Survey of ownership cost v buying a sorted example .
Discussion
Bought the cheapest on the market in August 2016 for £6500.
Absolutely not a bargain
Since then it’s had £4k chassis works, new outriggers and wishbones, £1k for an entire roof, rear section, targa and trim, £2.5k brakes, suspension, tyres and wheels (new pattern rear discs and calipers with 300mm upgrade and Jag calipers upgrade to the fronts, Alun’s old Gaz Gold Pro’s with rose joints set up for fast road/track, and TD pro race wheels with Federal 595RS-Rs), and £1k odds and sods.
So I’m £15k deep for a ‘93 400 still running the wheezy 3.9 engine on a carb, in desperate need of interior trim. The handling is superb and it’ll show most things a clean set of heels on track, but that’s all it’s got going for it. Probably saleable for £10k at a push on a good day.
To make it my perfect Chimaera it needs an interior refresh which I’d budget £2k for, a built engine with EFI, and drivetrain refresh ~£10k, the front end touching up (and a mk3 headlight conversion) and various cosmetics I’d probably spend £1k on. Probably needs another £13-15k before it becomes a really ‘nice’ car. I’m fast learning my lesson about buying in haste!
Absolutely not a bargain
Since then it’s had £4k chassis works, new outriggers and wishbones, £1k for an entire roof, rear section, targa and trim, £2.5k brakes, suspension, tyres and wheels (new pattern rear discs and calipers with 300mm upgrade and Jag calipers upgrade to the fronts, Alun’s old Gaz Gold Pro’s with rose joints set up for fast road/track, and TD pro race wheels with Federal 595RS-Rs), and £1k odds and sods.
So I’m £15k deep for a ‘93 400 still running the wheezy 3.9 engine on a carb, in desperate need of interior trim. The handling is superb and it’ll show most things a clean set of heels on track, but that’s all it’s got going for it. Probably saleable for £10k at a push on a good day.
To make it my perfect Chimaera it needs an interior refresh which I’d budget £2k for, a built engine with EFI, and drivetrain refresh ~£10k, the front end touching up (and a mk3 headlight conversion) and various cosmetics I’d probably spend £1k on. Probably needs another £13-15k before it becomes a really ‘nice’ car. I’m fast learning my lesson about buying in haste!
Wow, mine seems really cheap at about £21K total spend.
I will add for those that don’t do themselves, a huge amount of free blood, sweat and tears goes in by the guys that do everything themselves.
I’ve done everything except front end respray, gearbox o/h and the actual welding of the outriggers. I know, I’m slack
I will add for those that don’t do themselves, a huge amount of free blood, sweat and tears goes in by the guys that do everything themselves.
I’ve done everything except front end respray, gearbox o/h and the actual welding of the outriggers. I know, I’m slack
I thought I was buying a mostly sorted one. The previous owner to me had spent over £15k on my current '96 Chimaera 4.0 between 2015 and 2017. After buying it. He paid a dealer to do just about everything and there's the rub as mentioned about doing stuff yourself to save £1000s in labour.
To be fair, he paid for a full body off respray with new outriggers, several services and a Canems conversion that I couldn't do either, but I would fit a battery, alternator, number plates, belt tensioner etc myself. A clutch change I would consider but not sure with no ramp or pit, so I'm glad that was done too.
To buy one with everything, absolutely everything, is £15k plus for a 4.0 and £20k plus for a 5.0 I think. Mind you, a friend of mine sold his 500 in 2017 for under £15k. It was gorgeous. Refurbed chassis, hood, brakes, interior. The reason? The little history it had went up in smoke at Central TVR's fire and it had 116k on the clock. On the original engine.
When I bought mine, I knew the suspension needed a refurb as well as the seats and the dash was cracked. Very old tyres too. But you know how it is, I discovered the front wishbones were too far gone and changed them all. So ball joints and TREs get changed. Refurbished the wheels completely with new tyres. Fixed several little electrical issues like warning lamps not working. New windscreen via the insurance. Refurbished the suspension, seats and wrapped the dash. A geo set up with new engine mounts (only big jobs I didn't do myself). Just had the injectors cleaned.
I have a spreadsheet (not recommended if you're easily scared) and the 'cosmetics only' section including powder coating the rocker covers, anti roll bars, springs + various pipes, and metal polishing other parts comes to over £250 on its own. I started spreadsheets for every vehicle I've had since 2009 when I was working self employed using my own vehicle and needed to work out my costs per mile. Basically to decide if leasing one would be cheaper than running an old Panda multijet. It wasn't. That's how I know my 12 months with a 2003 Boxster S cost me 99p per mile. BEFORE putting any fuel in it or taxing and insuring it.
I'm retired now but still do it, it's become a habit.
So I'm into this car for over £13k now, and unlikely to recover it, yet. The lack of power steering (I agonised for days over buying it because of this, it really is OK) will still repel many buyers. It's a keeper, I think...…………… This week.
Many buyers only seem to want to pay £11k - £12k for one, but for that they'll need deep pockets, unless they're lucky.
To be fair, he paid for a full body off respray with new outriggers, several services and a Canems conversion that I couldn't do either, but I would fit a battery, alternator, number plates, belt tensioner etc myself. A clutch change I would consider but not sure with no ramp or pit, so I'm glad that was done too.
To buy one with everything, absolutely everything, is £15k plus for a 4.0 and £20k plus for a 5.0 I think. Mind you, a friend of mine sold his 500 in 2017 for under £15k. It was gorgeous. Refurbed chassis, hood, brakes, interior. The reason? The little history it had went up in smoke at Central TVR's fire and it had 116k on the clock. On the original engine.
When I bought mine, I knew the suspension needed a refurb as well as the seats and the dash was cracked. Very old tyres too. But you know how it is, I discovered the front wishbones were too far gone and changed them all. So ball joints and TREs get changed. Refurbished the wheels completely with new tyres. Fixed several little electrical issues like warning lamps not working. New windscreen via the insurance. Refurbished the suspension, seats and wrapped the dash. A geo set up with new engine mounts (only big jobs I didn't do myself). Just had the injectors cleaned.
I have a spreadsheet (not recommended if you're easily scared) and the 'cosmetics only' section including powder coating the rocker covers, anti roll bars, springs + various pipes, and metal polishing other parts comes to over £250 on its own. I started spreadsheets for every vehicle I've had since 2009 when I was working self employed using my own vehicle and needed to work out my costs per mile. Basically to decide if leasing one would be cheaper than running an old Panda multijet. It wasn't. That's how I know my 12 months with a 2003 Boxster S cost me 99p per mile. BEFORE putting any fuel in it or taxing and insuring it.
I'm retired now but still do it, it's become a habit. So I'm into this car for over £13k now, and unlikely to recover it, yet. The lack of power steering (I agonised for days over buying it because of this, it really is OK) will still repel many buyers. It's a keeper, I think...…………… This week.
Many buyers only seem to want to pay £11k - £12k for one, but for that they'll need deep pockets, unless they're lucky.
phazed said:
If we are coming out..............Just copied and pasted so not quite as sad as you think.
Some of the upgrades carried across from my old 4.6 as I put that back to standard when I sold it.
Also includes a new block as the old one developed a crack behind the liner and the resulting water ingress, the whole radiators worth went through the engine at a track day and I reckon that is what prematurely wore the bores.
Crankshaft also replaced when it snapped while cruising at 60 miles an hour! As to why that happened, no one will ever know but the new crankshaft which was balanced by John Eales brother has made the engine smoother than before so I am guessing the original crankshaft wasn't balanced that well.
Car running beautifully and doesn't use a drop of oil.
Engine.
5.5 RV8 built by yours truly.
Top hated large journal block.
Cross bolted,
Special stroker crank,
Cat forged steel H beam rods,
ARP head bolts,
Forged Diamond pistons,
Total Seal gapless rings,
H404 camshaft plus hydraulic lifters,
Yella Terra roller rockers,
JE billet outrigger posts,
ACT Triple plenum and 45mm trumpet base,
Plenum inlet opened out to 95mm,
100mm induction hose,
100mm KN Hiflow filter,
Stage 4 ported big valve heads,
10.5 :1 Comp,
Ported and polished inlet manifold,
30lb Accell Injectors,
JE alternator bracket,
P38 coil pack,
twin flame traps and catch tank fitted,
Magnacor 8mm leads,
McLeod 10.5" twin plate clutch (rated to 800 horses),
Forged lightweight alloy flywheel,
Other stuff.
Aaron alloy radiator,
ACT full set black silicon hoses,
34 row oil cooler with therostatic sandwich plate take off,
ACT S/S complete decatted big bore exhaust manifolds and pipe work,
New Emerald ECU fitted and mapped by Joolz plus new engine harness,
Wideband gauge,
SPA dual digital oil temp and pressure gauge,
Gaz Mono Dampers with Eibach 450/400 Springs,
5 stud conversion,
RL7 wheels, 17" all round with R1Rs for road,
Black RL7 wheels 17" & 18" with R888s for track,
Braided brake hoses,
Tuscan big brake conversion with DS2500 pads,
Thicker 25mm & 22mm ARBs fitted,
Ford Focus RS rear rose joint drop links,
Leven front drop links,
Superflex Polyurethane bushes all round,
TR Lane roll bar,
Converted to electric/hydraulic PS pump,
Converted to Subaru PS rack,
Series 2 Elise seats superbly upholstered in matching leather by Zigga,
4 point harness fitted to drivers seat,
Additional vents cut to front valance,
Carbon fibre front splitter,
QD bonnet hinges,
Additional servo and electric vacuum pump fitted to assist HD clutch,
Additional sound and heat insulation fitted, t
Tubular front wishbones fitted to front,
New outriggers fitted in-house,
New diff fitted & Polybushed ,
Gearbox completely overhauled with 5th gear mod.
Bought for £11,000 with 31k on the clock.
Spent about £10k, (car came with a lot of goodies but in a very sad state)
If I had not started with a car that had money spent on it, you could easily add another £15k on top and that's doing the work myself.
https://youtu.be/v4aahE3UvsQ
[img]
Peter this almost reads like an advert, hope your not selling the beast!Some of the upgrades carried across from my old 4.6 as I put that back to standard when I sold it.
Also includes a new block as the old one developed a crack behind the liner and the resulting water ingress, the whole radiators worth went through the engine at a track day and I reckon that is what prematurely wore the bores.
Crankshaft also replaced when it snapped while cruising at 60 miles an hour! As to why that happened, no one will ever know but the new crankshaft which was balanced by John Eales brother has made the engine smoother than before so I am guessing the original crankshaft wasn't balanced that well.
Car running beautifully and doesn't use a drop of oil.
Engine.
5.5 RV8 built by yours truly.
Top hated large journal block.
Cross bolted,
Special stroker crank,
Cat forged steel H beam rods,
ARP head bolts,
Forged Diamond pistons,
Total Seal gapless rings,
H404 camshaft plus hydraulic lifters,
Yella Terra roller rockers,
JE billet outrigger posts,
ACT Triple plenum and 45mm trumpet base,
Plenum inlet opened out to 95mm,
100mm induction hose,
100mm KN Hiflow filter,
Stage 4 ported big valve heads,
10.5 :1 Comp,
Ported and polished inlet manifold,
30lb Accell Injectors,
JE alternator bracket,
P38 coil pack,
twin flame traps and catch tank fitted,
Magnacor 8mm leads,
McLeod 10.5" twin plate clutch (rated to 800 horses),
Forged lightweight alloy flywheel,
Other stuff.
Aaron alloy radiator,
ACT full set black silicon hoses,
34 row oil cooler with therostatic sandwich plate take off,
ACT S/S complete decatted big bore exhaust manifolds and pipe work,
New Emerald ECU fitted and mapped by Joolz plus new engine harness,
Wideband gauge,
SPA dual digital oil temp and pressure gauge,
Gaz Mono Dampers with Eibach 450/400 Springs,
5 stud conversion,
RL7 wheels, 17" all round with R1Rs for road,
Black RL7 wheels 17" & 18" with R888s for track,
Braided brake hoses,
Tuscan big brake conversion with DS2500 pads,
Thicker 25mm & 22mm ARBs fitted,
Ford Focus RS rear rose joint drop links,
Leven front drop links,
Superflex Polyurethane bushes all round,
TR Lane roll bar,
Converted to electric/hydraulic PS pump,
Converted to Subaru PS rack,
Series 2 Elise seats superbly upholstered in matching leather by Zigga,
4 point harness fitted to drivers seat,
Additional vents cut to front valance,
Carbon fibre front splitter,
QD bonnet hinges,
Additional servo and electric vacuum pump fitted to assist HD clutch,
Additional sound and heat insulation fitted, t
Tubular front wishbones fitted to front,
New outriggers fitted in-house,
New diff fitted & Polybushed ,
Gearbox completely overhauled with 5th gear mod.
Bought for £11,000 with 31k on the clock.
Spent about £10k, (car came with a lot of goodies but in a very sad state)
If I had not started with a car that had money spent on it, you could easily add another £15k on top and that's doing the work myself.
https://youtu.be/v4aahE3UvsQ
[img]Probably one of the most interesting threads to date and hopefully will serve as a great educational piece for those looking to purchase or considering long term tvr ownership.
That said this is a hobby not a business, I always end up chucking loads of money and time at cars but would do it again every time in a heart beat, especially when you do most of it yourself, you can’t buy satisfaction like that
I have been looking for an LS project cerb.
The two that I showed an interest in were ridiculously expensive for what they were and since then I looked at one this week, an early 96 and it had about 2 inches less headroom then my Chimaera with standard seats! What is that all about? They were designed for midgets.
With their lower roof line, they seem out ot the picture
The two that I showed an interest in were ridiculously expensive for what they were and since then I looked at one this week, an early 96 and it had about 2 inches less headroom then my Chimaera with standard seats! What is that all about? They were designed for midgets.
With their lower roof line, they seem out ot the picture
I just thought I would add that these cars, (Chimaera's) are not only a true sports car but don't really have any other competition.
They can be taken apart down to every nuts and bolt, refurbished, upgraded and put back together again. You can do this piecemeal over a period of time or bite the bullet and do it all in one hit.
Parts are cheap and plentiful and engine mods are cheap compared to other vehicles.
Even though I have had Chimaera's for 12 years now, what would I replace it with that has similar performance, handling and versatility.
I am giving up work in the next couple of months and have been looking for a project but as yet nothing has materialised. I will stick to TVRs as they are so Meccano like and well within my capabilities
Anyone with an interesting project, whatever model, please contact me.
They can be taken apart down to every nuts and bolt, refurbished, upgraded and put back together again. You can do this piecemeal over a period of time or bite the bullet and do it all in one hit.
Parts are cheap and plentiful and engine mods are cheap compared to other vehicles.
Even though I have had Chimaera's for 12 years now, what would I replace it with that has similar performance, handling and versatility.
I am giving up work in the next couple of months and have been looking for a project but as yet nothing has materialised. I will stick to TVRs as they are so Meccano like and well within my capabilities
Anyone with an interesting project, whatever model, please contact me. phazed said:
I have been looking for an LS project cerb.
The two that I showed an interest in were ridiculously expensive for what they were and since then I looked at one this week, an early 96 and it had about 2 inches less headroom then my Chimaera with standard seats! What is that all about? They were designed for midgets.
With their lower roof line, they seem out ot the picture
Hi Peter,The two that I showed an interest in were ridiculously expensive for what they were and since then I looked at one this week, an early 96 and it had about 2 inches less headroom then my Chimaera with standard seats! What is that all about? They were designed for midgets.
With their lower roof line, they seem out ot the picture
Did they both have the chunky Cerb seats in? If so, they are really high. I looked at a Chim that had them in and I couldn’t get in that comfortably. It might the Seats or the runners but definitely a factor. Get someone to measure from floor to ceiling before ruling it out
The seats were not any thicker than the chimera seats. In fact the drivers seat was fitted lower than the passenger seat.
Sitting in the passenger seat I would have to have my head removed to fit properly!
If you look at a cerb and a chim side-by-side you can see the difference in rooflines easily. It seems as if TVR took a chim, streched it a little and chopped the roofline.
Sitting in the passenger seat I would have to have my head removed to fit properly!
If you look at a cerb and a chim side-by-side you can see the difference in rooflines easily. It seems as if TVR took a chim, streched it a little and chopped the roofline.
phazed said:
I am giving up work in the next couple of months and have been looking for a project but as yet nothing has materialised. I will stick to TVRs as they are so Meccano like and well within my capabilities
Anyone with an interesting project, whatever model, please contact me. Purchased Griff 4.3 92 plate in may 18 . Paid 16 k with reg. 50,000 mileage took a gamble non runner arlam issues , been stored for a couple of years. costs to date brake conversion wms 6 pot calipers 1K, protech shocks another grand , new ecu and wiring repairs, £1,300 Peter Wiggins dash £550, polybush kit £800 in the process of fitting poly bushes not forgetting new bottom wishbones from Racetech further ahead new screen, exhaust manifolds hopefully Clive ford's. Since ownership mileage done 423 . Sold wedge to get Griff had the last one twenty years yes will be keeping the Griff. Photos to follow the long game. off to second home garage!
I'm enjoying this thread because I'm at a crossroads with my Chim' by which I mean sell what's been done including the messed about body and replace it with a runner I can use on sunny days.
https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
So keep it going please.
Edited by lancepar on Sunday 10th February 12:31
lancepar said:
I'm enjoying this thread because I'm at a crossroads with my Chim' by which I mean sell what's been done including the messed about body and replace it with a runner I can use on sunny days.
https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
So keep it going please.
Edited by lancepar on Sunday 10th February 12:31
It seems you still have a lot more to do. When it is finished, you will have a very nice 4 L but after driving it for awhile you may want a little more.
Although you could change the engine for a larger capacity or spend a lot on tuning the 4 litre, as we know all this will add a lot more spending on your existing project.
What to do?
Jon Brown said:
phazed said:
Yes I did. It was a 4.6, 320 bhp.
I was thinking of the classic tvr (60s?)A most beautiful looking car that was the most uncomfortable, noisiest internally and generally very poor drive! It made the chimaera seem like a modern BMW by comparison.
That has gone for the above reasons. My wife said after one drive, "never ask me to go out in the car again!"
phazed said:
The seats were not any thicker than the chimera seats. In fact the drivers seat was fitted lower than the passenger seat.
Sitting in the passenger seat I would have to have my head removed to fit properly!
If you look at a cerb and a chim side-by-side you can see the difference in rooflines easily. It seems as if TVR took a chim, streched it a little and chopped the roofline.
I thought the Cerbera was higher than the Chim, about 2 inches from memory! It is a while since I have been in one though. The Cerb seats are definitely not a straight swap into the Chim eitherSitting in the passenger seat I would have to have my head removed to fit properly!
If you look at a cerb and a chim side-by-side you can see the difference in rooflines easily. It seems as if TVR took a chim, streched it a little and chopped the roofline.
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