation with the car is actually a bit confusing. I want to drive it all the time - 2 months / 2k miles later, I still find excuses to go out in it. I love driving it, and I think it looks great. It does almost everything very very well, and is genuinely better at 90% of things than all the cars I've owned before.
But for some reason, I still don't know how long I'll keep the car. I still don't want to sell the Ferrari - even though I've only used it once in the last 2 months (I should probably check it's still in the garage!). I'm not sure why this is - the car is brilliant - if you ignore the niggles it's had - it should be a car that I want to keep until it (or I) disintegrate from old age. But I haven't reached that point yet.
It might be the cost. I sank a lot of my capital into the car, and I'm aware that it's value is dropping faster than a Boeing 737 - but I knew that before I bought it, so I don't really think it's that. Maybe it's that I'm worried about the running costs - most things are "free" other than the servicing - but that's because of the warranty, which isn't exactly cheap. But again, I knew that - and the warranty is paid until August 2021 so I'm not really expecting any nasty surprises for almost 2 years - and if I decide that's too much, I could swap to Thorney which is half the cost.
Maybe I just haven't had the car long enough to properly fall for it. I can't imagine selling it - I can't think of anything that could replace it - so in that respect, I guess I do appreciate it. But that magical spark that some cars have (including my recently neglected 360) is still missing for me. I hope it turns up soon.
Sounds like you absolutely love the car but hate the small niggles. May only be small niggles but not being able to drive the car comfortably/safely at night for example would bother anyone in a modern. The squeaks and rattles are always going to be there as using new lightweight construction methods will have an impact on perceived quality especially for German car owners and or the modern Italians car owners from say 2007 onwards. You can't have everything if you want lighter sports cars - reminds me of a Lotus test driver at Hethel test track telling me a Lotus wouldn't be Lotus without its creaking dashboard, squeaks and rattles - went pretty well though 
IMI A said:
The squeaks and rattles are always going to be there as using new lightweight construction methods will have an impact on perceived quality especially for German car owners and or the modern Italians car owners from say 2007 onwards. You can't have everything if you want lighter sports cars - reminds me of a Lotus test driver at Hethel test track telling me a Lotus wouldn't be Lotus without its creaking dashboard, squeaks and rattles - went pretty well though
Do all 650s squeak n rattle ? My 720 has none at all and hasn't had since new, it feels and sounds extremely solid.IMI A said:
... The squeaks and rattles are always going to be there as using new lightweight construction methods will have an impact on perceived quality...
Is that true? Surely it is about parts being made and designed to the right tolerances and then fitted properly. Especially given one has appeared after the service so it looks they didn't put something back properly when servicing the car.The headlights sound strange since you would surely expect any modern car to be up to scratch in that department. If you have a good relationship with whoever looks after your 360 it might be worth getting them to have a quick look and give an independent view. I can't see any reason why it needs a McLaren specialist to check headlights.
IMI A said:
The squeaks and rattles are always going to be there as using new lightweight construction methods will have an impact on perceived quality
I'm sorry but that is absolutely nonsense. Poor fit and finish due to bad tolerances or fitting is exactly that and nothing to do with 'lightweight construction'.I don't think the new rattle from the passenger door was caused by the service team - it's an unfortunate coincidence. The car went in for some specific things to be fixed (it wasn't a general service), so they had no reason to be messing around with the passenger door.
I will get it sorted in December anyway. Given my ownership experience so far, it seems unlikely the list of things to fix won't be longer by then - but we'll see. It's quite nice that nothing has gone wrong with it in the last 10 days, even if that is partly due to reduced use.
I will get it sorted in December anyway. Given my ownership experience so far, it seems unlikely the list of things to fix won't be longer by then - but we'll see. It's quite nice that nothing has gone wrong with it in the last 10 days, even if that is partly due to reduced use.
isaldiri said:
IMI A said:
The squeaks and rattles are always going to be there as using new lightweight construction methods will have an impact on perceived quality
I'm sorry but that is absolutely nonsense. Poor fit and finish due to bad tolerances or fitting is exactly that and nothing to do with 'lightweight construction'.davek_964 said:
Car has been (mostly) fault free since I got it back from Ascot ~10 days ago. The roof seal still looks badly fitted to me - but the heavy rain on Saturday seems to have proved that they have stopped it leaking, so that's a big plus.
The headlights are still crap, and frankly not fit for purpose in their current state. I was driving down some dark country lanes at the weekend - the type that are only about 1.5 cars wide - and I could see absolutely f**k all. We were only doing 30-40mph, and my passenger asked me why I wasn't using high beam. My answer was that I was. This absolutely must be sorted at the service in December - I mailed Ascot yesterday to make them aware.
Incidentally - I've seen posts saying the sat nav is crap, but it worked well for me at the weekend. It even warned me of congestion, and offered an alternative route which is not something I was aware it could do.
The noise from the dashboard has been mostly fixed, but the much louder noise from the passenger door wasn't there when I dropped the car off! So that needs to be sorted out in the service too.
DAB is crap - whether it's worse in my car than it should be, I don't know but will get Ascot to take a look in December. Incidentally - the ~£800 for a minor / £1500 for a major seems to be an overly simplistic view of the service cost. I've been told that my (5 year) service isn't a major - but isn't a minor either, it's somewhere in between - and the book price is ~£1,450.
I don't really want to continue tyre-pressure gate, but it looks like the right rear was slightly lower than the other 3. I topped it up yesterday and had no warning this morning, although it may not have been cold enough.
Did a long run at the weekend, but still didn't see the kind if mpg that some people do - only managed ~23mpg and I can't imagine ever seeing anywhere close to 30. That was ~120 miles of mostly motorway at about the speed limit on cruise control.
Overall, I covered ~300 miles on Sunday and was very impressed with the car. I've mentioned before that one of the great things about it is that if you're really not in the mood, you can just stick it in auto mode and relax - which is exactly what I did on the drive home. Did get into a minor bit of trouble when the g/f noticed that the number plate had changed - and even more trouble when she discovered I did that a month ago and didn't tell her.
Had a lovely drive in to work this morning - roof down, and luckily got a clear run.
I've now done ~1,900 miles since buying the car on 24th August - so I really do need to try harder to keep the mileage down a bit and leave some spare for the summer. But this is where the situation with the car is actually a bit confusing. I want to drive it all the time - 2 months / 2k miles later, I still find excuses to go out in it. I love driving it, and I think it looks great. It does almost everything very very well, and is genuinely better at 90% of things than all the cars I've owned before.
But for some reason, I still don't know how long I'll keep the car. I still don't want to sell the Ferrari - even though I've only used it once in the last 2 months (I should probably check it's still in the garage!). I'm not sure why this is - the car is brilliant - if you ignore the niggles it's had - it should be a car that I want to keep until it (or I) disintegrate from old age. But I haven't reached that point yet.
It might be the cost. I sank a lot of my capital into the car, and I'm aware that it's value is dropping faster than a Boeing 737 - but I knew that before I bought it, so I don't really think it's that. Maybe it's that I'm worried about the running costs - most things are "free" other than the servicing - but that's because of the warranty, which isn't exactly cheap. But again, I knew that - and the warranty is paid until August 2021 so I'm not really expecting any nasty surprises for almost 2 years - and if I decide that's too much, I could swap to Thorney which is half the cost.
Maybe I just haven't had the car long enough to properly fall for it. I can't imagine selling it - I can't think of anything that could replace it - so in that respect, I guess I do appreciate it. But that magical spark that some cars have (including my recently neglected 360) is still missing for me. I hope it turns up soon.
The thing is, cars at this level are very emotional things. Sometimes the chemistry just isn't there. I had a similar experience when I got a 458 Spider. It went like stink, people loved it, it was a Ferrari! But I just didn't take to it and I still don't know why. Didn't regret selling it at all. Now have an AM V12 Vantage S roadster. My second V12 Vantage. Measurably worse at just about everything than the Fezza, but I love it. I guess it's the same sort of thing as we don't all fall in love with the same womanThe headlights are still crap, and frankly not fit for purpose in their current state. I was driving down some dark country lanes at the weekend - the type that are only about 1.5 cars wide - and I could see absolutely f**k all. We were only doing 30-40mph, and my passenger asked me why I wasn't using high beam. My answer was that I was. This absolutely must be sorted at the service in December - I mailed Ascot yesterday to make them aware.
Incidentally - I've seen posts saying the sat nav is crap, but it worked well for me at the weekend. It even warned me of congestion, and offered an alternative route which is not something I was aware it could do.
The noise from the dashboard has been mostly fixed, but the much louder noise from the passenger door wasn't there when I dropped the car off! So that needs to be sorted out in the service too.
DAB is crap - whether it's worse in my car than it should be, I don't know but will get Ascot to take a look in December. Incidentally - the ~£800 for a minor / £1500 for a major seems to be an overly simplistic view of the service cost. I've been told that my (5 year) service isn't a major - but isn't a minor either, it's somewhere in between - and the book price is ~£1,450.
I don't really want to continue tyre-pressure gate, but it looks like the right rear was slightly lower than the other 3. I topped it up yesterday and had no warning this morning, although it may not have been cold enough.
Did a long run at the weekend, but still didn't see the kind if mpg that some people do - only managed ~23mpg and I can't imagine ever seeing anywhere close to 30. That was ~120 miles of mostly motorway at about the speed limit on cruise control.
Overall, I covered ~300 miles on Sunday and was very impressed with the car. I've mentioned before that one of the great things about it is that if you're really not in the mood, you can just stick it in auto mode and relax - which is exactly what I did on the drive home. Did get into a minor bit of trouble when the g/f noticed that the number plate had changed - and even more trouble when she discovered I did that a month ago and didn't tell her.
Had a lovely drive in to work this morning - roof down, and luckily got a clear run.
I've now done ~1,900 miles since buying the car on 24th August - so I really do need to try harder to keep the mileage down a bit and leave some spare for the summer. But this is where the situation with the car is actually a bit confusing. I want to drive it all the time - 2 months / 2k miles later, I still find excuses to go out in it. I love driving it, and I think it looks great. It does almost everything very very well, and is genuinely better at 90% of things than all the cars I've owned before.
But for some reason, I still don't know how long I'll keep the car. I still don't want to sell the Ferrari - even though I've only used it once in the last 2 months (I should probably check it's still in the garage!). I'm not sure why this is - the car is brilliant - if you ignore the niggles it's had - it should be a car that I want to keep until it (or I) disintegrate from old age. But I haven't reached that point yet.
It might be the cost. I sank a lot of my capital into the car, and I'm aware that it's value is dropping faster than a Boeing 737 - but I knew that before I bought it, so I don't really think it's that. Maybe it's that I'm worried about the running costs - most things are "free" other than the servicing - but that's because of the warranty, which isn't exactly cheap. But again, I knew that - and the warranty is paid until August 2021 so I'm not really expecting any nasty surprises for almost 2 years - and if I decide that's too much, I could swap to Thorney which is half the cost.
Maybe I just haven't had the car long enough to properly fall for it. I can't imagine selling it - I can't think of anything that could replace it - so in that respect, I guess I do appreciate it. But that magical spark that some cars have (including my recently neglected 360) is still missing for me. I hope it turns up soon.
jtremlett said:
IMI A said:
... The squeaks and rattles are always going to be there as using new lightweight construction methods will have an impact on perceived quality...
Is that true? Surely it is about parts being made and designed to the right tolerances and then fitted properly. Especially given one has appeared after the service so it looks they didn't put something back properly when servicing the car.The headlights sound strange since you would surely expect any modern car to be up to scratch in that department. If you have a good relationship with whoever looks after your 360 it might be worth getting them to have a quick look and give an independent view. I can't see any reason why it needs a McLaren specialist to check headlights.
Took a 2013 991 turbo s for a spin when they were launched and the demo had squeaks and rattles everywhere perhaps because it was one of the first in the country. Bought a new 2018 991.2 turbo s which should rattle more in theory being a cab but its as quiet as my 997 coupe so you'll get good ones and bad ones and its not Mcl specific. Any car can have the odd squeak and rattle but back in the day cars like Lancia, Maserati and Lotus were famous for it!
IMI A said:
When Porsche made the all carbon CGT they warned customers that they would need to recalibrate what they expected from a Porsche in terms of what they perceive good quality build standard - for example doors close without the hewn from granite feel.
Again, with all due politeness that is absolutely nonsense as well.Hurri360 said:
If you tried using the 360 every day and the 650 on special days ie reverse the roles, do you think your feelings about the cars would change also?
My view would probably change, but I don't think my view would swap cars (if that makes sense).The 360 just isn't a daily car. I know there are people who've used them for that - and (until recently) I do use mine for daily duties on sunny days (shopping, commuting etc.) - if I'm in the mood to use it. But I'm not always in the mood to use it, and if I had to change my cars such that the 360 became the semi-daily, then I think it would be sold for something else. I think it's a brilliant car, but I think I'd find it tiring driving it that often.
I'm not sure what I'd think if the 650 was an occasional car. I used my 996 turbo as a semi-daily car, and I was absolutely 100% sure that it could never ever be a weekend sunny day toy for me - it just wasn't special enough. I don't think that's true of the McLaren though - it definitely could be a weekend toy. It might be the case that I'd feel it was more special if that was the case - and I am gradually reducing how much I use it in the week at this time of year anyway - but I'm not convinced the regular use is blurring my feelings about it that much, It still feels special every time I use it - and it is just so damn good as a daily car!
isaldiri said:
IMI A said:
When Porsche made the all carbon CGT they warned customers that they would need to recalibrate what they expected from a Porsche in terms of what they perceive good quality build standard - for example doors close without the hewn from granite feel.
Again, with all due politeness that is absolutely nonsense as well.ferdi p said:
IMI A said:
Makes sense to me and totally intuitive. One door cf and closes like its plastic the other ali or steel with typical porsche thunk!
Most have soft-close so they close like a modern kitchen drawer!davek_964 said:
The headlights are still crap, and frankly not fit for purpose in their current state. I was driving down some dark country lanes at the weekend - the type that are only about 1.5 cars wide - and I could see absolutely f**k all. We were only doing 30-40mph, and my passenger asked me why I wasn't using high beam. My answer was that I was. This absolutely must be sorted at the service in December - I mailed Ascot yesterday to make them aware.
Just a thought - You dont have PPF on the headlights by any chance ?. I've got a Hymer Motorhome that I recently had to buy a new (£1300 !) headlight for after stone damage - I PPF'd them after that and it ruined the lighting performance (not that it matters much @ 60mph)
speedick said:
Just a thought - You dont have PPF on the headlights by any chance ?.
I've got a Hymer Motorhome that I recently had to buy a new (£1300 !) headlight for after stone damage - I PPF'd them after that and it ruined the lighting performance (not that it matters much @ 60mph)
No - car doesn't have PPF.I've got a Hymer Motorhome that I recently had to buy a new (£1300 !) headlight for after stone damage - I PPF'd them after that and it ruined the lighting performance (not that it matters much @ 60mph)
I think it's purely the adjustment. If I am going up a slight hill, then as the road levels out, I can briefly see perfectly in the distance. The lights themselves seem perfectly bright - but only about 10ft in front of the car, even on high beam! They need to point much further forwards / higher.
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