Gross misconduct - Grounds for?
Discussion
Hey all
Need some advice on dealing with an employee matter in a small business..
I have an employee who has asked for leave giving only 4 days notice.
This has been refused because
1 - We're short staffed on the day in question as we already have people on leave and need to maintaine sensible staffing levels.
2 - It's within the 14 day notice period that all staff are required to give when requesting holiday.
If this member of staff takes the day off anyway and doesn't come into work is that grounds for dismissal as gross misconduct?
Need some advice on dealing with an employee matter in a small business..
I have an employee who has asked for leave giving only 4 days notice.
This has been refused because
1 - We're short staffed on the day in question as we already have people on leave and need to maintaine sensible staffing levels.
2 - It's within the 14 day notice period that all staff are required to give when requesting holiday.
If this member of staff takes the day off anyway and doesn't come into work is that grounds for dismissal as gross misconduct?
Thats not really classed as gross misconduct. GM is for serious matters like stealing, violence etc. You start throwing it around for an employee pulling a sickie and you would lose credibility.
You can ask for a sick note to back it up and you should offer to pay for the note (employees don't have to have a GP note for first 7 days, but can request one at a cost). I have done this in the past, however, the contract of employment allowed for this, yours probably dont.
I would discipline the employee if you have a genuine belief that they were taking the mick, however, the most I would expect to give them is a written warning.
My rule of thumb with leave is that the employee has to give at least as much notice as the amount of time they want to take. So if it is an odd day, then a day or two notice is ok (as long as it can be covered). If they want to take a week then I expect at least a weeks notice.
You can ask for a sick note to back it up and you should offer to pay for the note (employees don't have to have a GP note for first 7 days, but can request one at a cost). I have done this in the past, however, the contract of employment allowed for this, yours probably dont.
I would discipline the employee if you have a genuine belief that they were taking the mick, however, the most I would expect to give them is a written warning.
My rule of thumb with leave is that the employee has to give at least as much notice as the amount of time they want to take. So if it is an odd day, then a day or two notice is ok (as long as it can be covered). If they want to take a week then I expect at least a weeks notice.
Slurms said:
He just has informed us that despite being told he can't take holiday then he's not going to be coming in to work anyway.
Is he a valued employee, or are you just looking for an excuse to get rid on the cheap?Does he have a good reason for needing the time off at short notice?
I am aware of a case where an individual did just this - deliberately and wilfully told untruths and declared themselves sick whilst remaining in Mexico on holiday. It was proven and the individual dismissed.
Very much depends on the circumstances, but the general test for GM is that the individual's misconduct was of such seriousness that the relationship between they and the company was irrevocably broken.
Very much depends on the circumstances, but the general test for GM is that the individual's misconduct was of such seriousness that the relationship between they and the company was irrevocably broken.
Slurms said:
Nah this won't be a case of him pulling a sicky
He just has informed us that despite being told he can't take holiday then he's not going to be coming in to work anyway.
You need to sit him down and have a frank discussion. Find out if there is a specific reason for him needing the day off. The answer may change your outlook.He just has informed us that despite being told he can't take holiday then he's not going to be coming in to work anyway.
If he does not have an extremely important reason for meeding the day off then make it clear that the leave has been declined and failure to attend work will result in disciplinary action. Follow this up in writing. If he then fails to attend work on that day, then you would be in a strong position to do what you want with him.
V8A*ndy said:
Slurms said:
Hey all
2 - It's within the 14 day notice period that all staff are required to give when requesting holiday.
Is this in their contract?2 - It's within the 14 day notice period that all staff are required to give when requesting holiday.
Yes the you must give us 14 days notice is in their contract and it also states that holiday is not at any point guarenteed and is dependant on the needs of the business.
He has no valid reason for wanting the holiday he's just booked a trip away that day and doesn't want to miss it.
The final update here is that he's convinced another employee who was supposed to be off that day to cover his shift and we're allowing him to take the time as unpaid leave.
Though I think a written warning will be delivered when he returns..
He has no valid reason for wanting the holiday he's just booked a trip away that day and doesn't want to miss it.
The final update here is that he's convinced another employee who was supposed to be off that day to cover his shift and we're allowing him to take the time as unpaid leave.
Though I think a written warning will be delivered when he returns..
From an employee, as opposed to employer point of view...
How many staff do you employ? and how many are already taking holiday on the days in question?
Have you got any big jobs in the diary that require a certain number of people to carry them out?
Is the employee normally a diligent worker that you've not had problems with before?
How many staff do you employ? and how many are already taking holiday on the days in question?
Have you got any big jobs in the diary that require a certain number of people to carry them out?
Is the employee normally a diligent worker that you've not had problems with before?
Slurms said:
The final update here is that he's convinced another employee who was supposed to be off that day to cover his shift and we're allowing him to take the time as unpaid leave.
Though I think a written warning will be delivered when he returns..
It sounds to me like you are being the awkward one, sometimes trips materialise last minute, he has asked for the time off, you have said no as it would leave you short staffed, he has organised cover and you are still not happy. Though I think a written warning will be delivered when he returns..
Not sure I would allow it unpaid though, I'd make him take it out of his holiday allowance.
Right guys..
Many thanks for the helpfull advice above...
Final upshot of all this is that after he provided cover and apologised for the "screw you i'm taking the leave anyway" attitude he's been given a verbal warning about his conduct and reminded of the holiday requirements when asking for leave in the future.
Many thanks for the helpfull advice above...
Final upshot of all this is that after he provided cover and apologised for the "screw you i'm taking the leave anyway" attitude he's been given a verbal warning about his conduct and reminded of the holiday requirements when asking for leave in the future.
Slurms said:
He has no valid reason for wanting the holiday he's just booked a trip away that day and doesn't want to miss it.
The final update here is that he's convinced another employee who was supposed to be off that day to cover his shift and we're allowing him to take the time as unpaid leave.
Though I think a written warning will be delivered when he returns..
Sounds like a valid reason to me. It must be a barrel of laughs working for you.The final update here is that he's convinced another employee who was supposed to be off that day to cover his shift and we're allowing him to take the time as unpaid leave.
Though I think a written warning will be delivered when he returns..
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