Motorways - increasingly hostile

[Aiminghigh123]

Ok checked with a mate of mine who’s plod.

In the event of pulling out in front of someone even if they are speeding them crashing and dying, yes you would be prosecuted definitely for careless driving, possible death by careless depending how the judge is feeling you would have mitigating circumstances.

So those who want to crack on and pull out because “I’m doing the speed limit” do so at your peril.

[heebeegeetee]

BlackWidow13 said:

heebeegeetee said:

I'm talking about those who refuse to acknowledge that not everybody wants to break the law, and that you guys seem to think that these people are inferior, and less important.

This must be about the fourth time you’ve made something up to support your so-called position.

heebeegeetee said:

I'm talking about people who can't make progress without braking far too much, about people, who are incapable of reading the road, who can't cooperate with other traffic, and so on.

Which includes people who decide to pull into L3 when there is an inadequate gap, and who then elephant race a car in L2 not caring about the effect that has on L3 traffic.

Except in your mind, where it doesn’t.

Despite you claiming over and over than you have a monopoly on “the point”, you have a shockingly poor grasp of it.

A driver in L2 who pulls into L3, and thereby causes the L3 traffic to slow, and who then maintains their L2 speed to make a pass while accumulating a queue behind them is inconsiderate. It makes not one jot of difference how fast the L3 traffic is going. You seem to think that if the L3 traffic is doing 71 then the L2 driver gets a free pass, because the L3 traffic is driving illegally. Which is plain stupid.

When you join a motorway you get up to the speed of the L1 traffic, yes? So if you change lanes on a motorway to make a pass, then make the pass and pull back in. If the traffic to your right is moving faster than you are comfortable going, wait until there’s a gap. Don’t just barge out then sit there muttering in your adenoidal voice “it’s a limit not a target”.

Consideration and co-operation and two way streets.

Nope, you continually and wilfully misunderstand, your summary is is 100% wrong, you don't know me from Adam but you think you do from a few paragraphs on the internet.

You clearly want an argument but you're going to have find someone else to have it with, I'm afraid.

[Deranged Rover]

heebeegeetee said:

you don't know me from Adam....

Don't bloody well drag me into it! What have I done?!

[heebeegeetee]

Aiminghigh123 said:

Ok checked with a mate of mine who’s plod.

In the event of pulling out in front of someone even if they are speeding them crashing and dying, yes you would be prosecuted definitely for careless driving, possible death by careless depending how the judge is feeling you would have mitigating circumstances.

So those who want to crack on and pull out because “I’m doing the speed limit” do so at your peril.

Has anyone on here advocated that?

[anonymous-user]

heebeegeetee said:

BlackWidow13 said:

heebeegeetee said:

I'm talking about those who refuse to acknowledge that not everybody wants to break the law, and that you guys seem to think that these people are inferior, and less important.

This must be about the fourth time you’ve made something up to support your so-called position.

heebeegeetee said:

I'm talking about people who can't make progress without braking far too much, about people, who are incapable of reading the road, who can't cooperate with other traffic, and so on.

Which includes people who decide to pull into L3 when there is an inadequate gap, and who then elephant race a car in L2 not caring about the effect that has on L3 traffic.

Except in your mind, where it doesn’t.

Despite you claiming over and over than you have a monopoly on “the point”, you have a shockingly poor grasp of it.

A driver in L2 who pulls into L3, and thereby causes the L3 traffic to slow, and who then maintains their L2 speed to make a pass while accumulating a queue behind them is inconsiderate. It makes not one jot of difference how fast the L3 traffic is going. You seem to think that if the L3 traffic is doing 71 then the L2 driver gets a free pass, because the L3 traffic is driving illegally. Which is plain stupid.

When you join a motorway you get up to the speed of the L1 traffic, yes? So if you change lanes on a motorway to make a pass, then make the pass and pull back in. If the traffic to your right is moving faster than you are comfortable going, wait until there’s a gap. Don’t just barge out then sit there muttering in your adenoidal voice “it’s a limit not a target”.

Consideration and co-operation and two way streets.

Nope, you continually and wilfully misunderstand, your summary is is 100% wrong, you don't know me from Adam but you think you do from a few paragraphs on the internet.

You clearly want an argument but you're going to have find someone else to have it with, I'm afraid.

If you would like to participate with the grown ups, use your words instead of smiley faces.

Ps: if I had been “100% wrong”, then according to you:
- elephant racers in L3 read the road and co-operate with other traffic
- elephant racers in L3 are considerate drivers
- it doesn’t matter whether the traffic behind the elephant racer is driving above or below the limit; it’s always in the wrong
- you don’t get up to L1 speed when you join a motorway
- consideration and co-operation are one way things.
Which all seems, well, in terms you’ll understand, a bit

[Bennet]

I'm surprised that anyone who aspires to a high standard of driving would advocate deliberately pulling out into the path of another driver in such a way as to cause them to brake, even if they are speeding.

[Sofa]

Milkyway said:

Deep joy, when somebody goes speeding by or has been driving like an idiot... seeing them a few miles later having a nice chat with the boys in blue.

You must live a bloody miserable existence then... genuinely can't remember the last time I saw a police car actually pull someone over.

To all the posters saying how they shouldn't have to anticipate someone approaching at 90+ mph, does that attitude still apply if it is PC Plod in his Beemer approaching at that speed? After all, you'll have looked briefly in your mirror, seen that there's no one immediately behind you in L3 and pulled out. No need to observe further in order to ascertain that there's a police car with blues and twos on approaching at some speed in the distance after all.

Edited by Sofa on Tuesday 31st May 16:22

[FiF]

One thing this thread proves, too many still don't read what others have actually written, but then to go on to argue over what they wish the other had stated. No change there then.

[Pan Pan Pan]

Milkyway said:

Killboy said:

PHers at 70mph.

What’s that old joke:
“I’ve never had an accident... but seen loads in my mirror.”

The same applies to dawdlers who dont use their mirrors, and who believe that someone traveling at the posted limit, is breaking the law, because they are going faster than the pipe and slippers speed that `they' want to crawl along at. the typ[e that say they have never had an accident,but who have caused quite a few.

[heebeegeetee]

BlackWidow13 said:

If you would like to participate with the grown ups, use your words instead of smiley faces.


Which all seems, well, in terms you’ll understand, a bit

Hmm. Tells me off for smileys then uses a smiley.

It's up to you. I'm telling you you're wasting your time but if you want to carry on wasting it, crack right on.

And carry on complaining about something you possibly don't understand, nor can you affect.

[Greenbot35]

craigjm said:

If anyone flashes me in lane three I just slow down

Someone did that to me when I was going to hospital to see my dad who was having an heart attack. I try to look at things from another perspective, ok they might be a dick or genuinely in a hurry better to have them in front.

[Milkyway]

Greenbot35 said:

craigjm said:

If anyone flashes me in lane three I just slow down

Someone did that to me when I was going to hospital to see my dad who was having an heart attack. I try to look at things from another perspective, ok they might be a dick or genuinely in a hurry better to have them in front.

My Dad’s subtle trick for tailgaters was to flick his lights on & off quickly...a flash of red usually got the message across.

[Funk]

FiF said:

Funk said:

For a car/driving enthusiast forum, the attitude of a number of posters is mind-boggling.

For someone doing 70 in L3 there should be no EXPECTATION that someone else will be doing 95 coming up behind them. If you're breaking the limit you need to modify your driving to allow for other road users who are driving perfectly legally.

The 'fk you, outta my way - can't you see I'm busy speeding here?' attitude many appear to endorse is poor.

To the poster who asked about my response to emergency vehicles - iirc you will find that the onus lies on the emergency vehicle driver to anticipate that other drivers may not expect them to be arriving so quickly and it is the responsibility of the emergency vehicle to drive with caution. Which is exactly what I'm saying anyone speeding should do.

People don't notice emergency vehicles with lights and sirens approaching half the time - they're even less likely to notice you arriving behind at 90 etc.

I'm not arguing against speeding, I'm saying that if you do it then be responsible for expecting the unexpected from other drivers who are driving within the law.

On this matter of emergency vehicle drivers at high speed, locally there's been a court case where a police officer responding to a call for immediate assistance collided with another vehicle which pulled out. The police officer was charged in connection with the offence, despite having blues and sirens going, found not guilty of death by dangerous driving but guilty of causing death by careless or inconsiderate driving.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-hereford-wor...

My point exactly. The onus was on the police driver to drive safely outside of the law.

Aiminghigh123 said:

Ok checked with a mate of mine who’s plod.

In the event of pulling out in front of someone even if they are speeding them crashing and dying, yes you would be prosecuted definitely for careless driving, possible death by careless depending how the judge is feeling you would have mitigating circumstances.

So those who want to crack on and pull out because “I’m doing the speed limit” do so at your peril.

I'd try asking a lawyer, not a copper. The answer might well be very different.

5s Alive said:

Funk said:

I'm not arguing against speeding, I'm saying that if you do it then be responsible for expecting the unexpected from other drivers who are driving within the law.

I'm not sure whether you're wasting your breath trying to get this across or if those with opposing views actually agree but are unwilling to say so.

It's a simple concept to grasp.

Baffling.

Agreed. I've said it several ways as best I can now, I guess they'll never get it so perhaps I am wasting my time. Some are even mis-quoting or creating deliberately obtuse 'whataboutisms'.

I'll bow out here I think.

Edited by Funk on Tuesday 31st May 20:09

[Inky81]

Greenbot35 said:

Someone did that to me when I was going to hospital to see my dad who was having an heart attack. I try to look at things from another perspective, ok they might be a dick or genuinely in a hurry better to have them in front.

Must confess I've done exactly the same in very similar circumstances, a 300 mile dash from the ferry in Fishguard to see a dying relative. Made it with barely 30 mins to spare, worth every single hand gesticulation I received. Edit to add, this was c.20 years ago.

[jm8403]

Aiminghigh123 said:

Ok checked with a mate of mine who’s plod.

In the event of pulling out in front of someone even if they are speeding them crashing and dying, yes you would be prosecuted definitely for careless driving, possible death by careless depending how the judge is feeling you would have mitigating circumstances.

So those who want to crack on and pull out because “I’m doing the speed limit” do so at your peril.

Nah, surely 'funk' on PH is right

[heebeegeetee]

FiF said:

One thing this thread proves, too many still don't read what others have actually written, but then to go on to argue over what they wish the other had stated. No change there then.

Agreed.

[Funk]

jm8403 said:

Aiminghigh123 said:

Ok checked with a mate of mine who’s plod.

In the event of pulling out in front of someone even if they are speeding them crashing and dying, yes you would be prosecuted definitely for careless driving, possible death by careless depending how the judge is feeling you would have mitigating circumstances.

So those who want to crack on and pull out because “I’m doing the speed limit” do so at your peril.

Nah, surely 'funk' on PH is right

There is literally a link to a real-world court case a few posts up where a copper was prosecuted for causing death by careless driving when he killed someone who pulled out when he was approaching them at 103mph.

[jm8403]

Funk said:

I'll bow out here I think.

Edited by Funk on Tuesday 31st May 20:09

That lasted long.

[captain.scarlet]

Milkyway said:

Greenbot35 said:

craigjm said:

If anyone flashes me in lane three I just slow down

Someone did that to me when I was going to hospital to see my dad who was having an heart attack. I try to look at things from another perspective, ok they might be a dick or genuinely in a hurry better to have them in front.

My Dad’s subtle trick for tailgaters was to flick his lights on & off quickly...a flash of red usually got the message across.

When I was a relatively new driver, I once made a stupid move that got me awarded the glaring full beam headlights 'look' from the car behind.

Being chuffed to have learned a new driving expression, not long after I used it on someone else who sped up and overtook me like a rally driver as soon as a 30mph limit out of a rural suburb turned to national speed limit.

He had the final word though and had a response to that already lined up, effectively sticking two fingers up at me by switching on his rear fog lights for several seconds as he sped away!

When it comes to a flick of a rear red or a full on brake test, there's always a danger that the car behind could cut you up and conduct an even bigger brake test, again to have the final say...or if he's got nothing to lose compared to you, bring the traffic to a halt and become violent with fatal consequences.

You never know who you may be dealing with, and where driving becomes an extension of our personal space and therefore for some easily violated, they sometimes just aren't worth the aggro.

On the other hand it is easy to see why others are irate about deliberately poor driving manners. Give someone an inch and they'll take a mile, think it's okay and influence others to do the same because they feel they can get away with it or others may be scared to.do something about it, leading to a deterioration in driving safety and standards.

[Wills2]

FiF said:

One thing this thread proves, too many still don't read what others have actually written, but then to go on to argue over what they wish the other had stated. No change there then.

I think the thread shows that there are quite a few road captains on PH that cannot see or aren't willing to admit that they are pretty poor drivers.

I always look out for two types of drivers, road captains and reckless speeders (two sides of the same entitled coin) and make sure I adjust my driving to avoid both types.