Jaguar F-Pace Non Runner
Discussion
It seems that liners sliding down is not uncommon with these fragile engines.
https://dieselheads.co.uk/our-engines/jaguar/jagua...
https://dieselheads.co.uk/our-engines/jaguar/jagua...
Escy said:
Mikebentley said:
Would a new lump not be the best way of salvaging something from this?
You and the wife both really like the car and as you say everything else work. New engine and keep forever would be my plan. Good luck with whatever you do.
This is what I'm leaning towards. Suck it up and spend the money.You and the wife both really like the car and as you say everything else work. New engine and keep forever would be my plan. Good luck with whatever you do.
Gtom said:
The cheapest 2016 F pace R-sport on eBay at the minute is £13k, surely it’s got to be worth chucking an engine in it even if just to punt it on?
I might have been undervaluing it, based on seeing a few cheap ones come up for sale, I hadn't read the adverts so maybe they had issues. When looking around my car is a better spec than most I see (pan roof, heated rear seats, larger sat nav screen, digital dash). Plus it's got fairly new tyres, new battery, wheel alignment done recently, all the potential DPF trouble taken care of, recent gearbox service. Unfortunately it's the JLR curse, people like the cars...but they're an unreliable money pit lottery with some being 100% reliable and others being 0%.
My personal take is either swap engines and keep it or sell it broken as it is.
Breaking it may make slightly more but it's going to be a massive amount more grief and you're better off getting shot in one lump.
Equally replacing the engine *then* selling it IMO is going to be a whole load more grief, either you punt it off without declaring it's not road legal at auction and likely take a hit or declare everything and it'll be a lottery if someone wants it!
Fastdruid said:
Escy said:
Mikebentley said:
Would a new lump not be the best way of salvaging something from this?
You and the wife both really like the car and as you say everything else work. New engine and keep forever would be my plan. Good luck with whatever you do.
This is what I'm leaning towards. Suck it up and spend the money.You and the wife both really like the car and as you say everything else work. New engine and keep forever would be my plan. Good luck with whatever you do.
Gtom said:
The cheapest 2016 F pace R-sport on eBay at the minute is £13k, surely it’s got to be worth chucking an engine in it even if just to punt it on?
I might have been undervaluing it, based on seeing a few cheap ones come up for sale, I hadn't read the adverts so maybe they had issues. When looking around my car is a better spec than most I see (pan roof, heated rear seats, larger sat nav screen, digital dash). Plus it's got fairly new tyres, new battery, wheel alignment done recently, all the potential DPF trouble taken care of, recent gearbox service. Unfortunately it's the JLR curse, people like the cars...but they're an unreliable money pit lottery with some being 100% reliable and others being 0%.
My personal take is either swap engines and keep it or sell it broken as it is.
Breaking it may make slightly more but it's going to be a massive amount more grief and you're better off getting shot in one lump.
Equally replacing the engine *then* selling it IMO is going to be a whole load more grief, either you punt it off without declaring it's not road legal at auction and likely take a hit or declare everything and it'll be a lottery if someone wants it!
Come on.
So my car with led headlight bulbs retrofitted is illegal to sell too?
How many cars over the years have had a decat fitted and sold on, it’s the same thing.
You must be fun to have a pint with.
Ecsy I'm really sorry to see this 
Jeeez this car has put you through the wringer..... and I admire your impressively upbeat attitude to get it right.
With this latest failure I can't help thinking it's time to take a step back and re-assess.
We need to remember that this isn't the first time it's lunched an engine. Is this the 2nd or 3rd failure? Did you ever establish why it blew it's first engine before you acquired it? What was the original failure?
I am concerned that you're going to fit yet another new engine and find yourself with another failure at some point in the future IF there is an issue that you haven't yet identified that is leading to these failures. These modern engines are complex instruments with very precisely controlled fuelling and emissions - it's quite possible there is a bug or failure somewhere within the software or ECU that is leading to it creating a condition that the mechanical parts simply cannot survive. It could be something weird like a DPF regen attempt that goes bad and over-fuel's the engine..... It's just such an unknown. I hate to be the voice of doom, but I could see a situation where you put several thousand into known good mechanicals only to ruin them further down the line owing to the control systems you're fitting. I just don't think I could trust the car to run happily with a new engine.
Reading between the lines, I fear your desire to own a car that is essentially punching above your normal weight and the fact that you and Mrs Ecsy like it is allowing you to rose-tint your decision making process. Hence why I think it's time to take a big step back and look at the whole story again. In harsh terms, this car was a dud when you bought it - the trade knew it, which is why they wouldn't touch it. You've worked miracles getting it to where you did and we all admire that, but the car is still proving to be a dud.... Given enough money and time it's possible you might eventually be able to make a viable car out of it (and hey, if anyone can, you can!), but how much money, time and pain are you going to have to endure before you get there? IF you ever get there? Are you really going to be able to trust this car again?
There is an old saying in situations like this - 'your first loss is your best loss'..... I appreciate you're well beyond this point, but it bears repeating again. As much as we all want the thread to continue, you really need to take a long hard look at this, put all the emotion to one side and just make a decision based on the facts. The facts aren't encouraging.
Jeeez this car has put you through the wringer..... and I admire your impressively upbeat attitude to get it right.With this latest failure I can't help thinking it's time to take a step back and re-assess.
We need to remember that this isn't the first time it's lunched an engine. Is this the 2nd or 3rd failure? Did you ever establish why it blew it's first engine before you acquired it? What was the original failure?
I am concerned that you're going to fit yet another new engine and find yourself with another failure at some point in the future IF there is an issue that you haven't yet identified that is leading to these failures. These modern engines are complex instruments with very precisely controlled fuelling and emissions - it's quite possible there is a bug or failure somewhere within the software or ECU that is leading to it creating a condition that the mechanical parts simply cannot survive. It could be something weird like a DPF regen attempt that goes bad and over-fuel's the engine..... It's just such an unknown. I hate to be the voice of doom, but I could see a situation where you put several thousand into known good mechanicals only to ruin them further down the line owing to the control systems you're fitting. I just don't think I could trust the car to run happily with a new engine.
Reading between the lines, I fear your desire to own a car that is essentially punching above your normal weight and the fact that you and Mrs Ecsy like it is allowing you to rose-tint your decision making process. Hence why I think it's time to take a big step back and look at the whole story again. In harsh terms, this car was a dud when you bought it - the trade knew it, which is why they wouldn't touch it. You've worked miracles getting it to where you did and we all admire that, but the car is still proving to be a dud.... Given enough money and time it's possible you might eventually be able to make a viable car out of it (and hey, if anyone can, you can!), but how much money, time and pain are you going to have to endure before you get there? IF you ever get there? Are you really going to be able to trust this car again?
There is an old saying in situations like this - 'your first loss is your best loss'..... I appreciate you're well beyond this point, but it bears repeating again. As much as we all want the thread to continue, you really need to take a long hard look at this, put all the emotion to one side and just make a decision based on the facts. The facts aren't encouraging.
The original engine had a blown turbo which ended up causing further damage to the bores and pistons. The second failure looks like it was down to the previous owner partially blocking an oilway with silicone. Those 2 aren't related and this failure looks like it might be down to out of JLR spec repairs made to the block, or possibly the faulty fuel injector theory posted above. It's also 10k miles later on.
The DPF has been removed so there are no longer any possible re-gen issues which I think lead to the original turbo failure. The re-gen stuff is now coded out with the re-map.
The car wasn't a dud but the engine was. I should have just bought a used replacement the last time around rather than attempt a repair.
If I can find a nice low mileage engine and I replace the chains on it first I'd be confident in it. The original engine did 110k before the turbo blew.
I haven't made any decisions either way yet.
The DPF has been removed so there are no longer any possible re-gen issues which I think lead to the original turbo failure. The re-gen stuff is now coded out with the re-map.
The car wasn't a dud but the engine was. I should have just bought a used replacement the last time around rather than attempt a repair.
If I can find a nice low mileage engine and I replace the chains on it first I'd be confident in it. The original engine did 110k before the turbo blew.
I haven't made any decisions either way yet.
I would find a replacement engine.
Go through it for new chains etc, all the silly issues they have.
you can do that in your sleep by now given the practice you’ve had.
That engine has been bodged by the previous owner and you’ve been chasing their screw ups since. I doubt even QP online would repair that engine given the damage.
You’ve binned the dpf which is a smart move.
If the rest of the car is fine, go for the engine replacement and see it through.
Go through it for new chains etc, all the silly issues they have.
you can do that in your sleep by now given the practice you’ve had.
That engine has been bodged by the previous owner and you’ve been chasing their screw ups since. I doubt even QP online would repair that engine given the damage.
You’ve binned the dpf which is a smart move.
If the rest of the car is fine, go for the engine replacement and see it through.
NomduJour said:
I-am-the-reverend said:
What an absolute pile of s
t.
British engineering at its best.
If JLR designed a pushbike it would have square wheels
That appears to be a failure of an aftermarket liner/sleeve.t.British engineering at its best.
If JLR designed a pushbike it would have square wheelsA.J.M said:
I would find a replacement engine.
Go through it for new chains etc, all the silly issues they have.
you can do that in your sleep by now given the practice you’ve had.
That engine has been bodged by the previous owner and you’ve been chasing their screw ups since. I doubt even QP online would repair that engine given the damage.
You’ve binned the dpf which is a smart move.
If the rest of the car is fine, go for the engine replacement and see it through.
No.Go through it for new chains etc, all the silly issues they have.
you can do that in your sleep by now given the practice you’ve had.
That engine has been bodged by the previous owner and you’ve been chasing their screw ups since. I doubt even QP online would repair that engine given the damage.
You’ve binned the dpf which is a smart move.
If the rest of the car is fine, go for the engine replacement and see it through.
No no no no no.
These engines are bad news. There's no such thing as 'a good one'.
Regarding DPF removal - A customer had a 2013 Insignia with non stop DPF dramas. It was removed and gutted, the ECU doctored. And one day the ECU went mental and instructed the injectors to dump as much fuel as they could into the bores.
After the engine had comprehensively f
ked itself, the sump was found to contain about 10 litres of a fuel/oil mix. The crank webs were probably splashing in it. Ecsy,
As much as this is all a PITA,
Really well and truly your skills are awesome - that you can take something as complicated as this apart time after time in no time at all, is fecking brilliant.
Appreciate it might not want to be what you wish to do with your time, but seriously, hats off to you!
As much as this is all a PITA,
Really well and truly your skills are awesome - that you can take something as complicated as this apart time after time in no time at all, is fecking brilliant.
Appreciate it might not want to be what you wish to do with your time, but seriously, hats off to you!
A.J.M said:
I would find a replacement engine.
Go through it for new chains etc, all the silly issues they have.
you can do that in your sleep by now given the practice you’ve had.
That engine has been bodged by the previous owner and you’ve been chasing their screw ups since. I doubt even QP online would repair that engine given the damage.
You’ve binned the dpf which is a smart move.
If the rest of the car is fine, go for the engine replacement and see it through.
This, everyone else is being a it of a drama queen about it.Go through it for new chains etc, all the silly issues they have.
you can do that in your sleep by now given the practice you’ve had.
That engine has been bodged by the previous owner and you’ve been chasing their screw ups since. I doubt even QP online would repair that engine given the damage.
You’ve binned the dpf which is a smart move.
If the rest of the car is fine, go for the engine replacement and see it through.
Really enjoyed reading this one and I’m always in awe of anyone who can get this technically involved. Before long it’ll be a dying art, so all credit to you.
Sorry you’ve been dealt another hammer blow with the engine, it really does seem to be a nightmare situation.
You’ve had many good suggestions on this forum around next steps and my 2 pence is much less comprehensive than others.
Ultimately you’ll make the right call on what to do, I’d just say take a bit of time over it. A good option may present itself (one way or the other) and you’ll know instantly what the best call is. If that’s a new engine you’ve found, go into it with an open mind that it could be 50/50……expect the worst and hope for the best.
I do understand the desire to persevere….my wife’s car is getting money chucked at it hand over fist right now. Talking engine out job for a water pump swap, whole dash out for an evaporator swap, power steering rack dead due to water damage….etc etc (it’s a Ford Explorer Sport 3.5tt for anyone curious). Every time we’ve had an issue we are keen to get shot but then it comes back, looks great, drives nice and you forgive. Unless you go in for a brand new / nearly new replacement it could be better the devil you know.
Anyway, wish you all the best. Great thread, amazing skills and admirable determination.
Sorry you’ve been dealt another hammer blow with the engine, it really does seem to be a nightmare situation.
You’ve had many good suggestions on this forum around next steps and my 2 pence is much less comprehensive than others.
Ultimately you’ll make the right call on what to do, I’d just say take a bit of time over it. A good option may present itself (one way or the other) and you’ll know instantly what the best call is. If that’s a new engine you’ve found, go into it with an open mind that it could be 50/50……expect the worst and hope for the best.
I do understand the desire to persevere….my wife’s car is getting money chucked at it hand over fist right now. Talking engine out job for a water pump swap, whole dash out for an evaporator swap, power steering rack dead due to water damage….etc etc (it’s a Ford Explorer Sport 3.5tt for anyone curious). Every time we’ve had an issue we are keen to get shot but then it comes back, looks great, drives nice and you forgive. Unless you go in for a brand new / nearly new replacement it could be better the devil you know.
Anyway, wish you all the best. Great thread, amazing skills and admirable determination.
Edited by MTK1919 on Sunday 21st April 19:08
Considering you both like the car, you’d likely end up in something older and not as “nice”, and the problems with getting shot as-is or even parting out, I’d probably give it one last roll of the dice with a replacement engine, assuming a low-enough mileage and low-enough price unit can be sought.
The first hint of an untoward noise or wrong looking puff of smoke and it would be out on its arse whilst it was still running though.
The first hint of an untoward noise or wrong looking puff of smoke and it would be out on its arse whilst it was still running though.
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