Backing up Synology NAS

[clockworks]

I've got a Synology DS420+ with around 8TB of media files, in 3 folders (Video, Music, Photos).

I've recently replaced my iMac with a Mac Mini, and have bought new SSD external drives to go with it.
This leaves me with 3x 4TB external HDDs spare.

I thought I'd re-use these HDDs and backup all the media from the NAS.

I'm a bit stuck on how to do this though. I can connect a USB drive to the NAS, but the "USB Copy" utility only allows a single folder to be copied to an external drive.

In FileStation, I can select multiple folders, but it Moves them, rather than Copying them. Obviously I want to leave the original files on the NAS

The only way I can see to do it is across the network using Finder, with the USB drive connected to my Mac.

[davek_964]

Why would you?

Surely you're using Raid so you have redundancy in the NAS anyway. Unless somebody broke in and stole it, it seems unlikely you'd lose the content on it.

[alock]

RAID is not backup. It provides redundancy to keep your files live if a disk fails. I've had two RAID cards fail over the last 30 years that have destroyed all data on their way out.

You probably don't need the same level of backup for all your data. It might be best to isolate what's most important, and concentrate on that first.

I have some ripped DVDs on my NAS. I don't backup those because I can re-rip them if necessary.

[clockworks]

Yes, running RAID, so losing a single disk isn't an issue.
I'm thinking more about a cabinet failure, and the old disks maybe not being compatible with a newer cabinet?

Since I've already got the USB disks, might as well use them for something.

The NAS is worked quite hard, as I'm using it for 3x CCTV cameras (Surveillance Station) and Time Machine, as well as a media server

Edited by clockworks on Sunday 13th April 10:13

[rednotdead]

You can add multiple folders and 'jobs' to your USB copy app on the synology so when the specific USB drive is plugged in the NAS will run the jobs sequentially., just use the '+' at the top of the app to add as many folders as you like.

I have one 8TB USB that when plugged in the NAS copies movies and music

I have one 4TB USB that when plugged in the NAS copies over the home directories

This on top of the NAS->NAS backups and NAS->cloud jobs.

[bitchstewie]

davek_964 said:

Why would you?

Surely you're using Raid so you have redundancy in the NAS anyway. Unless somebody broke in and stole it, it seems unlikely you'd lose the content on it.

RAID isn't backup.

As stated it's resiliency.

RAID can still fail and RAID won't do a damned thing for you if/when you have finger trouble and press delete at the wrong level in Finder nor will it help you if you get ransomware or "something bad" happens at file level.

Sorry

[clockworks]

rednotdead said:

You can add multiple folders and 'jobs' to your USB copy app on the synology so when the specific USB drive is plugged in the NAS will run the jobs sequentially., just use the '+' at the top of the app to add as many folders as you like.

I have one 8TB USB that when plugged in the NAS copies movies and music

I have one 4TB USB that when plugged in the NAS copies over the home directories

This on top of the NAS->NAS backups and NAS->cloud jobs.

I'll have another look, see if I can do that

Edit:

Are you saying, add a second USB Copy task to copy a second folder to the USB drive that has already used the first USB Copy task to add the first folder?
I already tried that, and it complained about "insufficient space" on the target drive.

The first folder (music) used just under 1TB on the 4TB drive.
The second folder (photos) is less than 300GB.

It looks like USB Copy wants to allocate the entire drive for each task.
Is that because I chose "Incremental" as the option?

Edit:

Reading the Synology documentation, it looks like my problem might be due to not creating folders on the destination USB drive - "multiple tasks cannot copy to the same destination path".
That suggests multiple tasks to one drive can be done only if I create multiple folders, one for each task?

Edited by clockworks on Sunday 13th April 11:03

Edited by clockworks on Sunday 13th April 11:11

[Prak]

The HyperBackup tool on Synology will let you back up to a USB drive with the usual backup functionality. I back mine up to both a USB disk and a second small single-disk Synology.

[rednotdead]

clockworks said:

Reading the Synology documentation, it looks like my problem might be due to not creating folders on the destination USB drive - "multiple tasks cannot copy to the same destination path".
That suggests multiple tasks to one drive can be done only if I create multiple folders, one for each task?

Edited by clockworks on Sunday 13th April 11:11

Just checked my settings and yes - I have a separate folder on the usb drive for each task, e,g movies copies (incrementally) to /Movies, series to /TVseries etc.

I've also got the jobs set up to start when the USB is plugged in, the NAS beeps etc to tell you it's started and finished.

[Funk]

I'd get something like this: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Icybox-IB-3664SU3-Externa... and pop the disks in - keeps them nice and neat (and cooled) as JBOD. They do versions with RAID if you want to go nuts.

I have an older 10-bay version full of drives and as they all present as an external USB I'm able to back them up to Backblaze so I don't worry about RAID; if I lose anything I'll just pull it all back from the cloud.

[clockworks]

Funk said:

I'd get something like this: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Icybox-IB-3664SU3-Externa... and pop the disks in - keeps them nice and neat (and cooled) as JBOD. They do versions with RAID if you want to go nuts.

I have an older 10-bay version full of drives and as they all present as an external USB I'm able to back them up to Backblaze so I don't worry about RAID; if I lose anything I'll just pull it all back from the cloud.

The spare USB drives are all 2.5" portable ones. I'll just stick them in a box, and plug them in every now and then.

[clockworks]

rednotdead said:

Just checked my settings and yes - I have a separate folder on the usb drive for each task, e,g movies copies (incrementally) to /Movies, series to /TVseries etc.

I've also got the jobs set up to start when the USB is plugged in, the NAS beeps etc to tell you it's started and finished.

I've created folders on the drive, and I'm trying it again.

It's just beeped and failed after about 10 minutes, saying "insufficient space".
Seems odd with an empty 4TB drive?

Edit:

The USB disk actually had 2 partitions, one was very small. Only the first partition was recognised by the Synology.
I've now formatted the drive to EXT4, one partition. Trying again

Edited by clockworks on Sunday 13th April 12:16

[Arnold Cunningham]

I no longer use a NAS or RAID after losing data on them. Great to data centres, bit rubbish at home.

Now I use stablebit drivepool for all local storage, combined with Backblaze for offsite backup. Both work really well, I doubt I’ll ever go back to NAS or RAID at home.

[clockworks]

Having formatted the drive and created folders, I can now back up each folder separately, using individual "USB Copy" tasks.
That's the music and photos sorted.


I've got to do the Video folders backup again though, as the HDD wasn't quite big enough.
I've got 7 separate folders under the main "Video" folder.
Looks like I'll have to use 7 separate "USB Copy" tasks, one for each folder, and split them across 2 drives. A bit of a pain!

I could just split the 7 folder into 2 higher-level folders ("blu-ray" and "everything else"), but I'm worried that will mess with the media players as stuff will be on different paths.


If I bite the bullet and do it the hard way, and set each task to auto-run when the disk is plugged in, will all the tasks applicable to each drive run sequentially?

[Griffith4ever]

Prak said:

The HyperBackup tool on Synology will let you back up to a USB drive with the usual backup functionality. I back mine up to both a USB disk and a second small single-disk Synology.

same here.

[V8RAW]

davek_964 said:

Why would you?

Surely you're using Raid so you have redundancy in the NAS anyway. Unless somebody broke in and stole it, it seems unlikely you'd lose the content on it.

I take it you've not heard of QNAP's Qlocker ransomware incident? Whilst Synology is a better product and device open to the internet is a risk.

I personally have local backups to external HDD of my NAS, but also back it up to the cloud via Amazon Web Services. 👍

https://securityaffairs.com/117144/malware/qlocker...

[Griffith4ever]

bhstewie said:

RAID isn't backup.

As stated it's resiliency.

RAID can still fail and RAID won't do a damned thing for you if/when you have finger trouble and press delete at the wrong level in Finder nor will it help you if you get ransomware or "something bad" happens at file level.

Sorry

Not to mention no matter how many disks I have in my RAID, it helps nowt if my house burns down, or the NAS is stolen in a burglary.

[Mandat]

Arnold Cunningham said:

I no longer use a NAS or RAID after losing data on them. Great to data centres, bit rubbish at home.

Now I use stablebit drivepool for all local storage, combined with Backblaze for offsite backup. Both work really well, I doubt I’ll ever go back to NAS or RAID at home.

Just to pick up on this point.

It sounds like you previously lost your data due to a lack of a backup. You have now rectified this by having a backup copy in place.

That being the case, I don't see much difference in where you have your primary storage, i.e. NAS or local PC, so why is NAS rubbish at home?

[Mandat]

OP; what kind of speeds are you getting via the USB connection?

I can't imagine that copying TB's of data via USB is going to be a fast process, unless you're using the newest USB-C connection.

[clockworks]

Mandat said:

OP; what kind of speeds are you getting via the USB connection?

I can't imagine that copying TB's of data via USB is going to be a fast process, unless you're using the newest USB-C connection.

Video files are about 250GB per hour
Music files about 80GB per hour

Basically 2 days to copy just under 8TB of data.

Hopefully I'll only have to do it once - until the NAS dies.


The drives are USB3, but with USB A plugs.