BMW M140i vs Golf R. Which is best for Britain and tuning?

BMW M140i vs Golf R. Which is best for Britain and tuning?

Author
Discussion

Greg the Fish

1,410 posts

43 months

Thursday 21st January 2021
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Dylanaledhall said:
Greg the Fish said:
If you want one to devastate your wallet before you even start 'tuning' it. Get the BM

If you want your house burgled and a knife held to your throat for a set of car keys. Get the Golf.

Hope that helps.

Get a Dodge Charger and play with that. Will be more fun.
Golf Rs are stolen regularly aren't they? frown
Exactly.

J4CKO

36,435 posts

177 months

Thursday 21st January 2021
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Dylanaledhall said:
J4CKO said:
You need to drive one, you seem to be getting ahead of yourself talking about tuning an M140 them to 450 or more bhp but would drive one before you get too carried away with it.

Try not to fixate too much on power numbers, I have done that in the past and you can end up getting the wrong car. A 500 bhp One series is cool but I realised after a remap it was quick enough at 360 ish, it piles on speed as fast as I would ever want really, had a go in a 450 bhp M140i and it just seemed to spin even more and I decided not to bother doing any more to mine.

As I have said in the other thread, have lent my M135i to my son and he likes it, but he doesn't want one having spent some time with it, he took a mate out who fancies one who said he couldn't be arsed with the squirming about when its cold and damp having been in it.

I would say get a manual one, or at least try the auto as I find it frustrating when trying to drive it spiritedly, I had plans for it but decided it was not a keeper, maybe if it had been manual but not with the auto, you may love it but if you like the ST I think you may find it a bit meh once you get past the sheer shove. I did think of doing the suspension and fitting an LSD but will just buy something else.

I would suggest a Golf R over the BMW to be honest, but would also suggest a Civic Type R, Hyundai I30N, Cayman or leave it a bit longer and get and M2, just dont think if you love a modded ST that you will take to an M140i easily, might be wrong but do get a decent go in one.
Hey J4CKO, didn't expect to see you here, surely you're fed up of me by now? biggrin

Yeah I completely get where you're coming from, and to be honest I'm not really that bothered about the numbers cause the both cars will act completely different to each other. I just like a bit of a project and seeing where I could get an M140i to would be something to keep me busy smile

Again, I do need to try both, I definitely could prefer the Golf R but having seen so many people go from Golf to M140 ( or M135) there must be a reason.
As for other contenders I think I'll be looking at cars that aren't FWD as I've had FWD all my life and just want something different. I do like the M2, it's just the fact it doesn't have the B58 and is so much more expensive does kind of put me off. I know it's a proper M car but like I said in an earlier reply I'm not going to be hooning all day so most of the time It would make no difference whether I was in an M140 or an M2, definitely wouldn't be against having a go of an M2 though, plus they look the business smile
Dont worry too much about BHP/Pound or Bang for Buck, the cars that are generally regarded as great drivers cars are not always the most powerful for the budget, depends what you are after.

I dont want to do it down too much, they do have their good points but I have done it before where I have decided a car is definitely for me, nearly bought a Clio 182 until I drove it and was a bit nonplussed, bought the M135i as was wooed by the straight line performance but have never really gelled with it, dont hate it, like it but dont love it, and more power isnt what it lacks.

The M Cars fix the shortcomings to a point, even though the standard M2 isnt actually any quicker in a straight line as an M140i, sometimes they get beat, especially if the M140i has a remap, but neither are slow, but the M2 is the one that gets a better rating as a drivers car, not driven one though but based on all the info thats what I have gleaned. There is a reason they were more expensive.

Power is cheap and plentiful these days, the fact its relatively cos effective to tune a Fiesta to 350 bhp or more attests to that, if someone had said to me that a Fiestas would have that much power back when the XR2 was about (90 bhp) I would have thought they were mental. It seems almost commonplace but that knocking on Supercar territory from then, not far off a Lotus Carlton and half a ton lighter.


Dylanaledhall

Original Poster:

359 posts

42 months

Thursday 21st January 2021
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J4CKO said:
The M Cars fix the shortcomings to a point, even though the standard M2 isnt actually any quicker in a straight line as an M140i, sometimes they get beat, especially if the M140i has a remap, but neither are slow, but the M2 is the one that gets a better rating as a drivers car, not driven one though but based on all the info thats what I have gleaned. There is a reason they were more expensive.

Power is cheap and plentiful these days, the fact its relatively cos effective to tune a Fiesta to 350 bhp or more attests to that, if someone had said to me that a Fiestas would have that much power back when the XR2 was about (90 bhp) I would have thought they were mental. It seems almost commonplace but that knocking on Supercar territory from then, not far off a Lotus Carlton and half a ton lighter.
Yeah I know the M140i won't feel the same as an M2 but I do think the M140i offers really good value as you say, it can keep up with an M2 and sometimes beats them ( obviously depending on modifications).

Yeah I can't wait for my Fiesta to be done. Just got the new splitter fitted today and while I was there my tuner was looking at pricing up some new brakes for me ( just until I upgrade to a Big Brake Kit). But I think 340bhp will be more than enough in a little Fiesta, especially for everyday use.

Driver101

11,629 posts

98 months

Friday 22nd January 2021
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Dylanaledhall said:
Again, I do need to try both, I definitely could prefer the Golf R but having seen so many people go from Golf to M140 ( or M135) there must be a reason.
The Golf was the cheapest hot hatch to PCP or lease, then the M140i was the cheapest.

JD

2,344 posts

205 months

Friday 22nd January 2021
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I went from a 2017 S3 (310hp 7 speed one) into a current M140i.

I preferred the Audi.

The 140i is a great engine but everything else about it isn’t that good. Mine has standard suspension not adaptive and it rides poorly and I find the driving experience on a cold wet day frustrating at best.


Ozone

2,988 posts

164 months

Friday 22nd January 2021
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I went from an M135i to a Golf R, for me;

The Golf is a practical, competent, fast car - a car for your head.
The M135i is a fun, nice sounding, fast, drivers car - a car for your heart.

I did have some bd scrotes try to take the 135 from me in a car park one night.

They are both good, it just comes down to your preference.

Dylanaledhall

Original Poster:

359 posts

42 months

Friday 22nd January 2021
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Driver101 said:
The Golf was the cheapest hot hatch to PCP or lease, then the M140i was the cheapest.
Oh yeah that's true, I remember people mentioning that. Thanks smile

Dylanaledhall

Original Poster:

359 posts

42 months

Friday 22nd January 2021
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JD said:
I went from a 2017 S3 (310hp 7 speed one) into a current M140i.

I preferred the Audi.

The 140i is a great engine but everything else about it isn’t that good. Mine has standard suspension not adaptive and it rides poorly and I find the driving experience on a cold wet day frustrating at best.
Did you just prefer the ability to put the power down no matter what? Also, did you think the Audi was a better daily ? Thanks smile

Dylanaledhall

Original Poster:

359 posts

42 months

Friday 22nd January 2021
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Ozone said:
I went from an M135i to a Golf R, for me;

The Golf is a practical, competent, fast car - a car for your head.
The M135i is a fun, nice sounding, fast, drivers car - a car for your heart.

I did have some bd scrotes try to take the 135 from me in a car park one night.

They are both good, it just comes down to your preference.
My personal preference would definitely be the M140, however, the looks of the Golf and the all weather ability is very appealing to me.

Mirinjawbro

251 posts

41 months

Friday 22nd January 2021
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i had an MK3 TTS MRC stage 2 , now a M240i stage 2


TTS - i really really miss the 4wd. even with 400 ish hp and a rainy day i could stamp the floor and get 0 spin. this was on PS4S. the ride was far better.


M240i - the sound is 10 x better. both had downpipes but the BMW is so so much louder and better sounding, the ride is terrible. very very bouncy and you seem to sway left and right. putting power down is terrible. it annoys me so much ive already decided my next car has to have 4wd

id love to add LSD and b12 kit. but where does the spending stop.

nickfrog

16,782 posts

194 months

Friday 22nd January 2021
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Greg the Fish said:
If you want one to devastate your wallet before you even start 'tuning' it. Get the BM
Greg I appreciate you suffer from an irrational and obsessive hatred for anything BMW but what direct experience of running a M140i do you have? I ran a M135i and it proved cheap as chips in terms of depreciation and running costs.

MK1RS Bruce

579 posts

115 months

Friday 22nd January 2021
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Dylanaledhall said:
J4CKO said:
The M Cars fix the shortcomings to a point, even though the standard M2 isnt actually any quicker in a straight line as an M140i, sometimes they get beat, especially if the M140i has a remap, but neither are slow, but the M2 is the one that gets a better rating as a drivers car, not driven one though but based on all the info thats what I have gleaned. There is a reason they were more expensive.

Power is cheap and plentiful these days, the fact its relatively cos effective to tune a Fiesta to 350 bhp or more attests to that, if someone had said to me that a Fiestas would have that much power back when the XR2 was about (90 bhp) I would have thought they were mental. It seems almost commonplace but that knocking on Supercar territory from then, not far off a Lotus Carlton and half a ton lighter.
Yeah I know the M140i won't feel the same as an M2 but I do think the M140i offers really good value as you say, it can keep up with an M2 and sometimes beats them ( obviously depending on modifications).

Yeah I can't wait for my Fiesta to be done. Just got the new splitter fitted today and while I was there my tuner was looking at pricing up some new brakes for me ( just until I upgrade to a Big Brake Kit). But I think 340bhp will be more than enough in a little Fiesta, especially for everyday use.
M140i might keep up with an M2 in a straight line now and again if its mapped but show it a set of corners and it won't see which way the M2 went, totally different animal and so much more focused. M2 is like a go kart, M140i is like a fast sofa

Bennet

1,770 posts

108 months

Friday 22nd January 2021
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If I lived in South Wales (rather than the suburbs of Manchester), there is no way I would be wasting my driving life with modern hot hatches. I would go older and buy something with feel so you can maximise your enjoyment of the actual driving. Since you obviously have money and you enjoy modification and you want 4wd, Subarus or Mitsubishi EVOs come to mind.

Every idiot with money drives a fast German whatever. And it seems to me like every review of every modern fast car (short of something like a Lotus) complains that it lacks engagement.

You mentioned driving skill earlier, but I doubt that either of the cars you are choosing between takes much skill to drive quickly at all provided that you keep it below the level of utter, utter tool.

Sorry for the thread hijack. Just my opinion.

Disclaimer: I haven't driven either of them.
Disclaimer to the disclaimer: I'm probably still right though.

Dylanaledhall

Original Poster:

359 posts

42 months

Friday 22nd January 2021
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Bennet said:
If I lived in South Wales (rather than the suburbs of Manchester), there is no way I would be wasting my driving life with modern hot hatches. I would go older and buy something with feel so you can maximise your enjoyment of the actual driving. Since you obviously have money and you enjoy modification and you want 4wd, Subarus or Mitsubishi EVOs come to mind.

Every idiot with money drives a fast German whatever. And it seems to me like every review of every modern fast car (short of something like a Lotus) complains that it lacks engagement.

You mentioned driving skill earlier, but I doubt that either of the cars you are choosing between takes much skill to drive quickly at all provided that you keep it below the level of utter, utter tool.

Sorry for the thread hijack. Just my opinion.

Disclaimer: I haven't driven either of them.
Disclaimer to the disclaimer: I'm probably still right though.
Thing is, I am a bit of a moron biggrinbiggrin

But no please don't apologise for the 'hijack' I started this thread to get opinions so the more the merrier to be honest.

I would love an Evo I just think they're at that age ( especially evo 8 and evo 9) of needing so much attention to things like the undercarriage and other things that can go wrong with an older car. Above that, I need something I can daily easily and I just think an Evo would cost so much to run it would be painful. I know people have managed 40mpg in an M140i, you'd be lucky to see even half of that in an Evo. I think they are proper driver's cars, it's just I think that they will cost more to maintain than it's worth ( just my opinion of course) smile .

anonymous-user

31 months

Friday 22nd January 2021
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I couldn't get on with a friends M140i. Lovely engine but terribly set up as a performance car, feels more like a 120d with a big engine.

I'm sure a vast ream of modifications would change that but I haven't driven one with those attributes.

However I find the Golf R a bit dull even though I love AWD cars amd certainly with the farty autobox.

If you have another car as a daily I would 2nd getting an Evo or Impreza if you want proper driving dynamics but these are not particularly suited to being a daily. Saying that a 2016 or so a WRX STI can be had for similar money to the cars you are considering and although softer than the old ones is still a better driving car than the BMW or Golf and has all the modern creature comforts amd daily driveability.

Toltec

6,943 posts

200 months

Friday 22nd January 2021
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I'm not suggesting you buy one, however you should try driving a Cayman, GT86, mx-5 or lotus. Just to get an idea what a rwd car can feel like. Similarly Subaru, Evo and GR Yaris for 4wd.

I know they are not what you want power/tuning/value wise, but they will give you an idea how they can compare to fwd and a yardstick for trying a 140i and Golf.

Dylanaledhall

Original Poster:

359 posts

42 months

Friday 22nd January 2021
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Toltec said:
I'm not suggesting you buy one, however you should try driving a Cayman, GT86, mx-5 or lotus. Just to get an idea what a rwd car can feel like. Similarly Subaru, Evo and GR Yaris for 4wd.

I know they are not what you want power/tuning/value wise, but they will give you an idea how they can compare to fwd and a yardstick for trying a 140i and Golf.
Good plan. My Grandfather used to have a Lotus Elise I just never got to drive it unfortunately frown
As for trying AWD / 4WD my father has a Mk3 Focus RS so I can go drive that whenever too smile

thelostboy

4,134 posts

202 months

Friday 22nd January 2021
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I would agree the M140i is about the engine. It does not feel like an M car in any other respect. Perfectly nice, and I feel a more upmarket place to sit than a Golf R, but otherwise it was just another 1 Series.

Certainly it is rapid too. A friend had one when I had an RS6 Performance and we had to do silly speeds to notice a difference.

One of my dailies is now a MK7.5 Golf R and I think it is great; lots of low down shove and the ride and handling balance is well judged (although mine has ACC, not sure what the regular setup is like). It's great to have the security of 4WD given how miserable our weather is, and point to point it is undoubtedly the faster car.

I also don't understand the comments about it being dull either. In the recent weather I found the chassis is adjustable - it will rotate and you can feel the 4WD working. I had a MK6 Golf R years ago and, in comparison, that simply felt like a FWD which didn't run out of grip.

J4CKO

36,435 posts

177 months

Friday 22nd January 2021
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I had a MK1 TT for a bit and the 4WD was quite compelling, launching it on packed snow was fun,I know its not proper whatever and TT not drivers car but I quite liked it, just broke a bit too much as was old and neglected, think it had either 12 or 15 owners biggrin

I think a lot buy an M140 for say 20 ish grand, then the spending starts to address all the shortcomings and add more power, couple of grand on tuning, couple of grand on suspension, couple of grand on an LSD, bit on cosmetic mods and its easy to lavish say 5 to 10 grand no problem, hmm, what can you buy for 25 to 30 grand.....


https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202010195...

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202009113...


Can add all the power you want in isolation but you end up with the car equivalent of Bradley Wiggins riding a Raleigh Chopper (A bicycle from olden times that wasn't very good at being a bicycle) even at standard power they struggle a bit.

Not saying its pointless tuning them as some prefer the hatch, like the tuning aspect or dont have the cash for a M4 etc in one go but it probably works out cheaper in the long run and you get a more rounded package.

culpz

4,638 posts

89 months

Friday 22nd January 2021
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Usual RWD vs AWD benefits. Golf for it's all-weather ability, BMW for it's playful rear. Both are nice places to sit and great daily-drivers. They're also both easily tuneable. I'd probably go with the M140i, as the B58 engine and the ZF8 gearbox are fantastic and it's going to become a rare layout. I'd also say that it'll probably be a bit more fun and engaging. That being said, the EA888 with the DSG is a very good combo too.

However, neither will be anywhere near as fun as the Fiesta, IMO.