Discussion
podman said:
Slightly off topic but Ayrton sure had a random offering of pit vehicles..
BTT, great thread, love a small bike as much as anything larger, on occasion much more, look forward to seeing how yours progress’s
The C5 was developed at Lotus I believe. They certainly had something to do with it before my time because there are lots of stories of them being abused at Christmas parties back in the day BTT, great thread, love a small bike as much as anything larger, on occasion much more, look forward to seeing how yours progress’s
Pete that one I linked to isn’t/wasn’t mine, just saw it in an auction
srob said:
The C5 was developed at Lotus I believe. They certainly had something to do with it before my time because there are lots of stories of them being abused at Christmas parties back in the day
Pete that one I linked to isn’t/wasn’t mine, just saw it in an auction
Btw, one for sale currently;Pete that one I linked to isn’t/wasn’t mine, just saw it in an auction
https://www.facebook.com/share/12H69LSJMNo/?mibext...
NITO said:
srob said:
The C5 was developed at Lotus I believe. They certainly had something to do with it before my time because there are lots of stories of them being abused at Christmas parties back in the day
Pete that one I linked to isn’t/wasn’t mine, just saw it in an auction
Btw, one for sale currently;Pete that one I linked to isn’t/wasn’t mine, just saw it in an auction
https://www.facebook.com/share/12H69LSJMNo/?mibext...
Your right about Lotus being involved with the C5, I have a C5, another hobby that has grown legs, over the last year or so I managed to meet and /or speak with many of the original Sinclair team, inc a gentleman from Lotus.
Hello shirt,
I have read in the "frivolous things" thread that your newly-acquired two-wheeled housemate
can not be registered in UAE, why is this so ? Are there generally no mopeds allowed ?
If you go for "tuning parts" the possibilities are limited only by wallet size,
first thing I would add is a +4" swing arm, makes the ride more "stable" and pulls less (accidental) wheelies,
also moves the center of wheel more into center of rear mudguard radius, bad Honda factory design there.
If you keep the (undampened) front forks, check the nylon bushings, they wear and cause much play.
Original Honda parts list and parts can be found here :
https://www.cmsnl.com/honda-z50jb-monkey-gorilla-j...
I am not sure but there might be a small battery for operating the turn signals and horn.
I have read in the "frivolous things" thread that your newly-acquired two-wheeled housemate
can not be registered in UAE, why is this so ? Are there generally no mopeds allowed ?
If you go for "tuning parts" the possibilities are limited only by wallet size,
first thing I would add is a +4" swing arm, makes the ride more "stable" and pulls less (accidental) wheelies,
also moves the center of wheel more into center of rear mudguard radius, bad Honda factory design there.
If you keep the (undampened) front forks, check the nylon bushings, they wear and cause much play.
Original Honda parts list and parts can be found here :
https://www.cmsnl.com/honda-z50jb-monkey-gorilla-j...
I am not sure but there might be a small battery for operating the turn signals and horn.
Morning Benni.
Anything under 150cc can’t be registered. It’s one of the laws aimed at kids, same as why quads and dirt bikes aren’t road legal, e-bikes are highly regulated, cyclists can’t use any road with greater than 60kph speed limit, etc.
Just mentioning you ride in Dubai gets funny looks. I have a mate who’s competed at the TT who refuses to ride in the road here but I love it and it’s my preferred commuting method, just even for me a Monkey would be pushing the envelope.
My OH lives in Switzerland though and I bought it with the intention of doing it up as a birthday gift and shipping it there along with my old merc. Hence the hills. She lives in a quiet area, owns a car but prefers public transport for work, the monkey would be very handy for her to nip around on and I believe can be registered there.
She rides well (I have done 100km in Tuscany at night as her half-cut pillion on a Vespa) but I think the mods for her use will be very different from if I was building it for me! I have shown her enough bike’s previously including monkeys to know it will be well received. Or as far as you can expect when gifting to your mrs anyway…
So it needs enough power to be usable but still friendly, I have seen Takegawa 88 and 108cc kits available, which would be best? Swingarm I think I will extend it so it sits centrally in the arch as you say, but don’t think as far as 4in without moving the arch as well, we’ll see as I will need to create a small luggage rack.
I was getting tyres for my Ducati yesterday and saw some very small lipo batteries that would be easy to hide. Is adding electric starter possible? Might change after I do the engine rebuild but it took a few kicks to get it going and I can already seeing this being frustrating for her.
Otherwise I’m thinking along these lines but less bling Upgrades for genuine improvement.
https://bringatrailer.com/listing/1973-honda-z50a-...
More power (inc carb and updated clutch), splitfire exhaust. Upgrade shocks and forks. Modern controls. Thinking a darkish candy emerald green frame/tank with gold chrome…
She has a monkey related nickname so maybe something related to that on the side cover.
Thanks for the link. I looked at one of the others mentioned for genuine parts and prices were not off putting. Given what I paid vs completed value it makes sense to use genuine or high end (takegawa etc) parts.
I’m flying out for my work rotation tomorrow. I’ll be taking lots of pics for reference and buying parts whilst I’m away.
Anything under 150cc can’t be registered. It’s one of the laws aimed at kids, same as why quads and dirt bikes aren’t road legal, e-bikes are highly regulated, cyclists can’t use any road with greater than 60kph speed limit, etc.
Just mentioning you ride in Dubai gets funny looks. I have a mate who’s competed at the TT who refuses to ride in the road here but I love it and it’s my preferred commuting method, just even for me a Monkey would be pushing the envelope.
My OH lives in Switzerland though and I bought it with the intention of doing it up as a birthday gift and shipping it there along with my old merc. Hence the hills. She lives in a quiet area, owns a car but prefers public transport for work, the monkey would be very handy for her to nip around on and I believe can be registered there.
She rides well (I have done 100km in Tuscany at night as her half-cut pillion on a Vespa) but I think the mods for her use will be very different from if I was building it for me! I have shown her enough bike’s previously including monkeys to know it will be well received. Or as far as you can expect when gifting to your mrs anyway…
So it needs enough power to be usable but still friendly, I have seen Takegawa 88 and 108cc kits available, which would be best? Swingarm I think I will extend it so it sits centrally in the arch as you say, but don’t think as far as 4in without moving the arch as well, we’ll see as I will need to create a small luggage rack.
I was getting tyres for my Ducati yesterday and saw some very small lipo batteries that would be easy to hide. Is adding electric starter possible? Might change after I do the engine rebuild but it took a few kicks to get it going and I can already seeing this being frustrating for her.
Otherwise I’m thinking along these lines but less bling Upgrades for genuine improvement.
https://bringatrailer.com/listing/1973-honda-z50a-...
More power (inc carb and updated clutch), splitfire exhaust. Upgrade shocks and forks. Modern controls. Thinking a darkish candy emerald green frame/tank with gold chrome…
She has a monkey related nickname so maybe something related to that on the side cover.
Thanks for the link. I looked at one of the others mentioned for genuine parts and prices were not off putting. Given what I paid vs completed value it makes sense to use genuine or high end (takegawa etc) parts.
I’m flying out for my work rotation tomorrow. I’ll be taking lots of pics for reference and buying parts whilst I’m away.
shirt said:
It is home
Engine runs sweetly, if about as noisy as an electric toothbrush. Tyres don’t hold air so need to source some and I’m going away for the next 6 weeks so I anticipate a build up of tuning parts in my absence! It’s kickstart with dynamo electrics and appears to be genuine jdm Honda.
That is amazing! It's a good original one. I'd be inclined to get it running well, semi restore it and ride it standard. Or change the engine to get some extra power if that is the build brief. Engine runs sweetly, if about as noisy as an electric toothbrush. Tyres don’t hold air so need to source some and I’m going away for the next 6 weeks so I anticipate a build up of tuning parts in my absence! It’s kickstart with dynamo electrics and appears to be genuine jdm Honda.
NITO said:
Thanks for posting, an enjoyable read, Nigel sounds like a God send!
It’s great to see you enjoying it like this, takes me back to being a youngster. I’ve sat on a Monkey and Grom and considered one for fun, and often see a little pack of them out and about. I also quite liked the VanVan, although I look like an ape sat on one of them
Keep enjoying and having fun…
To the owner of the black Grom, it looks like a mini StreetHawk!!
I always loved the Baja Honda Monkey that looks like an Africa Twin, but they fetch big money!
Nigel's a dude all right. Always up for tinkering with something and getting the spanners out. And as the bike is (relatively) small he can bring it into his house to tinker in the warmth in the off season. He really enjoys working on it and is always up for the next Evolution. It’s great to see you enjoying it like this, takes me back to being a youngster. I’ve sat on a Monkey and Grom and considered one for fun, and often see a little pack of them out and about. I also quite liked the VanVan, although I look like an ape sat on one of them
Keep enjoying and having fun…
To the owner of the black Grom, it looks like a mini StreetHawk!!
I always loved the Baja Honda Monkey that looks like an Africa Twin, but they fetch big money!
Hello Shirt,
there is no Honda electric start in the classic"small block", only the newer EFI engines have that,
and numerous chinese copies.
As for the general approach, you have / had 3 options :
and also know about the big money needed for small-scale specials.
Maybe keep the original tank & side panels if you want to go option 1 or 2 in later life.
I was suggesting a 4 centimeter swing arm extension, not 4 inches, 4cm looks good with stock mudguard.
I have no experience between the 88 and 108 Take kits, but a good dealer ( not only salesman ) should know,
some kits have different cams and ignition systems available, to tune the engine characteristics for your ( wife) needs,
more power up the rev range but small powerband with lots of shifting,
or more "low & midrange grunt" for power cruising.
Keep us informed when you get the Monkey on the bench, reads like a great small project.
there is no Honda electric start in the classic"small block", only the newer EFI engines have that,
and numerous chinese copies.
As for the general approach, you have / had 3 options :
- full restoration of a classic and rare-ish Honda JDM Monkey
- keeping the stock optics and doing subtle inside changes, aka "Resto-Mod"
- full custom with tech and optics as you please
and also know about the big money needed for small-scale specials.
Maybe keep the original tank & side panels if you want to go option 1 or 2 in later life.
I was suggesting a 4 centimeter swing arm extension, not 4 inches, 4cm looks good with stock mudguard.
I have no experience between the 88 and 108 Take kits, but a good dealer ( not only salesman ) should know,
some kits have different cams and ignition systems available, to tune the engine characteristics for your ( wife) needs,
more power up the rev range but small powerband with lots of shifting,
or more "low & midrange grunt" for power cruising.
Keep us informed when you get the Monkey on the bench, reads like a great small project.
Edited by Benni on Thursday 20th March 07:35
i was going somewhere between options 2&3 but after some thought i've dialled it back a fair bit.
a friend has one with 4 a speed manual and 108cc and reckons that is overkill. he has ridden the TT, dakar, bonneville etc and says the monkey is the thing he has crashed the most.
i'm also wondering if its inability to get up the car park ramp [albeit on flat tyres] was the clutch slipping. and lastly i have to think about registering it in switzerland which is no doubt going to be a ton of fun.
so i have emailed a few suppliers including daxanised in germany. they offer various mild upgrades to 72cc, more importantly they are stamped as 49cc.... so it will likely be one of these with a suitable carb, heavy duty clutch [if needed] and a full rebuild kit. will be kept as 3spd semi auto.
then +4cm swingarm for stability and suitably lengthened shocks, electric lights, otherwise full stock rebuild and paint.
also from research it seems they did this livery between 1980 and 83. if it's an 83 then that is my oh's birth year so i can claim this was deliberate
a friend has one with 4 a speed manual and 108cc and reckons that is overkill. he has ridden the TT, dakar, bonneville etc and says the monkey is the thing he has crashed the most.
i'm also wondering if its inability to get up the car park ramp [albeit on flat tyres] was the clutch slipping. and lastly i have to think about registering it in switzerland which is no doubt going to be a ton of fun.
so i have emailed a few suppliers including daxanised in germany. they offer various mild upgrades to 72cc, more importantly they are stamped as 49cc.... so it will likely be one of these with a suitable carb, heavy duty clutch [if needed] and a full rebuild kit. will be kept as 3spd semi auto.
then +4cm swingarm for stability and suitably lengthened shocks, electric lights, otherwise full stock rebuild and paint.
also from research it seems they did this livery between 1980 and 83. if it's an 83 then that is my oh's birth year so i can claim this was deliberate
Hello Shirt,
I like your change of plan, there are various cyl. heads and cams available for 72cc to suit the engine to the driver.
50cc head can be re-used if machined or with special dome-style piston with squish area.
You could also fit an SS50 head with the much larger valves but carb and exhaust have to provide feed and flow.
I like your change of plan, there are various cyl. heads and cams available for 72cc to suit the engine to the driver.
50cc head can be re-used if machined or with special dome-style piston with squish area.
You could also fit an SS50 head with the much larger valves but carb and exhaust have to provide feed and flow.
Benni said:
Baja looks good, I heard that some original parts are hard to find / out of production ?
With the e-start, I suppose that is a non-Honda engine, why no original one ?
50cc is very easy to start with kicker and e-start needs bigger battery / alternator.
I've not even bothered looking for original parts to be honest, its a Jincheng Monkey copy so never going to be worth much, its just a bit of fun.With the e-start, I suppose that is a non-Honda engine, why no original one ?
50cc is very easy to start with kicker and e-start needs bigger battery / alternator.
The engine is a 72cc Lifan 4 speed manual which I got from facebook, hence the electric start. I got this as the standard 50cc semi auto was pretty awful. I probably wont bother wiring up the starter as the original bike was kick start only and doesnt even have a battery or any electrics to run it.
supacool1 said:
That looks amazing! Good work! Is it going to live in the house or will it get ridden?
Mine is getting a refresh for this years evolution.
The plan is to take it to Malle Mile this year, and use it as a pit bike at Silverstone Classic this. Its not registered so will be off road only,Mine is getting a refresh for this years evolution.
Edited by AceOfHearts on Wednesday 16th April 15:42
good work for 5 weeks. mine is still next to the sofa and has probably stunk the flat out with leaky fuel tap by now.
did you go for bridgestone trail wings? i ordered mine from amazon in the US. got a few parcels waiting for me when i get home in a couple of weeks.
re. the lifan, how does 72cc feel? i am waiting on a supplier to give me the cost for a full rebuild kit for my original engine to go up to 72cc so keen to know if that's a good idea or not.
i want to strip it to the cases and replace all the gaskets, bearings etc. and hoping i can lose the points but still stay 6v. haven't looked at that yet.
did you go for bridgestone trail wings? i ordered mine from amazon in the US. got a few parcels waiting for me when i get home in a couple of weeks.
re. the lifan, how does 72cc feel? i am waiting on a supplier to give me the cost for a full rebuild kit for my original engine to go up to 72cc so keen to know if that's a good idea or not.
i want to strip it to the cases and replace all the gaskets, bearings etc. and hoping i can lose the points but still stay 6v. haven't looked at that yet.
Jincheng was one of the first Honda-licensed copy companies, and they were *almost* up to Honda quality.
I would try to get the 3-speed engine running, maybe later, don´t sell it for peanuts 8-) .
The 3 speed actually has two clutches in one, it is centrifugal with weights, you can put 1st in at idle and the Monkey will not run away,
only when you apply throttle and revs the bike will move.
The reason all these semi-automatics have an un-japanese CLUNK noise when engaging any gear is
that the clutch is separated and engaged while shifting, this also explains the un-japanese heavy shifting.
If adjusted properly, you can put 1st gear in while idling, keep foot down on lever, rev the engine ,
and with a *sensible* foot control you can slide the clutch like in a car to accelerate quick.
Many people made the mistake to rev high and just stamp on the pedal, resulting in a BIG unwanted wheelie.
Inside the clutch basket there is a centrifuge for engine oil where crud is separated, no oil filter needed.
For use as pit bike : many circuits require a registered and insured pit vehicle, chek out local track rules.
I would try to get the 3-speed engine running, maybe later, don´t sell it for peanuts 8-) .
The 3 speed actually has two clutches in one, it is centrifugal with weights, you can put 1st in at idle and the Monkey will not run away,
only when you apply throttle and revs the bike will move.
The reason all these semi-automatics have an un-japanese CLUNK noise when engaging any gear is
that the clutch is separated and engaged while shifting, this also explains the un-japanese heavy shifting.
If adjusted properly, you can put 1st gear in while idling, keep foot down on lever, rev the engine ,
and with a *sensible* foot control you can slide the clutch like in a car to accelerate quick.
Many people made the mistake to rev high and just stamp on the pedal, resulting in a BIG unwanted wheelie.
Inside the clutch basket there is a centrifuge for engine oil where crud is separated, no oil filter needed.
For use as pit bike : many circuits require a registered and insured pit vehicle, chek out local track rules.
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