BMW M140i vs Golf R. Which is best for Britain and tuning?

[M.F.D]

liner33 said:

Tyre choice and technique is more critical for the 140 for sure , the golf requires little finesse

The fact that dragy is littered with sub 3 second 0_60 times for the 140 means it can get down the road well with the right driver

Unlikely to be UK cars with no LSD on standard suspension.

I'm sure elsewhere in the world they got an XDrive version.

[HM-2]

M.F.D said:

I'm sure elsewhere in the world they got an XDrive version.

They did. IIRC they were pretty much bang on 4 seconds to 60 out of the box (4.1 quoted). A simple remap is enough to get them in the high 3s.

[liner33]

M.F.D said:

Unlikely to be UK cars with no LSD on standard suspension.

I'm sure elsewhere in the world they got an XDrive version.

lol I suspect if you are going to map one to give the 700hp needed to get these kind of times you would have already fitted a lsd and decent suspension

But no plenty of rwd uk cars have done sub 3 second 0-60s

[Dylanaledhall]

M.F.D said:

Sorry you have me confused now. You said you're ST was stage whatever it is and estimated around 300-340bhp? The Golf R you drove was around 360bhp? Where is the 120bhp gap coming from?

Depends what you want, again sounds like you want a straight line rocket, in which case get the Golf. The m140i is severly traction limited once modified, made worse by the standard open diff.

The Megane is an epic car, but if you aren't bothered about driver involvement/going round corners then it will definately not be for you.

Sorry about the confusion, my ST currently is stage 2, I'm in the process of a stage 3 build. Progress has been slow as I've just bought my first home. If I didn't if would have been finished by now But that's why I was so confused as to why it didn't really pull like I expected it too. I think at 400bhp ish it would be a slightly different story it's just (to me) didn't feel as quick as my Dad's Focus RS did. I assume people are going to call me out and say I'm just a Ford fanboy or whatever but truth be told, I really did like the Golf, it just needs that extra something in my eyes.

[Dylanaledhall]

Glenn63 said:

That’s the problem with 4wd I find, just mash the pedal and zero drama for fuss it just goes but takes away some of the excitement. Add in that it’s probably more insulated etc than the fiesta it just adds to the masking of power/speed/excitement.
At least with RWD you will have to manage the pedal a bit more, rear may step out requiring steering corrections etc makes it feel more of a handful and exciting imo.

I think you've hit the nail on the head there. Hopefully by Saturday I'll find out which I prefer. I think a bit of drama would have helped the Golfs' case but obviously it can't help it, it's AWD and does a damn good job of doing what it's supposed to do.

[Glenn63]

If you get a proper drive in it use ‘sport +’ as in ‘comfort’ I find the traction control very sensitive, as if even the slight thought of possible wheel spin it cuts power. Sport + allows a nice bit of slip but won’t send you full sideways!

[Dylanaledhall]

Glenn63 said:

If you get a proper drive in it use ‘sport +’ as in ‘comfort’ I find the traction control very sensitive, as if even the slight thought of possible wheel spin it cuts power. Sport + allows a nice bit of slip but won’t send you full sideways!

Yeah I think that's how a guy called Joe Achilles used to drive his, albeit M135i. He said it would give you a nice controllable slide so if you're a half-decent driver you could kick the arse out if you want to. So if it did ever step out you could reel it back in as long as you know what you're doing

[Dylanaledhall]

So everyone I finally got that drive in the M140 and all I can say is wow. What a difference over the Golf!

Turned up, the dealer was very friendly, and let me go out for a test drive by myself. Not many people would trust a slightly dodgy-looking 21 year old with their 3 litre RWD 25 grand car.

I'll be honest I didn't put the car nor gearbox into any setting other than normal just to see how the car would be normally. As soon as I got some space I put my foot down and even in normal mode the gearbox and engine response was amazing, would have been even better in sport but wasn't my car and I was being trusted by the dealer so didn't want to take the piss

I didn't get a chance to throw it around any bends so couldn't really comment on the "m lite handling characteristics". However, even going around roundabouts you could definitely feel the weight of the car but I fully expected this. The steering was nowhere near as sharp as my fiesta's but again, I expected this. Brakes took a bit of getting used to just because the brakes didn't have much initial bite but the further you pressed down the more progressive they became.

Overall, very impressed with the car. I must say, felt so much faster than the Golf but again, masked it's speed very well. I have a little video from onboard but isn't very good and doesn't do the car any justice So finally, after this 22 or-so thread I think we've found my next car

[QuattroDave]

Dylanaledhall said:

So everyone I finally got that drive in the M140 and all I can say is wow. What a difference over the Golf!

Turned up, the dealer was very friendly, and let me go out for a test drive by myself. Not many people would trust a slightly dodgy-looking 21 year old with their 3 litre RWD 25 grand car.

I'll be honest I didn't put the car nor gearbox into any setting other than normal just to see how the car would be normally. As soon as I got some space I put my foot down and even in normal mode the gearbox and engine response was amazing, would have been even better in sport but wasn't my car and I was being trusted by the dealer so didn't want to take the piss

I didn't get a chance to throw it around any bends so couldn't really comment on the "m lite handling characteristics". However, even going around roundabouts you could definitely feel the weight of the car but I fully expected this. The steering was nowhere near as sharp as my fiesta's but again, I expected this. Brakes took a bit of getting used to just because the brakes didn't have much initial bite but the further you pressed down the more progressive they became.

Overall, very impressed with the car. I must say, felt so much faster than the Golf but again, masked it's speed very well. I have a little video from onboard but isn't very good and doesn't do the car any justice So finally, after this 22 or-so thread I think we've found my next car

Called it!

As an ex M140i owner from new all I can say is they're a fantastic car, proper tame but with a very fast and fun streak. You haven't made a bad choice.

I moved on to a mustang and prefer it in almost every single way but in a way I wish i'd kept the M140i too for my wife so I could take it out every now and then!

Post pics!

[resolve10]

Post photos!

[Dylanaledhall]

So I'm not going to excite everyone, the one I drove isn't going to be the one I buy, simply because it isn't my ideal spec, ideally I'd be after a 3 door. However, here's some pictures ( and a very very short video that my girlfriend took) of the one I drove yesterday:

Edited by Dylanaledhall on Sunday 15th May 18:13

[Dylanaledhall]

QuattroDave said:

Called it!

As an ex M140i owner from new all I can say is they're a fantastic car, proper tame but with a very fast and fun streak. You haven't made a bad choice.

I moved on to a mustang and prefer it in almost every single way but in a way I wish i'd kept the M140i too for my wife so I could take it out every now and then!

Post pics!

I really do like Mustangs, although my boss has a 5.0 GT and he's been back to the dealer 25 times with things that keep going wrong with it. Not saying all Mustangs are like it because I haven't really heard of anyone else having as many issues as he's had Hope you're enjoying it

[Dylanaledhall]

It is interesting however, that the M4 and 140i are so close in terms of price at these millages. Makes me think why would someone spend 26k on an M140 when for 2k more you could get an M4.





Don't get me wrong, I'm no expert, if anything I'd love for someone to guide me, but if you had a 26-28k budget and you were choosing between the M4 and the 140, surely you'd go for the M4?
Me personally I wouldn't be spending 26k on an m140, my budget would be around the 20k mark and you won't find an M4 for that price I can assure you

[Glenn63]

Those M4’s are 4/5 years older though. You can say who would buy an m140 when you could get a v10 m5 for £15k.

[Dylanaledhall]

Glenn63 said:

Those M4’s are 4/5 years older though. You can say who would buy an m140 when you could get a v10 m5 for 15k.

Very good point however, I do hear the M5s of that era are plagued with reliability issues regarding gearboxes and sometimes engine issues. Along with that, they are apparently massively expensive to maintain (obviously, it's a 5 litre v10) but for example disks and pads are around £2000 for that car, which I guess is why they are around the 15k mark, along with your original point - the age of the car (18 years since they first come out).

I think for the money though you can't go wrong with an M4 in today's market

[QuattroDave]

Dylanaledhall said:

Glenn63 said:

Those M4’s are 4/5 years older though. You can say who would buy an m140 when you could get a v10 m5 for 15k.

Very good point however, I do hear the M5s of that era are plagued with reliability issues regarding gearboxes and sometimes engine issues. Along with that, they are apparently massively expensive to maintain (obviously, it's a 5 litre v10) but for example disks and pads are around 2000 for that car, which I guess is why they are around the 15k mark, along with your original point - the age of the car (18 years since they first come out).

I think for the money though you can't go wrong with an M4 in today's market

FWIW when I had my M140 and was looking to get a slightly more 'special' feeling car I test drove both an M2 and an M4. Both felt more of an occasion to drive than my M140 but the experience wasn't enough of an upgrade to warrant the extra cost. Using 2016 as a reference for both models suggests an M4 is about 50% more (£7k) than an M140i which IMHO isn't worth the premium.

[Dylanaledhall]

QuattroDave said:

FWIW when I had my M140 and was looking to get a slightly more 'special' feeling car I test drove both an M2 and an M4. Both felt more of an occasion to drive than my M140 but the experience wasn't enough of an upgrade to warrant the extra cost. Using 2016 as a reference for both models suggests an M4 is about 50% more ( 7k) than an M140i which IMHO isn't worth the premium.

Hmmm interesting, out of the two which did you prefer, the M2 or M4? I'd love to know

I think with how the used car market is at the moment, some m140s are being sold at a premium. One car that has appreciated massively since the pandemic is the EP3. I remember a time where if you had £1500-£2000 to spend on a track car or a cheap fun car you could get an EP3 Type R or a Clio 182. Even rotten ones are now selling for 3k. I saw one EP3 a few days ago up for 12k. Madness.

[jdoubleu]

Dylanaledhall said:

Hmmm interesting, out of the two which did you prefer, the M2 or M4? I'd love to know

I think with how the used car market is at the moment, some m140s are being sold at a premium. One car that has appreciated massively since the pandemic is the EP3. I remember a time where if you had 1500- 2000 to spend on a track car or a cheap fun car you could get an EP3 Type R or a Clio 182. Even rotten ones are now selling for 3k. I saw one EP3 a few days ago up for 12k. Madness.

I think the M140i is at a double premium at the moment - one is that generally used prices are crazy high, and the other is that there will never again be a small hatchback with a 6 cylinder engine.

[QuattroDave]

Dylanaledhall said:

QuattroDave said:

FWIW when I had my M140 and was looking to get a slightly more 'special' feeling car I test drove both an M2 and an M4. Both felt more of an occasion to drive than my M140 but the experience wasn't enough of an upgrade to warrant the extra cost. Using 2016 as a reference for both models suggests an M4 is about 50% more ( 7k) than an M140i which IMHO isn't worth the premium.

Hmmm interesting, out of the two which did you prefer, the M2 or M4? I'd love to know

I think with how the used car market is at the moment, some m140s are being sold at a premium. One car that has appreciated massively since the pandemic is the EP3. I remember a time where if you had 1500- 2000 to spend on a track car or a cheap fun car you could get an EP3 Type R or a Clio 182. Even rotten ones are now selling for 3k. I saw one EP3 a few days ago up for 12k. Madness.

it was the M2 that felt more special. being that bit smaller it was more fun to drive and had more sense of occasion about it. But both M2 & M4's that I tried were S55 (based on N55) whilst the M140i uses the B58, worth considering as they are different in their character.

[Dylanaledhall]

jdoubleu said:

I think the M140i is at a double premium at the moment - one is that generally used prices are crazy high, and the other is that there will never again be a small hatchback with a 6 cylinder engine.

Very true, it is an unlikely combination to ever be repeated again