Saab 9000 clutch problem - help needed ASAP!
Discussion
Hi
My Saab 9000 clutch is playing silly buggers. I am needing some PH please!
Yesterday, on the dual carriageway with roundabouts, I started noticing the car get gradually more difficult to engage gears to the point that when home it was pretty impossible.
When stationary, if I depress the clutch fully, I can *just* about select gears but I can feel the car tugging forward. The clutch isn't fully disengaging.
I flushed the clutch fluid (using eezibleed as pressure or vacuum is the only way apparently) and it didn't seem to make any difference. I then started on the pedal (the pin can wear an elliptical hole in the clutch pedal arm). I don't know why but untried the car again, despite not having really done anything on the pedal arm and it worked.
Drive the car to town to test. Worked fine
Then on the way home, it has gone again, worse than before. I'm currently in B&Q carpark. Toss.
Any help or suggestions?? I have a 350 mile drive tonight so would love to fix or bodge until tomorrow when I am home!!
Thanks!
My Saab 9000 clutch is playing silly buggers. I am needing some PH please!
Yesterday, on the dual carriageway with roundabouts, I started noticing the car get gradually more difficult to engage gears to the point that when home it was pretty impossible.
When stationary, if I depress the clutch fully, I can *just* about select gears but I can feel the car tugging forward. The clutch isn't fully disengaging.
I flushed the clutch fluid (using eezibleed as pressure or vacuum is the only way apparently) and it didn't seem to make any difference. I then started on the pedal (the pin can wear an elliptical hole in the clutch pedal arm). I don't know why but untried the car again, despite not having really done anything on the pedal arm and it worked.
Drive the car to town to test. Worked fine
Then on the way home, it has gone again, worse than before. I'm currently in B&Q carpark. Toss. Any help or suggestions?? I have a 350 mile drive tonight so would love to fix or bodge until tomorrow when I am home!!
Thanks!
I had this on my c900 - elliptical wear on the pivot point - drilled out and replaced with larger pin. Didn't solve the problem and turned out to be (surprise surprise) the clutch!
Other thing that gave me a problem was the weld at the top of the clutch pedal broke giving me no clutch.
On the c900 it's the fact that the clutch has to come to the RHS on RHD cars that gives the problem.
My dad had a problem with the clutch on his 9000 but it was hydraulics, pedal to floor, etc. Slave cylinder if I remember correctly.
Other thing that gave me a problem was the weld at the top of the clutch pedal broke giving me no clutch.
On the c900 it's the fact that the clutch has to come to the RHS on RHD cars that gives the problem.
My dad had a problem with the clutch on his 9000 but it was hydraulics, pedal to floor, etc. Slave cylinder if I remember correctly.
The only reason I haven't suspected the clutch itself is because my clutch failure experience is limited only to slip ie clutch not fully engaging. What could fail on a clutch to mean it doesn't fully disengage?? Also, if something has gone on the clutch, what could it be that could be tempremental enough to not work, then work then not work?
I wouldn't suspect the clutch if it works properly sometimes and not others. If the clutch disengages then it can't be that worn.
No external leaks would usually discount the slave cylinder too. It's possible that there is air being drawn in somewhere, and changing the fluid improved this, until you used it again. Did you notice whether there was any air in the old fluid that you flushed? Does it help if you pump the clutch pedal?
Tim
No external leaks would usually discount the slave cylinder too. It's possible that there is air being drawn in somewhere, and changing the fluid improved this, until you used it again. Did you notice whether there was any air in the old fluid that you flushed? Does it help if you pump the clutch pedal?
Tim
Yes, sort of 
I went to bed last night with the car not working. The problem described existed.
I flushed the clutch fluid this morning, tested it again and it didn't work.
Next thing for me to test was the pedal elliptical problem that NCOT mentioned above. Thought I could do a temp fix to give me some extra pedal throw.
Couldn't do anything really but had wiggled the pedal around and depressed the clutch pedal several times. For some reason, the clutch now worked as it should.
I have tried to replicate the "tinkering" but to no avail.
So I have done things but not sure if they are related at all to the working/not working switchover.
Thanks everyone!
I went to bed last night with the car not working. The problem described existed.
I flushed the clutch fluid this morning, tested it again and it didn't work.
Next thing for me to test was the pedal elliptical problem that NCOT mentioned above. Thought I could do a temp fix to give me some extra pedal throw.
Couldn't do anything really but had wiggled the pedal around and depressed the clutch pedal several times. For some reason, the clutch now worked as it should.
I have tried to replicate the "tinkering" but to no avail.
So I have done things but not sure if they are related at all to the working/not working switchover.
Thanks everyone!
Wing Commander said:
The only reason I haven't suspected the clutch itself is because my clutch failure experience is limited only to slip ie clutch not fully engaging. What could fail on a clutch to mean it doesn't fully disengage?? Also, if something has gone on the clutch, what could it be that could be tempremental enough to not work, then work then not work?
Not sure about the intermittent-ness of it, but when I was having trouble with the clutch dragging (couldn't get it into gear without a crunch) it was the clutch. There was only very slight slipping at high revs, I didn't notice it until a tech demonstrated it!Odd thing is though that the clutch pedal has the same feel it should have. Always returns to the top, has consistent pressure (but no more than it should). Feels completely normal from inside the car.
It's just when you have the engine running, and try to pull away, it's just like you aren't pushing the pedal far enough.
It's just when you have the engine running, and try to pull away, it's just like you aren't pushing the pedal far enough.
Your last post has changed things a bit. I'm thinking that the friction plate may be sticking to the flywheel, due to oil or corrosion.
You could try slipping the clutch for a while, to see if it burns it off. A bit drastic, but if it helps, then you'll know where the problem lies.
You can always start the car with first gear already engaged, as a temporary measure.
Cheers
Tim
You could try slipping the clutch for a while, to see if it burns it off. A bit drastic, but if it helps, then you'll know where the problem lies.
You can always start the car with first gear already engaged, as a temporary measure.
Cheers
Tim
Tim, you know what - you are spot on. I don't know a huge amount about clutches, by the RAC man that rescued us and took us home said the same. We started the car in first and it freed itself up. I've got a 350 mile trip to do tonight so hoping it's ok!
Once home, I'll lay the car up and do a clutch change just to be safe. It's probably due one soon anyway
Thanks to everyone (especially Tim for diagnosis!).
PH - you have excelled yourself once again and I thank you for it! Virtual beers all round Collect in person if any of you pass through Devon!
Once home, I'll lay the car up and do a clutch change just to be safe. It's probably due one soon anyway
Thanks to everyone (especially Tim for diagnosis!).
PH - you have excelled yourself once again and I thank you for it! Virtual beers all round
Collect in person if any of you pass through Devon!
Well all was going well on my drive back to Devon. Clutch was working ok and when it wasn't, I slipped it until it freed the clutch plate. Not many gear changes needed on the drive, except, tonight of all nights, there's a 4 mile traffic queue on the M25 at 1am on Monday morning.
Stop starts meant the tired, ropey clutch was not a happy bunny. And neither am I now that I have blown a hydraulic clutch hose.
Currently stranded on M25. Onwards journey to Devon still to be completed and a full day at work tomorrow.
This sucks.
Stop starts meant the tired, ropey clutch was not a happy bunny. And neither am I now that I have blown a hydraulic clutch hose.
Currently stranded on M25. Onwards journey to Devon still to be completed and a full day at work tomorrow.
This sucks.
Well let me try and make you a happy bunny then.
There's a very strong possibility if you have blown the hydraulic hose that such was the problem all along. The only thing that makes me think otherwise is if the hose was the cause of your pressure loss you usually see the loss of fluid from such as it comes out under force in a jet where it is hard not to see. That said, sometimes the hose weeps and is not so much noticeable as all that seemingly happens is the fabric outer gets wet, which isn't so obvious. If this has been the case with your car, the continued use to get you where you were going has finally burst the weeping hose. If this is the case it is your lucky day as it's the most straightforward repair, and the least expensive. Whatever happens next you should replace the hose and bleed the clutch and see if your problem is solved. If you don't, you could never know the hose was the only problem as you are replacing it regardless, but doing so at the same time as the slave cylinder, and master if need be, won't necessarily show if they were the cause or not. Leaking slaves and worn m/cylinder seals are not always obvious to inspection after the fact. Hose though are. Replace the hose first, you could save yourself some labour time and money. But you'll never know if you don't.
Now on the other hand. If the slave cylinder through your constant use if it were in a distressed state, might have come out too far and stuck. If so you might momentarily have experienced a hard pedal. Trying to overcome the hard pedal might be what caused the hose to burst under higher pressure. A well worn friction plate needs the slave cylinder piston to travel out towards the clutch much further than a less worn plate, so a badly worn clutch maybe the cause of a slave cylinder problem given the seal is working towards the extremes of its capability. A tired seal under such duress could show the kind of intermittent problems with pressure loss you experienced. So it might not just be the hose, so be prepared. In defence of the 9000, a clutch should last at least 100,000 miles, and can sometimes last twice that. What's more usual is the 9000 at the age the surviving ones are at now, pretty much all will have seen a new clutch and slave cylinder once in their life.
One last thing. On the 9000 sloppy pedal issue. Unlike the classic 900 where the pedal transfer bar wears where the clevis pin goes through that attaches the m/cylinder pushrod, which also wears, it's usually only the clevis pin and the m/cylinder pushrod that wears on the 9000 and not the pedal itself.
Hope this helps. 9000's are great cars. Especially the manual 2.3 Aero.
There's a very strong possibility if you have blown the hydraulic hose that such was the problem all along. The only thing that makes me think otherwise is if the hose was the cause of your pressure loss you usually see the loss of fluid from such as it comes out under force in a jet where it is hard not to see. That said, sometimes the hose weeps and is not so much noticeable as all that seemingly happens is the fabric outer gets wet, which isn't so obvious. If this has been the case with your car, the continued use to get you where you were going has finally burst the weeping hose. If this is the case it is your lucky day as it's the most straightforward repair, and the least expensive. Whatever happens next you should replace the hose and bleed the clutch and see if your problem is solved. If you don't, you could never know the hose was the only problem as you are replacing it regardless, but doing so at the same time as the slave cylinder, and master if need be, won't necessarily show if they were the cause or not. Leaking slaves and worn m/cylinder seals are not always obvious to inspection after the fact. Hose though are. Replace the hose first, you could save yourself some labour time and money. But you'll never know if you don't.
Now on the other hand. If the slave cylinder through your constant use if it were in a distressed state, might have come out too far and stuck. If so you might momentarily have experienced a hard pedal. Trying to overcome the hard pedal might be what caused the hose to burst under higher pressure. A well worn friction plate needs the slave cylinder piston to travel out towards the clutch much further than a less worn plate, so a badly worn clutch maybe the cause of a slave cylinder problem given the seal is working towards the extremes of its capability. A tired seal under such duress could show the kind of intermittent problems with pressure loss you experienced. So it might not just be the hose, so be prepared. In defence of the 9000, a clutch should last at least 100,000 miles, and can sometimes last twice that. What's more usual is the 9000 at the age the surviving ones are at now, pretty much all will have seen a new clutch and slave cylinder once in their life.
One last thing. On the 9000 sloppy pedal issue. Unlike the classic 900 where the pedal transfer bar wears where the clevis pin goes through that attaches the m/cylinder pushrod, which also wears, it's usually only the clevis pin and the m/cylinder pushrod that wears on the 9000 and not the pedal itself.
Hope this helps. 9000's are great cars. Especially the manual 2.3 Aero.
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