Porsche Taycan

[SWoll]

ZesPak said:

Heres Johnny said:

You don't really pick a Model 3 over the Taycan on any other grounds than affordability.

Indeed

It is a more practical car both for passengers and parking etc. and despite claims if you are doing big mileages around the UK motorway network the charging experience is going to be considerably less of a worry. If the choice is between the LR and the base Taycan RWD with no options as could be the case there are also a number of other advantages to consider?

I'd have a Taycan tomorrow BTW, but it would cost almost double the LR for the spec I'd be happy with (and that's being gentle on the options list)

Edited by SWoll on Wednesday 19th May 11:06

[ecs]

Dave Hedgehog said:

andy43 said:

Schmee150 has a Taycan - his video from the weekend is worth a watch if you want to use a Taycan for long distances.
I've not driven one but I'd guess it's a far far better drivers car than the Tesla S (but no hatch which for me is essential) until you come to fill it back up with electric - videos like that are a real eyeopener.
Video summary : 3 hours spent, 2 charging stations visited, many failures and stoppages, gained about 30% charge, mostly at 40p/kw, gave up, went home.

it was very suspicious he deliberatly drove an hour out of his way to find a fast charger only to get their and it was borked, which was lucky as it made for great content

and i dont buy the bks he comes out with about not being able to fit a charger in his rented car park, he spunks £100ks on car payments he could drop a grand to have a basic 3.6kw charger in one bay which would cover him most of the time given how little he uses each car (as there are so many)

Edited by Dave Hedgehog on Wednesday 19th May 10:09

He's hamming it up because it's good for business. It's like James May's recent video about his Model S 12v battery going flat - surely a new Tesla comes with some kind of assistance for when something goes wrong? I know that if the same happened on my Taycan, Porsche Assist would be out within two hours and I'd be carrying on with my day. That wouldn't get many views, likes or comments on YouTube though would it...

[SWoll]

ecs said:

He's hamming it up because it's good for business. It's like James May's recent video about his Model S 12v battery going flat - surely a new Tesla comes with some kind of assistance for when something goes wrong? I know that if the same happened on my Taycan, Porsche Assist would be out within two hours and I'd be carrying on with my day. That wouldn't get many views, likes or comments on YouTube though would it...

Agreed. You've only got to look at the comments sections to see the utter joy videos like these bring to the majority of their following.

[Dave Hedgehog]

SWoll said:

ecs said:

He's hamming it up because it's good for business. It's like James May's recent video about his Model S 12v battery going flat - surely a new Tesla comes with some kind of assistance for when something goes wrong? I know that if the same happened on my Taycan, Porsche Assist would be out within two hours and I'd be carrying on with my day. That wouldn't get many views, likes or comments on YouTube though would it...

Agreed. You've only got to look at the comments sections to see the utter joy videos like these bring to the majority of their following.

i gave up pointing out to them it was user error ...

i hadnt thought that it would be covered by Tesla as well

[andy43]

Dave Hedgehog said:

SWoll said:

ecs said:

He's hamming it up because it's good for business. It's like James May's recent video about his Model S 12v battery going flat - surely a new Tesla comes with some kind of assistance for when something goes wrong? I know that if the same happened on my Taycan, Porsche Assist would be out within two hours and I'd be carrying on with my day. That wouldn't get many views, likes or comments on YouTube though would it...

Agreed. You've only got to look at the comments sections to see the utter joy videos like these bring to the majority of their following.

i gave up pointing out to them it was user error ...

i hadnt thought that it would be covered by Tesla as well

I wasn't trying to come across as a Tesla 'enthusiast' but what got me about the video was the total mission failure.
Could be a clickbait video set up to slate EVs, I've no idea, but the complete look of frustration on his face seemed realistic.
We've had EVs since 2015, always charged at home until we got the current Tesla, and have never had a problem at home or when using the superchargers. The Porsche is better looking, better built and certainly a better drive, but the chances of travelling long distances successfully is variable - and if you're spending six figures on a car that's not good.
Once he did manage to stretch the cable and position the car close enough to finally plug the thing in (who in gods name thought it'd be a good idea to stick the charging socket under the wing mirror?!) was it his car stopping charge constantly due to a fault, or the network having a fit and dropping out?
Easy to pay... he didn't need an app etc... then he's stood in the rain for nearly a minute while the charger 'communicates' with the car and decides whether or not to grant it electricity. The supercharger user would be inside in the dry ordering his coffee at that point.
It's easy to say it's down to user error or lack of knowledge but really, this stuff should just work. It should be as easy as filling with petrol.

[Heres Johnny]

Just watch a video of someone else who's charged more than onmce using the new ecotricity chargers

https://youtu.be/3-3WoyZiOTY

Public charging is getting easier all the time and more widespread.

[Zcd1]

https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/comparison-te...

[ZesPak]

Zcd1 said:

https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/comparison-te...

Car and Driver said:

Second Place:
The Porsche:
Highs: Bold styling, sports-car-like handling, beautifully finished, neat EV sounds.
Lows: Porsche pricing, modest range, less accommodating for people and stuff.

First Place:
The Tesla
Highs: Big-time range, plenty quick, attractively priced, practical packaging.
Lows: Poor fit and finish, dated interior, bland steering and chassis feel.

That about sums it up for me as well. I remember saying when the Taycan was launched: leave it to Porsche to make a Model S seem "attractively priced".

[Heres Johnny]

Rubbish journalism

Taycan gets 30% range more than its rating because it has a 2 speed gearbox that doesn't kick in during the official test cycle resulting in its real world range being longer than a Model 3 (they also don't tell you to only charge to 90%)

https://insideevs.com/reviews/443791/ev-range-test...

And the Model S starts at £84k and the Taycan starts at £71k. The MS Plaid is 110k v Taycan Turbo at £116k and don't even both mentioning options given Tesla want 8K for FSD that does bugger all really.

[WestyCarl]

Heres Johnny said:

Rubbish journalism

Taycan gets 30% range more than its rating because it has a 2 speed gearbox that doesn't kick in during the official test cycle resulting in its real world range being longer than a Model 3 (they also don't tell you to only charge to 90%)

https://insideevs.com/reviews/443791/ev-range-test...

I could say the same about that article...... A very quick scan shows using a 2019 M3 (the 2021 M3 has a longer EPA range I believe due to heat pump, latest battery) vs 2021 Taycan.

I also think driving at 70mph for 300 miles is not only unrealstic (for the UK) but also not really representitve of what 90% of EV's buyer will be doing.

A more balanced test would be using the latest models and doing a mix (or a number) of tests to find the "real world" best.

[Heres Johnny]

I take your point, but the last time I did over 200 miles in a day the vast majority of it was driving on motorways at higher speeds and you'd be doing well to to do that kind of mileage at speeds lower than 50mph. Range only really matters when you're doing long distances, and long distances generally means higher speeds so the test seems pretty reasonable to me.

The point I'm making though is the Taycan WLTP figures are pretty much always beaten and the people on here trying to dismiss it know full well thats the case.

[WestyCarl]

Heres Johnny said:

I take your point, but the last time I did over 200 miles in a day the vast majority of it was driving on motorways at higher speeds and you'd be doing well to to do that kind of mileage at speeds lower than 50mph. Range only really matters when you're doing long distances, and long distances generally means higher speeds so the test seems pretty reasonable to me.

The point I'm making though is the Taycan WLTP figures are pretty much always beaten and the people on here trying to dismiss it know full well thats the case.

I don't disagree with the Taycan being more efficent at motorway speeds due to the t/m, I think the ultimate range for both will be likely be the same.

The other significant factor for doing long distances in EV's are availability / speed of charging and I think the general concencous is Tesla wins on this. (unless you have charging at the destination you don't want to arrive with 10miles left)

I don't have an EV, but people that have told me it's a mindset change. Charge whenever available (little and often) to keep topped up rather than like an ICE where most of us run until the low fuel light comes on.

[ZesPak]

Heres Johnny said:

Rubbish journalism

Taycan gets 30% range more than its rating because it has a 2 speed gearbox that doesn't kick in during the official test cycle resulting in its real world range being longer than a Model 3 (they also don't tell you to only charge to 90%)

https://insideevs.com/reviews/443791/ev-range-test...

And the Model S starts at £84k and the Taycan starts at £71k. The MS Plaid is 110k v Taycan Turbo at £116k and don't even both mentioning options given Tesla want 8K for FSD that does bugger all really.

It's clear that you didn't like the outcome so didn't bother to read the article and their justification.

1. they claim to have done their own range test
2. the test was vs a LR MS, not a Model 3
3. they mention the base taycan but mention that it wouldn't change their verdict
4. they did mention options. Calling out Tesla for their FSD option is a farce of you ever looked closely at the porsche options list. It's also just about the only option you can select.

[Zcd1]

Heres Johnny said:

Rubbish journalism

Rubbish commentary.

Here's how they test range:

https://www.caranddriver.com/features/a32018270/ho...

[Heres Johnny]

WestyCarl said:

The other significant factor for doing long distances in EV's are availability / speed of charging and I think the general concencous is Tesla wins on this. (unless you have charging at the destination you don't want to arrive with 10miles left)

Tesla certainly wins on the availability, they can charge at all the ones a Taycan can plus obviously their own, but not always on the speed. The issue with Tesla is they tail of the charge rate quite quickly above 50% and to get the really high speeds they claim the conditions need to be near perfect. I know other cars in the VW family like the e-tron keep going at a high rate almost to the end, The Taycan also has an 800V battery tech so when those chargers become more prevalent (although that could be some time) there will be charging options faster than anything - I believe up to 350kw is coming.

[Heres Johnny]

ZesPak said:

It's clear that you didn't like the outcome so didn't bother to read the article and their justification.

1. they claim to have done their own range test
2. the test was vs a LR MS, not a Model 3
3. they mention the base taycan but mention that it wouldn't change their verdict
4. they did mention options. Calling out Tesla for their FSD option is a farce of you ever looked closely at the porsche options list. It's also just about the only option you can select.

Didn't read either the article, I was replying to the same old, same old from you and others just trying to belittle the opposite as illustrated byu your comment below

ZesPak said:

That about sums it up for me as well. I remember saying when the Taycan was launched: leave it to Porsche to make a Model S seem "attractively priced".

The Taycan is widely held up as the best EV you can buy. The new Model S is taking forever to come to the market and we're only now seeing pictures of preproduction cars at US race tracks trying to work out how to make it handle and not just have a 1000 bhp to blast down straights. It could be great to drive, we don't know and won't for a year in the UK. The Model 3 isn't in the same league handling wise as the Taycan, it flatters average drivers with his straight line speed and hard suspension is mistaken for performance suspension, just look at the number of threads on TMC about suspension upgrades and changes that you just don't see with the likes of BMW M cars or Porsche on their respective forums beyond making pure track cars,

If you want to spend 60k or less then sure, get a Model 3 and you'll have a quick car, spend 30k more on a Taycan and you'll have a great car. Thats the choice.

[ZesPak]

Disagree. A 90k Taycan isnt a "great car". Unless you got a good discount on a 110k one.

[off_again]

Heres Johnny said:

The Taycan is widely held up as the best EV you can buy. The new Model S is taking forever to come to the market and we're only now seeing pictures of preproduction cars at US race tracks trying to work out how to make it handle and not just have a 1000 bhp to blast down straights. It could be great to drive, we don't know and won't for a year in the UK. The Model 3 isn't in the same league handling wise as the Taycan, it flatters average drivers with his straight line speed and hard suspension is mistaken for performance suspension, just look at the number of threads on TMC about suspension upgrades and changes that you just don't see with the likes of BMW M cars or Porsche on their respective forums beyond making pure track cars,

If you want to spend 60k or less then sure, get a Model 3 and you'll have a quick car, spend 30k more on a Taycan and you'll have a great car. Thats the choice.

I agree, across a broad spectrum of motoring press, the Taycan is widely praised - except for one thing, the price.

But its a Porsche (again, coming from a serial Porsche buyer) and you pay for the privilege. If feel, handling and quality (:cough: not always the case!) are important to you, then its up to you if you want to pay the premium. But its like so many other things in life. A Seiko automatic for $500 is a fantastic watch and would fit most people, so why is a Rolex 10 times the price? Branding, feel, materials, etc. What about the fascination for 4x4's now? Do we really need the additional traction that they provide? Or is it because we 'might' need it at some point? Do you really need the best driving EV on the market? Probably not, so why not get the cheaper and more mass market model?

Its a personal choice, if you can afford it, but more likely a budget constraint for most. Personally, if I could afford a Taycan and it worked for me, I would get one. But at the moment it doesnt work for me and I cant afford it, so its not on the cards.... ;-)

Oh, and just for reference, my local Tesla & Porsche dealers are on the same road so there is no difference in convenience. However, the Porsche dealer is excellent and I have had only excellent service and support from them. Never bought a Tesla, but the experience with the Porsche dealer is excellent and it made the whole experience something special. Somewhat different to buying something online and turning up to a car park to pick it up.... for some people, this makes a difference too, just be prepared to spend money for it.

And dont get me started on optional extras.... Porsche has an excellent ability to part buyers from their money.

[SWoll]

Well, I've just done a quick configure on both cars and with upgraded wheels, paint and interior as I'd spec on the Tesla it's a £92k car.

A Taycan 4S CT with all of the options I'd want is £99k.

The Tesla is a bit quicker and goes a bit further but no question where my money would be going. I see no reason to pay the additional £30k+ Tesla ask for the S over our 3, the Taycan looks to be worth every penny.

off_again said:

I agree, across a broad spectrum of motoring press, the Taycan is widely praised - except for one thing, the price.

It's cheaper than a comparable Panamera. Not sure what the issue is with the price personally.

Edited by SWoll on Wednesday 19th May 20:13

[stuthemong]

Took a 4S for two hours this week (thanks porsche cambridge), very impressive car.

Very impressive.

Brakes were just awesome.

<shakes piggy bank >...